[Ibogaine] comments from star

Randy Faulconer bicuitboy714 at gmail.com
Sat Sep 7 05:53:27 CDT 2013


hi jeff, thanx for the laugh. don't forget about p k dick. i reccomend
a scanner darkly. during my hiatus from the internet i read some  very
 good books which in point of fact is a detox method in of itself.
i can see personality issues having something to do with how a person
deals with withdrawal but i agree with u in that when the shit hits
the fan (literally) most of that goes down the drain with whatever
else  is ejected from ur body the last time u where in the bathroom.

  peace love and immodium
        randy

On 8/24/13, Jeff G <jeffgallop at gmail.com> wrote:
> Donny....
> You said
> "the SAOs help pshycally, not necessarily mentally or depression, they are
> not anti depressants nor endorphin enhances, “
>
> I am fairly certain I have read multiple times in well respected medical
> journals that opiates are in fact very good anti depressants and do in fact
> help in endorphin production, (to a fault when over used).
>
> You also went on to state
>
> "Coming off opiates sub included is subjective from each individual..101
> factors play into this that include personality levels, intelligence,
> confidence, self esteem issues, will power, motivation, lifestyle, issues
> beside withdrawals and opiates etc"
>
> I think your over simplifying things here .
>
> I know some pretty fucking smart people, many right here on this list who
> had the smarts, confidence, motivation, and more will power than the
> average bear, not to mention self confidence, to detox off all sorts of
> long acting opiates but even with all these wonderfully positive
> personality traits when the real, good, messy fun starts  a week or so into
> the kick, there is no denying the pain and suffering, (and shitting,
> puking, shivering) that is happening and getting worse by the minute
>
> I think you are over simplifying the situation.
> Maybe your stash of sao's are doing the talking here more than you realize.
>
> Please do not get me wrong, I could not be happier for you that your sub
> detox is going so well. I mean it, I am genuinely happy to hear at least
> one tale of seeming success here lately, besides my own on going
> journey...(pardon my lil self promotion folks)
>
> But as others suffer, a little empathy may be called for brother....
>
> I'm curious as to your real age and exactly what short acting Opiates  your
> taking now and how much....(in between screwing your  girlfriend and
> working your important job).
>
> I don't mean to sound snarky, tho I know I do. And it's ALL to clear lately
> that this list is here for anyone to use to help others or even just
> themselves get through whatever and how ever they need to, so keep on
> keeping on Donny Drake, my curiosity just kind of got the best of me, so I
> wanted to ask you a few questions.... you know for clarity.
>
> Got Milk?...
>
> Got Morphine?...
>
> Got Empathy?
> JeffG
>
>
>
> DD wrote
> Coming off opiates sub included is subjective from each individual..101
> factors play into this that include personality levels, intelligence,
> confidence, self esteem issues, will power, motivation, lifestyle, issues
> beside withdrawals and opiates etc. If we be realistic there have been tons
> of people who have quit suboxone or subutex and lived to tell the tale,
> without Ibogaine.Some people can get through it, perhaps they are healthy,
> in good shape, have a good enough life with nothing much to worry about,
> exercise work outs, determination etc all this comes into play here...I
> dont think there been many suicides coming off sub, but again it depends on
> each individuals..Some people are better determined then others, there is a
> saying in the UK that some people are more pussy then others (slang term is
> all) though personally I would not put it like that. Some people who never
> been prone to depression do  not get much depression coming off opiates,
> some people ma be down because of current life circumstances and when
> detoxing this can magnify low mood feelings...Personality traits such as
> naivety, ignorance. inpatient personality etc all come into it as well..The
> Iboga will not necessary change your personality in that sense, only you
> can d that.  Some people use the Iboga to get past withdrawals while others
> want it for personal insights...Some like me want it to get past some PAWS
> or to speed them out quick so I can carry on working in the right mind as I
> have a important job....If Ibogaine was not available to me I still believe
> I can make it to the other side, it's not beyond the realms of possibility
> for me..I have done it before..Age is on my side as well as many other
> factors.....I still do not know if I am going to face same PAWS before
> Ibogaine, who knows I may feel I do not need Iboga if I can make it 3
> months and feel half human, that is tapering off the SAOs of course.. Even
> after Ibogaine there is no guarantee you will not have PAWS, like my
> provider said PAWS is about healing and you brain getting use to reality.
> Nothing is guaranteed in anything in life let alone post Ibogaine.
>
> I have been off sub for 6 weeks now, it hasn't been easy but am keeping a
> strong head, yep am on SAOS but low dose, the SAOs help pshycally, not
> necessarily mentally or depression, they are not anti depressants nor
> endorphin enhances, remember that, so you still may face the depression
> that you had coming off subs even with SAOs...I manage to occupy my time
> and stay busy, work out, have sex with the girl (gf), have a positive
> mindset..I honestly can control any depression feelings. I been through
> this before so I know what to expect..
>
> You have to remember it's not same for everyone..One may be more depressed
> then the other coming off any substances...Personality, self esteem,
> motivation and other factors play a part here. I believe suboxone is harder
> to come off according to experiences that I have read of others
>
> I certainly do not believe when some claim after long term meth or sub
> there is no way out, that is their own assumption, opinon and
> experience...Many 20 year plus meth users have done done, same with long
> term sub users, so to say there is hardly a way out is counter productive,
> and it doesnt do much to encourage those coming off opiates who may not
> have the money or resources to do Ibogaine...It might be hard for some
> users that they can never live dope free but that isnt the case for
> everybody else...Younger you are the less harder it is, more intelligent
> you are the more doable it is and more determined you are the more chance
> of making it to the other side..
>
> ________________________________
> From: Valarie <val.needis at gmail.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Thursday, 22 August 2013, 20:47
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] comments from star
>
> So me and my bf had a plan to save up 3 months of SAOs in order for me to
> do my ibogaine treatment. He was recently in a car accident and hurt his
> back but pain killers make him seriously ill. So when we went to the
> doctors yesterday they gave him a script for 10 days worth of Norco. I had
> to tell him You can't just hold on to this script you have to get it
> filled.  So he went and got it filled and what do you think was the first
> thing I said? Please don't make me take the sub, I have only been on it for
> four days I still have a chance! I stressed him out so much that he gave me
> 3 pills. God help me. Sometimes he just breaks down and starts crying
> because he doesn't know what to do. He just lost his mom(who was his best
> friend), I just lost my Grandpa (who was the ONLY person that NEVER made me
> feel bad about myself). Being at what I think is 2mgs of sub (had to break
> the pill) has put me in a pretty deep depression. I have heard especially
> with Subutex because it is just a partial antagonist not a full antagonist
> like Suboxone , that the cravings and depression are really bad. So I took
> 3 Norco and feel nothing, probably because the sub is still in my system.
> My bf says everyday I will have a reason to take the Norco (there for never
> be able to save up)  and he is right!  I can't keep bouncing from Norco to
> Sub I need 3 months free off sub. I am not suicidal,  but I wonder what the
> suicide rate is for people trying to get off Sub? They say ignorance is
> bliss, maybe if I never found out that Sub binds the receptors in the brain
> with a sticky goop,  I wouldn't be so he'll bent against it, maybe if I was
> someone that did not give a shit about humanity in the first place I would
> not be so he'll bent against it. A girl I know is on 32mgs of sub and the
> only problem she seems to have with it is that where she lives she has to
> go to a meeting once a week (probably more brain washing about staying on
> the sub) but she is not a very compassionate person in the first place.
> Although I belive most addicts are the most compassionate people there are
> and we don't know how to deal with our feelings and turn to drugs.
> Unfortunately or fortunately (I guess it's how u look at it) Drugs have not
> taken away the compassion I feel towards another living creature. I started
> to feel it slipping away on the sub that's when I took a step back and
> really looked at what I was becoming. Before I knew how bad subutex was I
> saw someone in a lot of pain on the street, he had used the last of his
> heroin and was to sick to even pan handle for money, so I gave him my last
> Subutex. My bf was so mad at me now I was going to get sick but deep down I
> knew my bf would not let that happen and we went to the doctors and got
> another script. I just can't believe how easy it was back in the day to get
> all these pain pills, and now WTF! It almost seems like they gave out all
> these pills knowing they were starting an epidemic that they could "cure"
> with Sub. I was always told growing up just stay away from Heroin and I
> did! I was an idiot at 22 year's old and had no concept that vicodin and
> all the other shit was just the same. I also find it interesting that when
> Ibogaine started to be tested and at that time they thought there was a 90%
> success rate that they come out with a drug that binds your receptors there
> for the ibogaine will not work. My provider suggested that I switch to
> Methadone because unlike Subutex you only need a few weeks of SAOs, But
> when I tried to switch I had a drug interaction with the xanex. But now I
> am off the xanex and on colonzapam,  so maybe I will think about it again.
> When I went to the Methadone clinic they did an orientation and they told
> me they average one death per month at that particular clinic. That scared
> the shit out of me. People are not over dosing on sub all the time, I think
> they just end up taking there life. So, so sad. I know I personally have a
> lot to offer this world and I am not going to give up!  Star, I know we are
> in the same boat and I think about you all the time. Lets hang in there
> togeather babe. Lotsof Love, Val
> On Aug 22, 2013 9:56 AM, "Sister" <sistereboga at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> Val... I so understand your anger about the MD scripting this poison.
> But... don't let that get in your way of your wean.   Don't linger too long
> on 2 mgs, the longer on it the harder it is to walk away from it.   So..
> pls continue your wean and not sit on 2mg too long.  Once stable you should
> be planning your next drop.  Hang in there.
>>
>>> From: Valarie <val.needis at gmail.com>
>>> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 2:24 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] comments from star
>>>
>>> I think most of us know more then our doctors do. What do you think will
> happen if I stand outside one of these pharmacies with a big sign that says
> " don't let Sub be your conscience" . My bf did a good deed earlier this
> week when he was getting his marijuana card renewed he overheard another
> doctor prescribing Sub to somebody, so he waited outside and when the guy
> walked out my bf said he overheard his conversation with the doctor, and
> did the doctor have a taper plan for him? Of course their was no taper plan
> in place. So my bf just warned him what I was going through and that he
> might want to do some more research before he gets that filled, I wish my
> bf would have got the guys number. I don't want anyone sticking a needle in
> their arm but if someone truly wants to get sober and has not been hooked
> on Sub. They can use a very low dose and a 3 day taper, I have seen this
> done with my own eyes but I would recommend having someone hold onto the
> sub, So that person does not take more then needed. If only I knew then
> what I know now. So I got my 2Mg subs tomorrow and I will be able to devide
> it more precisely then with the 8mg. Maybe that is why my doc wanted me to
> stay at 8mg, and the pharmacy had to order the 2mg. That just shows they
> want everyone at a large dose. I want to get into the solution. Good news I
> am not epileptic, the seizure was caused by not having a schedule with my
> xanex, so now I am taking 1mg of colonzapam every 8 hrs with break through
> xanex as needed (which I really don't take) I am down to 2mgs and the day
> after tomorrow I am going to 1.5 mgs then 1mg, then.5, then. 25 then
> hopefully nothing. I have Clonidine to help with the kick. If anyone knows
> of a place that sells poppy pods and does not cost an arm and a leg, please
> let me know.  Remember we may not be able to save the world but we can
> definitely change the world! Help a stranger, give to someone less
> fortunate.  And don't give up the fight!  Remember it is against human
> nature to be enslaved! And if we don't start warning others, Sub is going
> to be the most prescribed drug in the United States! And nobody will give a
> fuck about the world, which is exactly what "they" want. Sub takes away
> your spirit. I am a extremely emotional person and I could actually fill my
> soul start to hurt as I walked by people and didn't give a fuck. I am glad
> I realized it because that disgust I recognized in myself is what keeps me
> fighting. I will not give in! And my provider did not dump me, he just did
> not call me for a few days and when he did he apologized, he called me from
> a family members house and told me not to go 3 days without calling him. He
> is an amazing human being! I am sure most of you have heard of him. He has
> helped a lot of people who are now providers themselves. The first day I
> heard about Ibogaine I was lucky enough to have talked to Norma Lotsof,
> who did not recommended any providers but gave me a book of questions to
> ask. That's why I say Lotsof Love to you all we should never forget the
> people who tried to fight our government for the good. So Lotsof Love, Val
>>> On Aug 21, 2013 9:51 PM, "Randy Faulconer" <bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> well i had one written and lost it.
>>>>
>>>> val i like ur atttitude. ya oughta read some of the stuff patrick
>>>> wrote in heroin times about us being the last niggers on earth. i very
>>>> seldom find myself using that word bit it so apllies here. there are
>>>> some orgs around but they little to no power. organinzation is called
>>>> for here. subjugation is what give us, or try to. i myself find glee
>>>> inout thinking those in the system that i come in contact with. i win
>>>> the little battles most of the time but i would much rather be on a
>>>> team and win the war
>>>>      peace love and pre emptive strikes
>>>>      randy
>>>>
>>>> On 8/20/13, Valarie <val.needis at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > Seriously,  when are we all going to stand up to the FDA and say Fuck
> You!
>>>> > All a doctor needs is one 8Hr class and that gives him the right to
>>>> > prescribe subutex/  suboxone!  Not telling us how hard it is to get
> off!
>>>> > Then they make it illegal to be prescribed by your doc that put u on
> the
>>>> > sub,  for that same doctor to prescribe a SAO because tjey label you
>>>> > a
>>>> > "pill addict" there for No more pills for you! Even when the Doctor.
> know
>>>> > it's the right thing to do! Subutex/  Suboxone is the 31st most
> prescribed
>>>> > drug!!! How many of us like being on it? When are we going to take a
> stand?
>>>> > We are people too! This may sound like a crazy post but I don't care
> I'm
>>>> > pissed! When is it our turn? The blacks said were not going to take
> this
>>>> > shit anymore! The gays have came out and said their peace too. So
> when is
>>>> > it our turn? We are not guinea pigs! They need to stop treating this
> like
>>>> > we are! Sorry but I'm mad! Love us all, Val
>>>> > On Aug 17, 2013 10:25 PM, "Valarie" <val.needis at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Yea Donnie, if I would have had short acting opiot I know I would
> have
>>>> >> gotten through to 3 months off subutex. I just want people to know I
> have
>>>> >> a
>>>> >> problem with benzodiazepines too, and the Kratom DID stop my
> withdrawal
>>>> >> for
>>>> >> over a month along with a few SAOs, the problem was I could not
> sleep,
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> was having a panic attack right before my seizure which scared the
> shit
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> of me,  my hands must have been near my chest because it is all
> scratched
>>>> >> up. I might have been able to do it with the Kratom so I don't want
>>>> >> people
>>>> >> to be discouraged, it worked for me for a month with NO withdrawal.
> Just
>>>> >> don't drink the powder, boil it in tea bags instead this is for
> people
>>>> >> like
>>>> >> me who can not get SAOs.  But because of my problem with xanex it
> did not
>>>> >> work. I know if you have enough SAOs u should defiantly do it that
> way if
>>>> >> you are preparing for an ibogaine treatment,  I am going to get
> myself
>>>> >> tested to see if I am epileptic it sucks that in the meantime I have
> to
>>>> >> be
>>>> >> on sub. Without SAOs at least for me I could not go longer then a
> month.
>>>> >> My
>>>> >> boyfriend talked to my ibogaine provider they were supposed to call
> back
>>>> >> but didn't.  Oh well, atleast I have you guys that give me advice
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> help
>>>> >> me. Thank you all... Val
>>>> >> On Aug 17, 2013 1:41 PM, "Donny Drake" <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>
> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> It's sad that kratom did not work to help subutex withdrawals,
> believe
>>>> >>> me
>>>> >>> you and I are not the only ones who used kratom and found to it to
> be
>>>> >>> quite
>>>> >>> weak during the acute stage of subutex or suboxone withdrawals...
> The
>>>> >>> thing
>>>> >>> is that sub acute stage is tooooo looong drawn out for anything
>>>> >>> like
>>>> >>> kratom
>>>> >>> or benzos to work. They might help after 3-4 months and later on in
> PAWS
>>>> >>> but during the acute phase it is a totally different matter.
>  Another
>>>> >>> issue
>>>> >>> is that if youy jump from a high dose of subutex or any dose above
> 0.25
>>>> >>> or
>>>> >>> 0.5 then it only extends the acute stage, and tends to also block
> out
>>>> >>> anything so called comfort med working.,..This is why I weaned down
> so
>>>> >>> low
>>>> >>> to subutex because I wanted SAOs to work, and indeed they are...Yes
> am a
>>>> >>> lucky bastard in that I managed to get all these SAOs for free and
> how
>>>> >>> am
>>>> >>> so stable now..Not in withdrawal at all. Infact am high from just a
> low
>>>> >>> dose of SAOs, I ve never been this happy because I know hard and
>>>> >>> depressin
>>>> >>> it is to get off subutex especially without anything..But the job
> has
>>>> >>> not
>>>> >>> be done yet..I need to taper off SAOs and then do Ibogaine..
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> .I have made a deal with my provider to give me half price, she
>>>> >>> will
>>>> >>> have
>>>> >>> blood pressure monitor, heart, 3 sitters and other facilities. Who
> kows
>>>> >>> I
>>>> >>> may only need boosters instead of a 1 big flood?...I still need to
> do
>>>> >>> further tests because anybodys who been on sub, lratom needs
>>>> >>> further
>>>> >>> tests,
>>>> >>> MUST get further tests, it's not just about death but some damage
> too,
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> sub effects liver, so does kratom, so more tests are needed.. But I
> am
>>>> >>> so
>>>> >>> confident about this...Didnt think I would get of the sub cycle..I
> do
>>>> >>> agree
>>>> >>> someone MUST have SAOs to get get off sub and prepare ofr Ibogaine,
> maybe
>>>> >>> 3
>>>> >>> moths MINIMUM, but if you stopped at high dose then maybe longer
>>>> >>> according
>>>> >>> to my provider...You see we have to puyt effort in getting this
> far, you
>>>> >>> have to be smart enough to meet the right people, right providers,
>>>> >>> research
>>>> >>> beforehand about SAOs and everything else...I just happen to have
>>>> >>> people's
>>>> >>> skills and naturally get on well with people, so this is another
> factor
>>>> >>> in
>>>> >>> why am stable right now.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Again am sorry kratom and other meds did nit work for you..You have
> to
>>>> >>> taper the sub, then go on SAOs for long as possible, but please get
>>>> >>> tested,
>>>> >>> its harder for females, very bard, that is why my provider said
> thank
>>>> >>> God
>>>> >>> am a guy because she is so vary of women doing Ibogaine...Anytway I
> did
>>>> >>> say
>>>> >>> kratom will not work in acute stage as eventually the half
>>>> >>> life/withdrawals
>>>> >>> of sub breaks through and blocks it...I so can't believe am so
> stable on
>>>> >>> SAO on such low doses...This means I can save these SAOs for 2
> years,
>>>> >>> perhaps even give them to someone who is on sub... At least now I
> do not
>>>> >>> have to worry about 3-5 months of extreme mental withdrawals from
> sub,
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> that bad depression, insomnia etc...
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Good luck people in anyway.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>   ------------------------------
>>>> >>>  *From:* Valarie <val.needis at gmail.com>
>>>> >>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>> >>> *Sent:* Saturday, 17 August 2013, 5:14
>>>> >>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] comments from star
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Jim, Randy,Star,Fall and others . You have all helped me so much
> that is
>>>> >>> why it aches my heart to have to tell you I took 2mg of sub to
> stabilize
>>>> >>> myself. Jim is right I tottay mixed to many drugs togeather and I
> may be
>>>> >>> epileptic. For now I have 2 2mg pills of clonazepam. I don't know
> how
>>>> >>> long
>>>> >>> they last, so if someone who does please let me know. I took half
> of one
>>>> >>> at
>>>> >>> noon when I took 1mg of sub then another 1mg about an hour later. I
> have
>>>> >>> stopped the Kratom. But I have been on xanex for 12 years and
>>>> >>> cannot
>>>> >>> just
>>>> >>> stop. I feel like I stabilized myself,  My doctor is out of the
> country
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> they won't call me in more clonazepam (I had a few from an old
> script,
>>>> >>> from
>>>> >>> when I tried to switch from xanex to that) I feel like I need to
>>>> >>> get
>>>> >>> these
>>>> >>> benzodiazepines in order before anything else, because I take quote
> a
>>>> >>> bit
>>>> >>> of xanex. I want to be totally clean not taking xanex still. I feel
> like
>>>> >>> I
>>>> >>> was rushing everything, rushing my bf for the money and I had a
> really
>>>> >>> scary awake dream (You know when u can't sleep anfd close your
>>>> >>> eyes)
>>>> >>> which
>>>> >>> threw me in the panic attack which I then woke up my bf and told
> him to
>>>> >>> hold me then had a seizure. If I would not have woke him up he is a
> very
>>>> >>> deep sleeper. My dream was that this dark shadow was cutting down
> all
>>>> >>> these
>>>> >>> trees in a forest, the shadow was very scary! I have heard about
>>>> >>> people's
>>>> >>> ibogaine treatment and I remember one of them saying about seeing
> trees
>>>> >>> being chopped down so maybe that's why I dreamt it. But I have
> realized
>>>> >>> that I was trying to do everything to quickly and I was putting
> myself
>>>> >>> in
>>>> >>> way more danger its like somebody shook me and said wake up valarie
> this
>>>> >>> is
>>>> >>> not the way. You can not combine all these different things to keep
>>>> >>> yourself from detoxing, that is what is going to kill me. I was
>>>> >>> just
>>>> >>> watching a documentary on CNN about marijuana and they said every
>>>> >>> 14
>>>> >>> minutes someone dies because an accidental drug overdose combining
> drugs
>>>> >>> like I was doing. I am not trying to rationalize the sub I am just
>>>> >>> trying
>>>> >>> to be honest. So I am going to take Jim's advice and see if I am
>>>> >>> epileptic,
>>>> >>> then do a sub taper if I decide to stay on the subutex.  Just to
> let you
>>>> >>> all know I put myself in an intense 6 day a week outpatient drug
> rehab 2
>>>> >>> months ago (they are letting me make payments that is how I can
> afford
>>>> >>> it)
>>>> >>> unfortunately nobody makes payment plans to detox you, but I have
> to get
>>>> >>> off this xanex! I am taking this very seriously.  However I am not
> going
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> go to a place to detox where I basically have to sign my life
> away.Which
>>>> >>> is
>>>> >>> the only thing I can afford and the times I went there they would
> always
>>>> >>> stop whatever they had me on for seizures and every time I went to
> this
>>>> >>> place (5+ years ago) When they took me off the seizure med I would
> have
>>>> >>> a
>>>> >>> seizure.  I never had seizures before I started taking xanex but I
> have
>>>> >>> also had a seizure when I took 2 ultra pills. So first things first
> I
>>>> >>> have
>>>> >>> to get the seizure situation under control.  It sucks that I will
>>>> >>> probably
>>>> >>> continue the sub after a month off but I could have killed myself
> mixing
>>>> >>> all this stuff to keep me from withdrawal.  I was able to get Norco
> in
>>>> >>> short periods I'm sure that's why I was able to stay off the sub
> for a
>>>> >>> month but my tolerance is to high and a few Norco was not enough.
> Kratom
>>>> >>> did work to keep me from withdrawal But it's also a stimulant,
> which is
>>>> >>> why
>>>> >>> I took all that other stuff to sleep. I can't just say fuck it! But
> I
>>>> >>> can't
>>>> >>> just mix all these drugs whether there kratom, Nyquil, xanex,
> Clonidine
>>>> >>> and my last vicodin. I do not want to die. I'm not 100% bit I have
>>>> >>> stabilized myself, and do not have to worry about a seizure if I
> keep
>>>> >>> the
>>>> >>> right amount of clonazepam in my system. Geeez didn't realise how
> long
>>>> >>> this
>>>> >>> message was, but I need all the support I can get
>>>> >>> On Aug 16, 2013 8:14 PM, "Valarie" <val.needis at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Thanks for your advice Jim but I have to say I am very disappointed
> in
>>>> >>> myself, I was so afraid that I would have another seizure I don't
> know
>>>> >>> if
>>>> >>> the Kratom has anything to do with it but I took 2mg of subutex
> today.
>>>> >>> The
>>>> >>> pods are really expensive and because of all of this my boyfriend
> work
>>>> >>> has
>>>> >>> been suffering , he basically can't do his job if he is up worrying
>>>> >>> about
>>>> >>> me He had a few thousand dollars saved for my treatment but now
> since
>>>> >>> all
>>>> >>> this has been going on he has not been waiking up early, stopped
> going
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> the gym and he works from home so you can see how this would
> definitely
>>>> >>> hurt his job performance especially since he works from home. So
> now we
>>>> >>> are
>>>> >>> having to use that money to pay our rent that I had saved or he had
>>>> >>> saved
>>>> >>> up. I am just so upset I don't want to end up homeless. Plus his
> mother
>>>> >>> just died unexpectedly  from single cell lung cancer, she was only
> 50.
>>>> >>> But
>>>> >>> she also had no insurance,  there for never went to the doctor and
> this
>>>> >>> happened. I won't even go into how horrible the hospital treated
> her all
>>>> >>> just say this they knew she had maybe a month to live did not tell
> her
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> release her! We got hospice and she staid with us for about 4 days
>>>> >>> before
>>>> >>> she passed away. My boyfriend thought he was going to.do , therapy
> and
>>>> >>> get
>>>> >>> better, but it was too late for the chemotherapy at that stage. He
> has
>>>> >>> been
>>>> >>> through so much and I am putting him in even worse condition, we
> have
>>>> >>> been
>>>> >>> togeather for over 6 years,  but we're not married.
>>>> >>> On Aug 16, 2013 3:40 PM, "Jim Hadey3" <jimhadey3 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Hi Val,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> You might be an epileptic and it would not hurt to be tested.  If
> you do
>>>> >>> not have insurance or cash con the Epileptic Center of Whatever
> state
>>>> >>> your
>>>> >>> in and it can be done for free.  Give them a call and find out.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> It seems you mixing a lot of drugs, yes a low amount but your in a
>>>> >>> fragile state right now.  Kicking sub.... well it is like lifting
> 500
>>>> >>> lbs,
>>>> >>> very hard to do and most people can not do it.  I feel for ya, your
>>>> >>> hooked
>>>> >>> on sub and going through hell and still got a ways to go.  Most
> people
>>>> >>> want
>>>> >>> to go a two or three months off sub but the not the ct way.  Well
> there
>>>> >>> are
>>>> >>> not that much options, there is ct, taper and Ibo and that's about
> it.
>>>> >>> And
>>>> >>> when your at the end of your taper there is still some ct to go
> through.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> You want something that you can use for 2 months, get you self some
>>>> >>> thing
>>>> >>> that you can use for the next two months.  It seems that Kartom can
> be a
>>>> >>> problem for the liver and you drink it all day long - that can't be
> good
>>>> >>> for ya.  And two folks that I talked to said they will not do a
> Kartom
>>>> >>> detox with IBO so then you got to switch to another yet another
> drug and
>>>> >>> go
>>>> >>> through the switch then detox as low as possible then do the Ibo.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I am not a pod salesman but that would be one true normal opiate
> drug.
>>>> >>> I
>>>> >>> have not idea how much it will cost but got to be cheaper than sub.
>>>> >>> Also,
>>>> >>> you have a problem for you like getting an opiate buzz and so does
>>>> >>> everyone
>>>> >>> on this forum.  Some use and some are trying to quit or cut down
> and get
>>>> >>> off.  It is not that easy, you got a rough road ahead and once your
> clean
>>>> >>> -
>>>> >>> stay clean.  You asked while going through w/d would it be ok to
> take a
>>>> >>> sub
>>>> >>> pill or will that start my habit all over again.  Yes, for every
> time
>>>> >>> you
>>>> >>> felt shitty you would take a pill and eventually be hooked and all
> the
>>>> >>> suffering will be in vain or vane whichever, it will be a lot of
>>>> >>> suffering
>>>> >>> with no gain.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 1. Call your state or county health dept and tell them your having
>>>> >>> seizures.  If you have another one have your BF call for an
> ambulance
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> get it on paper and who know you might find someone at the hospital
> who
>>>> >>> will tell who to contact.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 2.  Get you brain and body depending on one drug rather than
>  a
>>>> >>> mixture.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 3.  Don't take Xanax for you body may still be sensitive to it.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 4.  When you get your self straight keep away from everything.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> That's the best I can think of, maybe some others on the forum can
> offer
>>>> >>> some suggestions.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Best,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>   - JIM
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On Fri, Aug 16, 2013 at 4:36 PM, Valarie <val.needis at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I am really confused, I have been taking Kratom for about a month
> now.
>>>> >>> Last night I could not sleep so I took that zzz Quill ( nite quill)
> , a
>>>> >>> xanex bar and a Clonidine in a period of 2 hrs, a few vicodin, and
> some
>>>> >>> more Kratom.  I awoke to an extreme panic attacks. I woke my
> boyfriend
>>>> >>> up
>>>> >>> and told him I was really scared and just to hold me. Then I awoke
> to
>>>> >>> him
>>>> >>> all freaked out he informed me that I just had a seizure!  I was so
>>>> >>> scared
>>>> >>> . Now I am so confused I had just taken a xanex so it was not
> because of
>>>> >>> that. I have had seizures in the past but I always blamed it on the
>>>> >>> benzodiazepines. Could this have been some weird drug reaction? All
> this
>>>> >>> shit makes me want to get back on the sub, but I have not taken
> any. Its
>>>> >>> just starting to get so hard. I do NOT want to die. My boyfriend
> just
>>>> >>> lost
>>>> >>> his mother and is extremely depressed, he needs me to be the strong
> one
>>>> >>> he
>>>> >>> has been the strong one for over six years now I feel like I'm
> bringing
>>>> >>> him
>>>> >>> down with me. :( . I am afraid to take ibogaine now and I feel like
>>>> >>> maybe
>>>> >>> since I have been off the sub for a month now and I was thinking
> about
>>>> >>> trying to taper myself with the use of Clonidine from the Kratom, I
> have
>>>> >>> found myself drinking the Kratom tea all day long, but I don't want
> to
>>>> >>> take
>>>> >>> the Clonidine for more then 2 weeks because it can cause
> hypertension,
>>>> >>> and
>>>> >>> that is the last thing I need! Can anyone help me maybe with a
>>>> >>> taper
>>>> >>> plan
>>>> >>> or something to get off the Kratom? Does anyone know why I would
> have a
>>>> >>> seizure?  I have never been tested to see if I am epileptic. I
>>>> >>> don't
>>>> >>> have
>>>> >>> insurance. Thanks, Val
>>>> >>>  On Aug 16, 2013 12:50 AM, "Jim Hadey3" <jimhadey3 at gmail.com>
>>>> >>> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Hi All,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I's 3 O'clock in the morning and can't sleep.  Anyway, the first
>>>> >>> sentence
>>>> >>> of Kevins email went like this ...where I live a young kid called
> 911
>>>> >>> ..said he was suicidal ..cops shot him in the head..... ( I don't
> want
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> mention the kids being there.)
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I can hear the phone call now.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 911: what's your emergency?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Kid   I want to kill my self but just can't
>>>> >>>        pull the trigger.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 911:  Is there something wrong with
>>>> >>>         the gun?  Are you sure it is
>>>> >>>         loaded?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Kid:   No the gun if fine I just don't
>>>> >>>          have the courage or guts.  I
>>>> >>>          need help.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 911:  Ok, we will send someone out
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> 911:  Car 54 please go to 23874 Maple
>>>> >>>             and help the man trying to commit
>>>> >>>             suicide.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Cops:  Hello dispatch we went to the
>>>> >>>           address and he said he could
>>>> >>>           not pull the trigger so we
>>>> >>>           shot him in the head.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Now, that's service.  That would make a funny skit or cartoon. Most
> of
>>>> >>> ya
>>>> >>> know they also shoot dogs too, yeah I posted a few.
>>>> >>> Best,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>   - JIM
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 8:36 PM, Kevin Murchie
>>>> >>> <satansbigtoe at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> where I live a young kid called 911 ..said he was suicidal  ..cops
> shot
>>>> >>> him in the head in front of little kids ..his mother and
> neighbors..they
>>>> >>> thought he was going to attack them..as he was walking back inside
> the
>>>> >>> house ..btw he was only 125lb soak an wet..so keep thibking the
> police
>>>> >>> are
>>>> >>> your pals..
>>>> >>>  On 2013-08-15 6:54 PM, "Matt S." <ibogamail at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>  I don't mean to be rude Shelly but a rudimentary google search
>>>> >>> will
>>>> >>> find dozens and dozens of news stories about suicidal people
> calling 911
>>>> >>> and having the cops come and shoot them (or their family).  See for
>>>> >>> yourself.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Here are just a few from page one of my search
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://wtaq.com/news/articles/2013/apr/22/suicidal-man-shot-by-police/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://www.kvoa.com/news/suicidal-man-shot-by-police-was-veteran-with-ptsd/#_
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://wvmetronews.com/2013/04/19/state-police-say-raleigh-death-suicide-by-cop-case/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://www.azcentral.com/news/arizona/free/20130608tucson-police-shooting-woman-suicide-call.html
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> https://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/watch-parents-suicidal-boy-shot-police-speak-article-1.1194069
>>>> >>>
> http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20130815/BLOG41/130819911/1048/comm0609
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2013-04-01/news/fl-pines-police-involved-20130401_1_boyfriend-woman-two-guns
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
> http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-222310.html&s=0e00e18f469667f95a235740fd95d7bc&amp
> <
> http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-222310.html&s=0e00e18f469667f95a235740fd95d7bc&amp
>>
>>>> >>> ;
>>>> >>> http://rt.com/usa/police-sniper-suicidal-boy-870/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I know all the people in these stories had guns or knives or
> something
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> justify getting shot by the cops.   Isn't that always the way it
> is?  As
>>>> >>> soon as someone gets shot it turns out they were armed because cops
>>>> >>> would
>>>> >>> never ever shoot an unarmed person.  There was a case where I live
> where
>>>> >>> a
>>>> >>> suicidal kid had a crucifix in his hand and the cops thought it
> looked
>>>> >>> like
>>>> >>> a gun so they offed him. I'm sure some of these cases really were
> people
>>>> >>> who intentionally provoked a cop to kill them but sending trigger
> happy,
>>>> >>> ego maniacal,  meat heads with inferiority complexes to handle a
>>>> >>> suicidal
>>>> >>> person is a stupid idea to begin with.  The very last people I
>>>> >>> personally
>>>> >>> would ever call for help of any kind whatsoever would be the cops.
>  In
>>>> >>> fact
>>>> >>> since we are on the subject, I did call 911 once a long time ago
> when I
>>>> >>> thought I had OD'd.  I was taken to the hospital and then to jail.
>  Fun
>>>> >>> stuff.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Sorry if my sensibilities offended you.  Sometimes the line between
>>>> >>> realism and pessimism is razor thin.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Matt
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On 8/15/2013 3:33 PM, shellygrantham wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> That is simply false..period.  They do not send a swat team to
> shoot you
>>>> >>> if you are suicidal and call 911. I wonder if...
>>>> >>> 1) Maybe there was a scenario where you live and something awful
>>>> >>> happened
>>>> >>> 2) you are joking?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>  Either way its irresponsible
>>>> >>> Ive read many posts, on recently where people are desperate and
>>>> >>> struggling.   They should never fear calling 911 for help.
> Hopefully it
>>>> >>> doesnt get to that point and there are other therapeutic
> interventions
>>>> >>> available to thw individual.  But people should know that if help
>>>> >>> is
>>>> >>> needed--dial 911
>>>> >>> If missed something that put your post in context-I apologize.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy Note® II, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> >>> From: "Matt S." <ibogamail at gmail.com> <ibogamail at gmail.com>
>>>> >>> Date: 08/15/2013 4:40 PM (GMT-05:00)
>>>> >>> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com> <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] comments from star
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Jim I don't know what things are like where you live but here if
>>>> >>> you
>>>> >>> call
>>>> >>> 911 and say you want to commit suicide they send the swat team over
> to
>>>> >>> shoot you.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Matt
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On 8/15/2013 2:19 PM, Jim Hadey3 wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>  Not once did I see on tv that it is hard to withdraw from SSRIs.
>  Of
>>>> >>> course the program may be sponsored by them.  If you take too many
> oxys
>>>> >>> they will bitch at ya but you triple your dose of SSRI/NI and they
> will
>>>> >>> probably up your dose, figure poor person they need more.  I am so
>>>> >>> curious
>>>> >>> as to how many Dr take them, 10 percent of the US population are
> taking
>>>> >>> them.  How did we live all these years without them.  If something
> is so
>>>> >>> bad you can lose a years word from being in a fog is pretty serious
> the
>>>> >>> Dr
>>>> >>> should of said something.  The suicide this can be a big deal too
> but
>>>> >>> the
>>>> >>> Dr never mention it.  They should say something like if you feel
> like
>>>> >>>  committing suicide call 911 but most people who commit suicide
> don't
>>>> >>> call.
>>>> >>>  Another thing you can not say that Dr did not warn me and should
> of,
>>>> >>> I'll
>>>> >>> get another Dr. because neither will the next Dr.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>  Best,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>    - JIM
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On Thu, Aug 15, 2013 at 3:48 PM, Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com>
> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Those SSRI/SNRI's can be difficult to withdrawal at times.  I
> remember
>>>> >>> Zoloft and Effexor having the most unpleasant and noticeable
>>>> >>> withdrawals.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ___________________
>>>> >>> Edward
>>>> >>> edwardw at mtciep.com
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> On 8/15/2013 1:06 PM, Randy Faulconer wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> star is very sensitive (sp) what would be a non issue for me for
>>>> >>> instance would make her od. everybody has different reactions to
> drugs
>>>> >>> just about. that's the one thing u have to watch for when doing a
>>>> >>> treatment with ibo.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>   jim what u said about ssri's brought to mind my first treatment.
>>>> >>> i
>>>> >>> got as sick quiting paxil as i did the methadone and it is an
> extreme
>>>> >>> no no to
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>   trust ur intuition grrrl and u can always call me anytime
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
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