[Ibogaine] suggestions of NA and AA

Edward W edwardw at mtciep.com
Sun Jan 22 13:50:15 EST 2012


Different paths for Different people Preston.  I do remember 
experienceing some of the same after going to an AA meeting.  If nothing 
else the environment can be condusive to recovery..for some.  I say 
whatever works for aftercare, no doubt, something has to be in place.  I 
would be open to going back to AA/NA/SA...etc...just havn't in years. I 
agree, not to voice other options is a bad start.

___________________
Edward
edwardw at mtciep.com





On 1/21/2012 9:06 PM, Preston Peet wrote:
> Just thought I'd note that personally, every single time I'd go to a 
> meeting, I'd always leave thinking about doing drugs. I myself cannot 
> condone such a suggestion to someone trying to strengthen their powers 
> over themselves and their urges. There are way more modalities than AA 
> and/or NA, etc, that are shown to be ever so much more effective,, or 
> at least, somewhat more. This is not to say I do not think that some 
> do get help from meetings, but to not voice other options could turn 
> out badly. So please, by all means push the aftercare idea hardcore, 
> as I'm all for that, just not so hot on the Anonymous meetings.
> Peace, love and Lotsof respect,
> Preston
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* "ibogaine-request at mindvox.com" <ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>
> *To:* ibogaine at mindvox.com
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 21, 2012 7:24 PM
> *Subject:* Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 13
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. update on iboga experience (Rory)
>   2. Yea (Jeremy spence)
>   3. Re: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 10 (junkboy)
>   4. Re: update on iboga experience (sister)
>   5. Re: afercare (Emma Sachs)
>   6. Re: afercare (buddy ellis)
>   7. Re: update on iboga experience (Jim Hadey3)
>   8. Re: afercare (Sister)
>   9. Re: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 12 (Preston Peet)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2012 16:58:04 +0000
> From: Rory <rorymiller3 at gmail.com <mailto:rorymiller3 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] update on iboga experience
> Message-ID:
> <CAL21oCdvoGOjpttmx0OtaMFFMFZnZZ4j5OzwqtXJbyzceyEcBQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CAL21oCdvoGOjpttmx0OtaMFFMFZnZZ4j5OzwqtXJbyzceyEcBQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi, I was just googling myself and saw that I popped up on this list quite
> a bit after posting my iboga experience last year. Well, I thought I'd
> update the story, as I also ate 45-50grams of rootbark a few months later.
> Weirdly, even less effect - but things don't tend to affect me so anyways,
> for one reason and another.
>
> Full iboga page with all eatings and a short video and follow-up here:
>
> http://rorysbligblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/rorys-complete-iboga-page.html
>
> By the way, it's over six months on and I still haven't felt any urge
> whatsoever to play internet chess! Eight hours+ a day beforehand to not
> even a whiff of a desire overnight. Okay, I know it's not heroin but it
> sure was one hell of an addiction - and my experience with iboga seems to
> have obliterated it completely.
>
> Best wishes,
> Rory
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2012 10:21:03 -0600
> From: Jeremy spence <jlspence12 at gmail.com <mailto:jlspence12 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Yea
> Message-ID: <54161053-338C-4B37-A0C1-C6776B0879F9 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:54161053-338C-4B37-A0C1-C6776B0879F9 at gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=us-ascii
>
> I "think"
> That the whole US system is kind a
> Mess...
> I just "love" with all my heart to "just"
> "see" "some?"
> "Changes" with the
> Whole here we go again, god damm, whole mother, fuck'en system and the 
> way they look at even "possible" "Addicts"
> Which is the "whole in tire" USA
> Sex, drugs, more drugs, with do u need more drugs?
> In my town that mean "ur given every drug but the ones u really might 
> want to have, a lower side affects, That's however, only "if u have 
> Learned how to even take them at all, with so much of "any sense?"
>
> I took me a long time understand how to even possibly take them, with 
> "any" sense..
> I'm on less pain Meds over all then I've ever been on, it took a lot 
> out of me.
>
> Its been a process...
> It just been extreme in my case because of just how bad my IC was.
>
> It just hit so hard, I'm a hard mfer to take out too.
> It just has damage me in ways I won't even talk about.....
> I just said, for just myself, unassisted
> A half gram of HCl which I know sounds gay as hell...
> I just got so much distress on and off.
> This town
> I live really fucked.
> I used to believe it wasn't this town, it's "no it's a, it's just U"
> Problem until I heard other people finally
> Speak out about, just BS here, people, it's like this town has in some 
> areas slipped back further in time?
> I don't get it????
>
> I never like this town much. I always wondered what it be like some 
> place else????
> The main issue with that is mfers
> It being so much more insane, I not
> Sure what that means but, just beyond
> In some other crazy ass way?
>
> like the murder rate In, Gary IN(and u just wouldn't ever think that 
> it would be that way...) but if u lived there for any length of time, 
> u would...
>
> Use to be up there with big cities, and that's a small town, "beyond...."
>
> I don't know, It like people in this town
> With the control another person thing...
> Not that I really care, not really.
> If people are that nuts, fuck'en beyond...
> what can u really say?
> Nothing......
>
> I just like to have as many possible opitions as possible..
> not limitless, just my God!
> Just having extremely little options, has led me to near death like 
> distress, and just made me near questioning my, very just "being"
> On earth at all?
> It seems there is little "point?" to some this shit..
> other then stubbornness
> Which I use to be more of if u can really believe that?
> I was at one time, did not trust natural treatments at "all"
> But I seen improvements, worth your wild, if u got like 10 years to 
> piss away...
> It might not take that long, but it did for me.
> Just dealing with the system, being forced to deal with it shit.
>
> I just saw on facebook, where a
> Horribly destressed women nearly her 40s had sex with a dead body and 
> got The "P" word
> Knocked up by "it"
> Isn't that crazy?
> Or what?
> But the way the medical people dealt with it was fucked too.
> I mean, nearly just only, every thing (aka they got in touch with 
> police that very day)
> I'm not saying what that should have done?
> It just the simple fact that this "person"
> Is going though system hell...
> and the fact that most MDs don't believe a word I've ever said, ever..
> And they believed this women right from the start is too me, out of 
> this world..
>
> I've have not been believed ever! Even still! That's fucked! Not that 
> really so much as I even care.
>
> Everything about this persons ID was let out... So her life is fucked 
> over, no telling in what sort of crazy, fucked up ways?
>
> I'm not even going judge the "person"
> but It just, not That I must believe this persons acts was "sane"
> But it was a once in life time sort of thing, not thing u expect to 
> ever happen..
> I'm sure it has.
> Stranger things???
> What those "things are?"
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Jeremy Lee Spece
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2012 20:43:06 -0700
> From: junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 10
> Message-ID:
> <CA+VSwKKj69RG0iZ1L9W6=MLyytwJ-+OvXWZcF1KW-fiyL5L9-g at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:OvXWZcF1KW-fiyL5L9-g at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> sounds like you have it under control!! well as under control as it really
> gets.. lol.
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:39:01 -0500
> From: sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] update on iboga experience
> Message-ID: <6819847E-BF7C-487B-8C66-8724FEC9CAC4 at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:6819847E-BF7C-487B-8C66-8724FEC9CAC4 at yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I had to giggle when I read this... as I sat here drinking my coffee 
> then it hit me .... before my eboga treatment I also spent a lot of 
> time playing bridge and chess on line.  I have not played but maybe a 
> few games and that was while waiting for a flight!
>
> Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
>
> On Jan 19, 2012, at 11:58 AM, Rory <rorymiller3 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:rorymiller3 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > Hi, I was just googling myself and saw that I popped up on this list 
> quite a bit after posting my iboga experience last year. Well, I 
> thought I'd update the story, as I also ate 45-50grams of rootbark a 
> few months later. Weirdly, even less effect - but things don't tend to 
> affect me so anyways, for one reason and another.
> >
> > Full iboga page with all eatings and a short video and follow-up here:
> >
> > http://rorysbligblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/rorys-complete-iboga-page.html
> >
> > By the way, it's over six months on and I still haven't felt any 
> urge whatsoever to play internet chess! Eight hours+ a day beforehand 
> to not even a whiff of a desire overnight. Okay, I know it's not 
> heroin but it sure was one hell of an addiction - and my experience 
> with iboga seems to have obliterated it completely.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> > Rory
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:15:08 -0500
> From: Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] afercare
> Message-ID:
> <CAAxLk=Rhubyps-2ifKZ8z+9mAUDBZa2ytHkyeOoJGVWB4ne+kA at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:kA at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I would include AA and NA meetings as well. When people get out into the
> real world they will need this.
>
> On Fri, Jan 20, 2012 at 5:21 PM, buddy ellis <sivabud at gmail.com 
> <mailto:sivabud at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > *i am currently putting together an extremely comprehensive and
> > individualized post ibogaine treatment center in new mexico.  our base
> > program will be kundalini yoga  and wilderness therapy. we an 
> experiential
> > module that will include mind body and spirit.  we will have trained
> > professional counselors on staff and will include a large array of
> > activities and alternative healing methods that will be co created by
> > counselors and clients.  we have a professional wilderness program
> > available,  organic gardening, fly fishing , skiing, snowboarding,
> > whitewater rafting , sweat lodges, art therapy, music therapy. 
> ibogaine is
> > an experiential interupter. i feel tthe aftercare should also be in the
> > same modality. we have a huge repertior of interested professionals
> > involved.  i am looking for some feedback from the list as to what 
> we can
> > do to be as successful as possible.*
> >
> > --
> > *Victory over others brings us satisfaction, but victory over ourselves
> > brings us joy."
> > *
> >
> >
> >
> > *Buddy Ellis*
> >
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:55:55 -0700
> From: buddy ellis <sivabud at gmail.com <mailto:sivabud at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] afercare
> Message-ID:
> <CAAmeJb98KLK8J7_W6B-TpTWkFDX8SBGRqn2UH4cCU3y8osNqCQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CAAmeJb98KLK8J7_W6B-TpTWkFDX8SBGRqn2UH4cCU3y8osNqCQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> of course emma, i got clean with the twelve steps and i would never deny
> anyone their own path....this is what i am trying to stress, lets work
> together to find what will work for each individual
>
> On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 6:15 AM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > I would include AA and NA meetings as well. When people get out into the
> > real world they will need this.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 20, 2012 at 5:21 PM, buddy ellis <sivabud at gmail.com 
> <mailto:sivabud at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >> *i am currently putting together an extremely comprehensive and
> >> individualized post ibogaine treatment center in new mexico.  our base
> >> program will be kundalini yoga  and wilderness therapy. we an 
> experiential
> >> module that will include mind body and spirit.  we will have trained
> >> professional counselors on staff and will include a large array of
> >> activities and alternative healing methods that will be co created by
> >> counselors and clients.  we have a professional wilderness program
> >> available,  organic gardening, fly fishing , skiing, snowboarding,
> >> whitewater rafting , sweat lodges, art therapy, music therapy. 
> ibogaine is
> >> an experiential interupter. i feel tthe aftercare should also be in the
> >> same modality. we have a huge repertior of interested professionals
> >> involved.  i am looking for some feedback from the list as to what 
> we can
> >> do to be as successful as possible.*
> >>
> >> --
> >> *Victory over others brings us satisfaction, but victory over ourselves
> >> brings us joy."
> >> *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> *Buddy Ellis*
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >>  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
>
>
> -- 
> *Victory over others brings us satisfaction, but victory over ourselves
> brings us joy."
> *
>
>
>
> *Buddy Ellis*
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 16:56:52 -0500
> From: Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] update on iboga experience
> Message-ID:
> <CAEoZqz3Q8EU635YNnyxwuQhGg1i_8JTCOm8qL2RrqC0e=11Kdg at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:11Kdg at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Sis,
>
> Ya wanna play my dog, Lucky??  I beat her 2 out of 3.
>
>   - JIM
>
> On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 6:39 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> > I had to giggle when I read this... as I sat here drinking my coffee 
> then
> > it hit me .... before my eboga treatment I also spent a lot of time 
> playing
> > bridge and chess on line.  I have not played but maybe a few games 
> and that
> > was while waiting for a flight!
> >
> > Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >
> > On Jan 19, 2012, at 11:58 AM, Rory <rorymiller3 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:rorymiller3 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Hi, I was just googling myself and saw that I popped up on this list 
> quite
> > a bit after posting my iboga experience last year. Well, I thought I'd
> > update the story, as I also ate 45-50grams of rootbark a few months 
> later.
> > Weirdly, even less effect - but things don't tend to affect me so 
> anyways,
> > for one reason and another.
> >
> > Full iboga page with all eatings and a short video and follow-up here:
> >
> > 
> <http://rorysbligblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/rorys-complete-iboga-page.html>
> > http://rorysbligblog.blogspot.com/2011/09/rorys-complete-iboga-page.html
> >
> > By the way, it's over six months on and I still haven't felt any urge
> > whatsoever to play internet chess! Eight hours+ a day beforehand to not
> > even a whiff of a desire overnight. Okay, I know it's not heroin but it
> > sure was one hell of an addiction - and my experience with iboga 
> seems to
> > have obliterated it completely.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> > Rory
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:50:41 -0800
> From: Sister <ibogamom at gmail.com <mailto:ibogamom at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] afercare
> Message-ID: <B8B8FCBE-6A43-41E9-A275-1EDBAF6A674E at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:B8B8FCBE-6A43-41E9-A275-1EDBAF6A674E at yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hey buddy... So glad to hear.  Email me some prices and site pls
>
> Sister
>
> On Jan 21, 2012, at 5:15 AM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > I would include AA and NA meetings as well. When people get out into 
> the real world they will need this.
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 20, 2012 at 5:21 PM, buddy ellis <sivabud at gmail.com 
> <mailto:sivabud at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > i am currently putting together an extremely comprehensive and 
> individualized post ibogaine treatment center in new mexico.  our base 
> program will be kundalini yoga  and wilderness therapy. we an 
> experiential module that will include mind body and spirit.  we will 
> have trained professional counselors on staff and will include a large 
> array of activities and alternative healing methods that will be co 
> created by counselors and clients.  we have a professional wilderness 
> program available,  organic gardening, fly fishing , skiing, 
> snowboarding, whitewater rafting , sweat lodges, art therapy, music 
> therapy. ibogaine is an experiential interupter. i feel tthe aftercare 
> should also be in the same modality. we have a huge repertior of 
> interested professionals involved.  i am looking for some feedback 
> from the list as to what we can do to be as successful as possible.
> >
> > --
> > Victory over others brings us satisfaction, but victory over 
> ourselves brings us joy."
> >
> >
> >
> > Buddy Ellis
> >
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
> >
> >  -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
> >  -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 09:32:23 -0800 (PST)
> From: Preston Peet <prestonpeet at yahoo.com <mailto:prestonpeet at yahoo.com>>
> To: "ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>" 
> <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 12
> Message-ID:
> <1327167143.42495.YahooMailNeo at web125405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1327167143.42495.YahooMailNeo at web125405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> hi Vector, great to "see" you.
> I have been taking the exercise advice religiously. Every time i find 
> myself suddenly zoning out I will then force myself upright, and onto 
> my feet. Hanging out two (for me lately , very late hours) days and 
> nights at the Yippie Museum and cafe (holy cow, you all should see the 
> place, it''s gorgeous), playing guitar, just chillin around other 
> people has certainly enabled to me to sleep twice this week now (LOL). 
> A relief as I'm sure you all can imagine.
> Once I get the emails stuff cleared it's walking time.
> Otherwise, later, peace and love and Lotsof respect.
> Preston (I just was looking at my boosters this morning, still having 
> sneezes and creepy skin- how much is just ME and how much detoxification?)
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>" <ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 9:54 PM
> Subject: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 12
>
> Send Ibogaine mailing list submissions to
> ??? ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> ??? http://www.mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ??? ibogaine-request at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ??? ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com>
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Ibogaine digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> ?  1. Re: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 9 (Vector Vector)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2012 21:45:13 -0800 (PST)
> From: Vector Vector <vector620022002 at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:vector620022002 at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 9
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1327038313.19692.YahooMailNeo at web160905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1327038313.19692.YahooMailNeo at web160905.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Preston, hang in there bro! Go for a walk at least, get some exercise, 
> do anything you can to get your body moving. When you need a booster 
> then go for it!
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Preston Peet <prestonpeet at yahoo.com <mailto:prestonpeet at yahoo.com>>
> To: "ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>" 
> <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 6:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 9
>
>
> ty Vector, Chris, JB, (w0w), and Edward, nice to be back to life. Did 
> a reading at the yippies tonight staying out later than I have for a 
> long time, and cleaned out my formerly methdone nod room in my apt 
> today, and it's Spotless! LOL One step at a time, but no looking back 
> or wallowing in self abuse. that's all for now, peace and love (and I 
> don't think I'm going to do a booster now, though it did occur to me.
> Preston (I have them on reserve, ;-)
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>" <ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 5:51 PM
> Subject: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 9
>
> Send Ibogaine mailing list submissions to
> ??? ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> ??? http://www.mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ??? ibogaine-request at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ??? ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com>
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Ibogaine digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> ?? 1. Re: successful eperience........ (Chris McMurtry)
> ?? 2. Re: successful eperience........ (Vector Vector)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 17 Jan 2012 22:55:20 -0600
> From: Chris McMurtry <lenanchris at gmail.com <mailto:lenanchris at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject:
> Re: [Ibogaine] successful eperience........
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CABw_bBBWVC1gAErOn1A=bOag-2JviDzrYyJsQTJpfjq1qQW2ew at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:bOag-2JviDzrYyJsQTJpfjq1qQW2ew at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Awesome! Hang in there and breathe the free air!!!
>
> On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 5:19 PM, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > good to see you preston!! maybe a booster will get rid of the rest 
> of the
> > symptoms..
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 17, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com 
> <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>> wrote:
> >
> >> Good to hear from you Preston, continued peace and health to
> you.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
>
>
> -- 
> **
> *This here email is from-->*
> **
> *? **? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ...Lena 'n' Chris...*
> **
> ? ? ? ?? *Wanna respond?? ?? Send yer mail to*:? lenanchris at gmail.com 
> <mailto:lenanchris at gmail.com>
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2012 03:57:34 -0800 (PST)
> From: Vector Vector <vector620022002 at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:vector620022002 at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] successful eperience........
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326887854.40522.YahooMailNeo at web160904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326887854.40522.YahooMailNeo at web160904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Preston! It's good to see you! Haven't heard from you in years, I'm 
> glad you are in the place
> you are right now!!!
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Preston Peet <prestonpeet at yahoo.com <mailto:prestonpeet at yahoo.com>>
> To: "ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>" 
> <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 5:19 PM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] successful eperience........
>
>
> Hi all, long time no visit.
>
> I took appx 2 grams of a ibo extract this past Friday, and while 
> extremely discombobulated still and wobbly as hell, I expunged an 80 
> ml methadone clinic hell.
> Extremely difficult to walk and even stand or even sit up right STILL, 
> I'm getting better every day, and I'm not feeling meth sick, though I 
> had some major restless leg/twitches last night. I'm hoping that 
> passes sooner than
> later.
> WELCOME HOME DANA!!!!!!!!!!!
> And I hope everyone else is doing well. It'd been six years since my 
> last experience, and was more than a little nervous, even terrified. I 
> told someone six years ago I was through with ibogaine, and his wife 
> smiled at my, and said, "yes, but it is through with you. Anyway, just 
> quick note here, Peace, love and Always Lotsof respect,
> Preston
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>" <ibogaine-request at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2012 2:10 PM
> Subject: Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 4
>
> Send Ibogaine mailing list submissions to
> ??? ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World
> Wide Web, visit
> ??? http://www.mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ??? ibogaine-request at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-request at mindvox.com>
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ??? ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine-owner at mindvox.com>
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Ibogaine digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> ?? 1. Re: Dear Ibogaine List (David Ray)
> ?? 2. David Bowie Turns 65 (DC from AZ)
> ?? 3. Re: Ibo flood symptomatic
> relief + and thoughts re how
> ? ? ? itfeels post flood (Jim Hadey3)
> ?? 4.
> Medication (Chris Mallin)
> ?? 5. Re: Medication (junkboy)
> ?? 6. Re: Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re how
> ? ? ? itfeels post flood (Andrew)
> ?? 7. Re: Dear Ibogaine List (Eboka Man)
> ?? 8. Re: Medication (sister)
> ?? 9. Re: Medication (Edward W)
> ? 10. Re: Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re how
> ? ? ? itfeels post flood (David Ray)
> ? 11. Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon (Ted)
> ? 12. Re: Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon (Sister)
> ? 13. Re: Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon (Jim Hadey3)
> ? 14. Re: Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon (Edward W)
> ? 15. Re: Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon (Sister)
> ? 16. Re: MS Contin (Donny Drake)
> ? 17. Re: Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine (Donny Drake)
> ? 18. Re: MS Contin (Sister)
> ? 19. Re: Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> (Ted)
> ?
> 20. Re: Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine (Donny Drake)
> ? 21. Re: MS Contin (Donny Drake)
> ? 22. Re: Medication (Andrew)
> ? 23. Re: MS Contin (David Ray)
> ? 24. Re: MS Contin (Sister)
> ? 25. Re: Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine (Megan Simm)
> ? 26. Re: Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine (Megan Simm)
> ? 27. benzodiazepines (jeff goldstein)
> ? 28. Re: benzodiazepines (Emma Sachs)
> ? 29. Re: Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine (Jim Hadey3)
> ? 30. Re: benzodiazepines (Andrew)
> ? 31. Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Diboga SanFilippo)
> ? 32. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Emma Sachs)
> ? 33. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Sara Glatt)
> ? 34. Re: Transitions | Unethical "Underground"
> Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Kevin Walker)
> ? 35. Re: Transitions | Unethical
> ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (sister)
> ? 36. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com>)
> ? 37. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Edward W)
> ? 38. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Sister)
> ? 39. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Sister)
> ? 40. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com>)
> ? 41. Re: Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> ? ? ? Treatment Centers (Emma Sachs)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date:
> Mon, 9 Jan 2012 12:13:06 +1100
> From: David Ray <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Dear Ibogaine List
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAD_M9k3ftk6Cr1x5AL6jWzEFUErWXy2C=YNsN1-hugMAkjUKwg at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:YNsN1-hugMAkjUKwg at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> It does reset.? All evidence suggests
> this.? BUT? this reset is
> temporary and precarious and can be wiped away in a couple of days,
> like any reset.? Like you say, reset is no great trick.? The way
> ibogaine works - I can sum up the entire experience of the group -
> nobody knows.? It interacts with so many different
> neurotransmitter
> mechanisms in the brain that there are endless theories.? It is
> certain that some combination of these actions causes the effect.? It
> takes away most of the withdrawals in the majority of cases (this is
> not guaranteed - individuals can be so different, one from the other,
> that no drug can be guaranteed in its effects. Heroin can provide
> peace or abject terror.? The latter group tend not to get addicted, so
> you don't hear much about them).? This liberation is not the effect,
> though - this is a starting point, a chance to go forward into a new
> lifestyle.? To expect it to provide
> an improved? minor variant of your
> old lifestyle is misguided in the extreme. Nor-ibogaine appears to
> remain in the body from 3 to 12 months and provides a diminishing
> protection during that period.? It also magnifies the effect of other
> neuroactive drugs so you may be causing additional harm if you go back
> to using
> other drugs after an ibo flood.? The drug provides a window
> of opportunity.? The benefit depends on what you do with this
> opportunity.? The ibogaine dossier and other online links provide
> heaps of useful information.? Howards Lotsof and his cronies provided
> immensely useful information that still remains the most reliable
> information.? There is also a vast amount of medical testing that can
> be accessed online.? User forums must be read with great caution.
> Good luck.
>
> On 08/01/2012, Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > Hi Hadin,
> >
> > You have been on the Met a very long time and you can expect Severe
> > depression and weakness for months after you kick.? Ibo will work for a
> > while but you should have boosters.? Just thought I would mention it 
> to ya
> > for you are not the only one.? Also you will have minor
> but annoying body
> > aches like withdrawal and it seems to last for ever.
> >
> > Also, Ibogaine does not always work the first time.? Should you fall 
> back
> > into using do the Ibo Experience over again.? You have been at it a long
> > time my friend and it is going to take a Very long time to get straight.
> > You have a long hard fight ahead of you and I wish you the best.? 
> Also, Ibo
> > can not do it alone specialty with a 25 year old Met habit.? Learn 
> all ya
> > can on this forum and you
> will have to change you buds for you can not hang
> > with users for you will surely fail.? Hey, why am I telling you 
> this?? You
> > have been at it 25 years you know this, excuse me.? Just do the best you
> > can.
> >
> > Best of luck,
> >
> >?? - JIM
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 8:32 PM, Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>> wrote:
> >
> >> wow.. that came out wrong.?? Really, I meant to put across that I 
> have me
> >> as proof.? Not saying that I walk away and didn't have to pay the price
> >> for
> >> 35yrs of use.? I had to work hard on my energy level,? get involved 
> in new
> >> interest and really build an identity that didn't involved doing 
> dope all
> >> day.
> >> I know I got the reset because I walked away without the physical
> need.
> >> My head was at rest when I allowed it.? It was very? uncomfortable 
> in the
> >> beginning.? At first I felt like I was still maintaining my habit 
> but just
> >> didn't have to take the drug.? As time passed I became more comfortable
> >> with day to day living without the dope but I also so just how immature
> >> and
> >> behind I was as far as growing up.? It became
> clear that I needed to put
> >> more effort in my new life mainly because I had some much more time 
> to do
> >> it.? Without dope I couldn't? just exsist anymore going to work
> >> maintaining
> >> so I don't get sick then coming home and do more till I nodded out.
> >> Needed
> >> a new identiy to be happy.? Ibogaine opens doors and gave me the 
> choice...
> >> thats a pretty good reset.
> >>
> >>?? *From:* Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> >> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >> *Sent:* Friday, January 6, 2012 8:09 PM
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Dear Ibogaine List
> >>
> >>?? because I am clean today.? dont care about this question anymore
> >> really.?
> I know I came thru the experience not needing dope anymore.
> >>
> >>?? *From:* Aiden Jacobs <aiden.panos at gmail.com 
> <mailto:aiden.panos at gmail.com>>
> >> *To:* ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >> *Sent:* Friday, January 6, 2012 4:12 PM
> >> *Subject:* [Ibogaine] Dear Ibogaine List
> >>
> >> Dear
> Ibogaine List,
> >>
> >> Happy new year to all. I am new to the list, and plan on doing Ibogaine
> >> shortly. I am in a situation which requires me to be on opiate
> >> painkillers.
> >> While researching the concept of tolerance to painkiller medications, I
> >> came across an article on Mindvox which describes how Ibogaine works
> >> terrific to reduce tolerance down to almost the starting point. I did a
> >>
> lot
> >> of digging and exploring after that, and it seems as if everyone 
> (ranging
> >> from professionals to providers to "patients") all agree that Ibogaine
> >> does
> >> work to "reset" tolerance (this was discussed in a recent post on this
> >> Ibogaine forum).
> >>
> >> What I would like to ask is -- how do we know that Ibogaine resets
> >> tolerance? If a person does Ibogaine and a month later they take the
> >> medicine
> again, their tolerance would be back way down anyhow.
> >>
> >> The only way to know that it resets tolerance is to have someone 
> tolerant
> >> to opiates do the Ibogaine, and within a few days take the opiate
> >> medication. Then we would know if the tolerance is reset.
> >>
> >> So I would love to hear back as to "how" and "why" it became so well
> >> accepted and agreed upon by everyone in the Ibogaine community
> that it
> >> does
> >> reset tolerance.
> >>
> >> Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
> >>
> >> Warm wishes,
> >>
> >> Aiden
> >>
> >>
> >>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>?? -=[) :::: Change Account
> Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) :::::::
> MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 09:55:41 -0500 (EST)
> From: DC from AZ <dcollier9 at q.com <mailto:dcollier9 at q.com>>
> To: Ibo List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] David Bowie Turns 65
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <1125961947.404045.1326120941828.JavaMail.root at md39.quartz.synacor.com 
> <mailto:1125961947.404045.1326120941828.JavaMail.root at md39.quartz.synacor.com>>
> ???
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>
>
> 1962?68: Bowie did his foundational work with early bands the Konrads 
> to the Riot Squad.
>
> 1969?73: Was his demonstrative work in psychedelic folk to glam rock 
> that included Space Oddity, Hunky Dory and the ever classic fable that 
> became Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars.
>
> 1974?76: Were the Diamond Dog years of
> soul, funk and the Thin White Duke. His work during this period is 
> some of his crowning achievements. The Man Who Fell to Earth gains 
> film acclaim for his acting career.
>
> 1976?79: With albums like Low in the Berlin era, Bowie became the 
> eclectic artist most fans know him for. Heroes was an important single 
> during this era also.
>
> 1980?89: Bowie propels from superstar to mega star with
> albums like Tonight, Scary Monsters and Let's Dance. The Title track 
> for Let's Dance reaches number one. He appears in the Jim Henson film 
> Labyrinth also.
>
> 1989?91: Tin Machine and Bowie take a dynamically different approach 
> to his work. Although a dream team approach for a band, the lineup did 
> not work as the democracy that Bowie hoped for, but the music is very 
> cool.
>
> 1992?99: The electronica approach for this era is complimented by the 
> collaboration of Bowie and Trent Reznor. Nine Inch Nails becomes a 
> touring partner for this period also. I'm
> Afriad of Americans is a classic statement of the new direction his 
> music has taken.
>
> 1999?present: The internet, remixing and collaborations with the new 
> social media, are the hardware of the neoclassicist Bowie movement of 
> today. Bowie achieves artistic awards and merits long deserved from 
> his peer community. Bowie plays Nikola Tesla in the film The Prestige.
>
> Blessings on this
> birthday number 65.
>
> Your Arizona fans love you as much today as ever.
>
> In the words of biographer Thomas Forget , "Because he has succeeded 
> in so many different styles of music, it is almost impossible to find 
> a popular artist today that has not been influenced by David Bowie."
>
> David Bowie has been many characters on stage, in film and on the 
> airwaves. He has been his own prophetic bard, a traveling minstrel 
> always telling tales of his own life in his songs. As Ziggy once said 
> so profoundly, " When the kids had killed the man, they had to
> break up the band ."
>
> Happy Birthday to Major Tom.
>
> -- 
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Donzo
> News: http://www.prourladyofemmitsburg.org/latestnews.html
> "After you see the two suns, there is only a short time before you 
> will see a
> tremendous change in weather"
> "in 203 BC, ?two suns? were seen in the sky. There were
> intervals of daylight during the night. Another appearance of ?two 
> suns? was in
> 185 AD. Chinese astronomers recorded the appearance of a bright star 
> like a
> sun in the sky and observed that it took about eight months to fade 
> from the sky.
> Yet another such phenomenon was observed on July 4, 1054 AD. It remained
> visible in daylight for 23 days and was visible in the night sky for 
> 653 days. It
> eventually faded from view on April 17,1056 AD. This explosion appeared in
> the
> constellation of Taurus"
> -----------------------
> "Love converts hearts, and gives peace." 1 John 5:18 God's protection
> ______________________________________________________________
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 13:57:39 -0500
> From: Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts
> re
> ??? how itfeels post flood
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAEoZqz0yAtPry6UjGsGSiMpFeuHzWT3PA85Ejc39LrFE2x0mwA at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CAEoZqz0yAtPry6UjGsGSiMpFeuHzWT3PA85Ejc39LrFE2x0mwA at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type:
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>
> Hello Andrew,
>
> Seems like you do not have much trust in the drug companies.? Just a 
> day or
> two ago I looked up Methadone and oh man you got to read it to believe it.
> It says an addict uses heroin then switches over to Methadone where they
> can get a correct dose of quality pharmaceutical medicine.? Then when
> stable they can detox at the rate of 5 to 10mg per week.? Oh come on 5 to
> 10 mg per week - no way.
>
> Everyone who tried Methadone has said it is harder to quit than most
> anything except sub.? It was much like a
> infomercial only you read it.? Now
> here is the part where ya got to pay attention:? It says it may be a 
> two or
> three year program.? OK if you can detox at 5 mg a week and you start with
> less than 100mg you should be off in a year, Right?? That's the math.
> Seems like it has not been updated since 1969 or so.
>
> Best,
>
> ? - JIM
>
> On Sat, Jan 7,
> 2012 at 8:08 PM, David Ray <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > Thanks all, Faith in particular.? I took a test dose of 250mg TA a few
> > weeks back as I was concerned about going overseas and finding that I
> > couldn't tolerate Ibo, an allergic reaction or vomitted it up, in
> > which case I would have been in real trouble.? I assumed that this
> > dose was high enough to be a good test, but low enough to not have any
> > significant
> effect. However, after a few hours, it did begin to have
> > an effect.? A little like mushrooms or LSD, but it felt almost like an
> > animal presence inside me.? The next day still getting a bit of
> > peripheral visual distortion.? Funny dreams for a few days.? And for a
> > few hours there was the vaguely insightful dreaming I've read about.
> > But for the week that
> followed I could still feel its presence inside
> > me, which is why I asked the question.? I like to be prepared.? This
> > tells me that I cannot be prepared, but obviously what I want is
> > something pretty dramatic, so I guess I just need to be ready to hold
> > on for the ride.? Lots of very helpful information.? Thanks again.
> > David
> >
> > On 08/01/2012, Andrew <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> > > Hi David,I'm in Oz too and coming off long-term,high-dose Benzo's 
> atm and
> > > lowering my Alc intake too which are both minimal now.
> > > I ramped the intake and strength(as I home-brew) down slowly as I have
> > the
> > > Benzo's as I was on 6mg Xan a day and drinking to blackout 
> stages...I'm
> > > lucky to have survived.Alcohol goes really well with Xanax....in the
> > >
> beginning ;)
> > >
> > > I too am looking at resetting soon,as my addiction was
> > "Accidental"...well
> > > basically I was prescribed Xanax and went through the stages of rapid
> > > dependence and tolerance to quite a high dose before I instigated the
> > taper
> > > withdrawal over to Valium and I'm nearly at the sticky end after 4 
> years
> > > detoxing....yes it's a long time I know,but everyone is different 
> in this
> > > respect.I want full functionality back
> and there have been many setbacks
> > > along this path.I take it only now to abate symptoms as I reduce,not
> > because
> > > I get high.It's all pain.
> > >
> > > I just read the responses as well as your post and I can say that 
> T.Iboga
> > > plants are available as well as seeds from www.herbalistics.com.au 
> , as
> > is
> > > Kanna.
> > > Darren is a top bloke and will look
> after you and he told me recently he
> > has
> > > seedlings growing now, as you will see there is none in stock atm. 
> I was
> > a
> > > member of an ethnobotany forum for many years and am still a member of
> > > another here in Aus.
> > > I wouldn't recommend the corroboree for reasons I won't go into.
> > > OK BIG ego problems,thus my absence and Darrens ;)
> > > Anyway I deter,Sceletium works quite well as I have used it in the 
> past
> > > mainly as a snuff
> preparation but I have used it sublingually too.
> > > I found snuff was easier to guage as the dose is felt rapidly and 
> you get
> > > used to eyeing up how much to use.It's also smokeable and a crushed
> > > match-head is roughly a dose.The same for snuff.
> > > It is however something that you would use infrequently,it seems 
> to work
> > > better that way.
> > > The plants are readily available
> too and the process is traditionally
> > > fermentation in a leather pouch.
> > > Sub-threshold doses of a certain fungus have been reported to be 
> of use
> > too.
> > > Also maybe look into Hemia Salcifolia as it has some desirable 
> properties
> > > for pain and a non-benzo non-addictive alternative in it's action.
> > > The immature seed heads are hand picked and dried in a warm shady
> > > position.Then they can be crushed and smoked or vapourised.
> > > I have used
> all these and lotus stamens to help me through
> > > pain,cramps,spasms etc.
> > > At one point I employed Mandrake,but you really need to know how to
> > prepare
> > > it and how much to use....I was in extreme withdrawal pain and 
> could not
> > > sleep.
> > > These days I use binaural beats(528Hz is good),self-hypnosis and
> > meditation
> > > and I'm not depressed.
> > >
> Points to note with Sceletium and Prozac are NOT to mix them as you
> > probably
> > > know and also to understand what the Prozac has actually done to 
> you're
> > > brain.
> > > Prozac contains mostly Sodium Fluoride which calcifies the Pineal 
> Gland
> > and
> > > also causes Fluorosis, so look those up and learn about the Pineal's
> > > importance in your mental health and sleep.
> > > Personally I'd steer clear of Pharma's,there are other ways,plus 
> Prozac
> > has
> >
> > a bad rep for suicidality.Congrats on getting off them!
> > > Melatonin works great for some to reset the sleep phases,though those
> > would
> > > already be interfered with by the other drugs in your system.
> > > Still you could use it and gauge your reaction(usually the 2nd 
> night is
> > when
> > > the reset happens).
> > > Pure Melatonin is what you want, somewhere around the
> 2mg mark, not the
> > > stuff from the chemist as it is like a tissue salt and not active 
> enough.
> > > If the dose is too high you will feel drowsy and off balance for a few
> > hours
> > > in the morning.Once again,use intermittently.
> > > Bear in mind that it is now illegal under the stupid analogues 
> clause as
> > is
> > > GABA, though you can get it easily enough.
> > > Sunlight(vitamin D3 synthesis) has proven to have more efficacy than
> > > Prozac.Exposure to the
> back of the knees seems to be the best.
> > > Don't believe the melanoma hype,studies show more incidences in 
> those who
> > > sit under fluorescent lights doing desk work than tradesman, which 
> I was
> > for
> > > 15 years installing Airconditioners in the blistering summer heat on
> > > roof-tops.Funny enough, it's Desk-Jockey's that seem to have a higher
> > > incidence of depression as
> well.
> > > I also had my time with anti-depressants many years ago,though luckily
> > > briefly, as my system reacted to them all quite rapidly thank God.
> > > Check out the CCHR's website and see for yourself how we have been
> > grossly
> > > mislead by these dollars for Doc's BS.
> > > They are releasing another video soon exposing the DSM!
> > > My heart goes out to all who have been given Pharma's that are 
> worse than
> > > pure H as I've watched a lot of Doco's on the
> subject and know exactly
> > why
> > > they prescribe it....it's inhumane IMHO.
> > > For maintaining and assessing your mental-health,there are really good
> > sites
> > > like moodgym for C.B.T. so go on the hunt for those sites.They are 
> really
> > > good and Bronwyn Fox has some excellent CD's and media available
> > especially
> > > on mindful-meditation.
> > > There is
> no science behind mood altering pharmaceuticals and most if not
> > all
> > > do damage to the receptor sites.IMO GP's handing these out is 
> ludicrous
> > but
> > > they get a kickback,so...yeah.
> > > Also it's no surprise that the push for expanding Methadone sales came
> > from
> > > the then Prime Minister's "plight".IMHO it was a believable 
> brainwashing
> > > exercise to make them look good,for the public to embrace it out of
> > > sympathy.
> > >
> Problem,reaction,solution...this is how Governments work.
> > > All here would know pure H is not dangerous at the correct dosage,it
> > used to
> > > be available at the chemist and was in Coca Cola.
> > > There is most probably absolutely nothing wrong with your brain,just
> > you're
> > > thoughts.This is where CBT, especially mindful-meditation and exercise
> > come
> > > in.
> > > We
> are built to repair ourselves.We have the ingredients but have been
> > > talked out of it with fake labels/conditions/crap food and thus the
> > > proliferation of Pharmaceuticals purely for bloody money!
> > > My PC has been out of action for quite a while now so I have only just
> > > opened up my inbox and am trying to catch up....still can't 
> believe Obama
> > > signed away American's Civil Liberties and we have US troops coming to
> > > settle in Darwin o,O!
> >
> > Chevron's been put back into place,but it looks like they are going to
> > try
> > > to drag this out again,so support Amazon Watch guys....if ever we 
> needed
> > > Shaman presence and maintain the diversity of the plants and 
> culture in
> > the
> > > world it is now.
> > > Sorry for the pretty random post, but I missed a dose today,been 
> offline
> > and
> > > am really starting to feel like
> shit,so a lot is coming out.
> > > It's getting really hard to concentrate now and I'm going through bad
> > > inter-dose withdrawals as I type which will pan out over the next few
> > > weeks,so I hope to keep track and wish you well mate.
> > > You might just find someone in Oz too,just keep posting and feel 
> free to
> > > keep in touch as I will be looking for treatment in the very near 
> future
> > > too.
> > >
> > > Cheers for now and take care all.
> >
> >
> > > Andrew...
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --------------------------------------------------
> > > From: "David Ray" <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> > > Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 2:31 PM
> > > To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> > > Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re how
> > > itfeels post flood
> > >
> > >> Hi Folks,
> > >>
> > >> Apologies in advance for the length of this question, but I need to
> > >> give considerable background to get to what I want to ask about. Also
> > >> a bit of a picture of Australia might help as I?m sure there are 
> major
> > >> differences between Oz and the USA.? Culturally
> Oz has some closer
> > >> connections to UK and Europe. Cultural difference and the differences
> > >> in the use and availability of different drugs make a difference to
> > >> how the addiction profile is dealt with.? For instance, we have a
> > >> pretty great health care system although it has the stresses and
> > >> delays you might expect from
> ?rational? economic approaches to
> > >> management.? I can go to a doctor free of charge, or with a small
> > >> co-payment and the government pays most or all of the fee.? Blood
> > >> testing is free and a detailed heart analysis (echo-cardiogram) cost
> > >> about $220 but I get back about 80% from the government health 
> agency.
> > >> The status of ibogaine in australia is the same as in the USA ?
> > >> banned. If I had recently ordered 2 grams of TA from ibogaworld, for
> >
> >> example, the government would have classified that at a level with the
> > >> importation of 2 grams of pure heroin and I would have been 
> liable for
> > >> a jail sentence of months or years.? Had ibogaworld posted it 
> labelled
> > >> as some innocuous herb that it vaguely resembled, I might have
> > >> received it safely, but this is purely hypothetical of
> course.
> > >> Reliable Canadian sources have, quite rightly, refused to post
> > >> ibogaine to me here in australia in the past because of its legal
> > >> status.? I have read about ibogaine for more than a decade and have
> > >> always thought that I would use it at some stage when it became 
> viable
> > >> in Australia, when the difficulties of methadone became 
> unbearable.? I
> > >> have learned that there have been some treatments in Australia, in
> > >> Queensland,
> the tropical north.? I think that these were done by some
> > >> people I?ve since contacted who are now in the UK. I?ve tried to
> > >> contact people listed as ibo providers in the past but have never got
> > >> a reply so I think they came and went quite quickly and were gone,
> > >> quit, jailed or whatever before I learned of them. I suspect that
> > >> there
> may be other underground ibo groups, probably in north
> > >> queensland, where the product could be successfully grown, but 
> this is
> > >> only a guess.? Seeds can be legally purchased.? It is just the 
> refined
> > >> product that is highly illegal to import. I?ve never been in a
> > >> financial situation where I could think of travelling to Holland or
> > >> Mexico to get a treatment.? Methadone maintenace treatment was vastly
> > >> expanded in the late 80s after
> a drug conference in 1986 triggered by
> > >> the addiction of the then prime minister?s daughter.? At that time
> > >> there were about 200 people on methadone maintenance in Victoria, the
> > >> state where I live. About a quarter of the australian population live
> > >> in this state ? about 5 million people out of 20+ million.? Within a
> > >> couple of years about 3000
> people were on methadone.? Now there are
> > >> tens of thousands.? In the last decade subutex has become popular and
> > >> there are thousands also on that.? Many authorities prefer it because
> > >> of its agonist/antagonist nature, despite the factor that methadone?s
> > >> overall success rate is significantly higher.? I went from methadone
> > >> to subutex for a couple of months. I hate the stuff and was overjoyed
> > >> to return to
> methadone, but some people prefer it.? Some hate
> > >> methadone.? I think one of the problems of methadone is that it is
> > >> more subtle in effect, but also goes very poorly with other
> > >> substances.? Alcohol can cause nasty side effects combined with
> > >> methadone, like death by suffocation in your sleep. The diuretic
> > >> effect of alcohol also tends to flush the methadone from your
> system,
> > >> further screwing the effect.? Combined with benzos it tends to send
> > >> you into zombieland.? As I use it by itself it works well for me.? Or
> > >> has worked reasonably well, despite its difficulties.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> I?ve been on methadone for 25 years roughly, with a couple of breaks
> > >> of a month or two ? firstly a return to heroin about 20 years back,
> > >> then subutex
> about 3 years back..? I don?t smoke, or drink any more,
> > >> although the idea that I might give up drinking would have been
> > >> unimaginable to me until I stabilised on methadone and gradually gave
> > >> up drinking.? I have hep C which I most likely got about 35 years 
> ago.
> > >> Around 95% of Aus junkies in my age group have hep C, most of them
> > >> got in when it was unknown and sharing syringes was common.?
> Many of
> > >> my friends who kept drinking are now dead from cirrhosis and related
> > >> liver problems.? I?ve always hated benzos for the way they cloud the
> > >> mind, although I?ve used them for short periods a few times.? When
> > >> methadone maintenance initially became available I was offered one of
> > >> ten places on an early trial program.? I turned it down as you?d have
> > >> to agree
> to stay on methadone for 4 years (we were all long term
> > >> multiple relapse junkies who were offered places.)? No way I?d still
> > >> be on methadone for four years, I thought.? 6 months later, for legal
> > >> reasons (conditional good behaviour bond that enabled me to avoid a 6
> > >> month jail sentence on appeal) I was under the supervision of a
> > >> government treatment agency and got on methadone.? Over the years 
> I?ve
> >
> >> gone up and down but, apart from the couple of months noted above,
> > >> have been on methadone since then.? The only other drug I?ve taken is
> > >> prozac, then effexor, then back to prozac.? Lifelong depression 
> is one
> > >> of the root excuses for the H addiction.? H is a very good
> > >> anti-depressant.? It is also one of the few anti-depressants that I
> > >> can
> tolerate, as it doesn?t muddy the brain and make me
> > >> non-functional. Until prozac came along I could never tolerate any of
> > >> the antidepressants that were prescribed for me.? Too muddy, too
> > >> drowsy, too hangovery.? Now I have tapered off prozac.? While on
> > >> methadone I have done an arts degree (practically worthless, but 
> I met
> > >> some good people and learned a few things).? I have also worked
> > >> fulltime for many years.? Just jobs that
> meant nothing but provided
> > >> income.? About 8 years ago hep C became very debilitating and I gave
> > >> up full time work when redundancy became available, after having to
> > >> take extended leave, most of it unpaid towards the end.? That?s the
> > >> time that I decided to move to the country/coast, live cheaply in a
> > >> cabin and try to
> get some decent writing done.? In the nineties I
> > >> published a number of short stories and poems in little lit mags but
> > >> it?s mainly been something for myself.? In the last few years the
> > >> poems and stories I?ve been writing have seemed right to me for the
> > >> first time.? I?ve always muddled through my own simple idiot tunes on
> > >> the guitar, and in the last few years I?ve had poems turn into songs
> > >> (when I was younger attempts at public performance were only
> possible
> > >> when blind drunk and they still terrified me ? didn?t go well).? 
> ? The
> > >> reason I?m giving this biographical crapolla is to explain that the
> > >> writing is what is important.? Methadone has been like a protective
> > >> barrier so that I can be very emotionally open, thus enabling the
> > >> writing, while
> being protected from the chaos of the modern world (the
> > >> forest is also a major protection).? As the years go on I find that
> > >> the methadone becomes more intrusive and begins to make clarity of
> > >> mind, and hence writing, to be harder.? Likewise the side effects of
> > >> the prozac seemed to become stronger.? I?ve found that reducing
> > >> methadone, even slowly tends to lead to major depression and 
> lethargy,
> > >> meaning I can?t write.? So Ibogaine becomes much more desirable, to
> > >>
> the point that I will be doing a flood when the arrangements can be
> > >> made.? Hopefully in New Zealand, where it has been legal on
> > >> prescription for about 16 months now.? I have a very good person in
> > >> New Zealand who is in the process of lining up a doctor who can be
> > >> made aware of the
> benefits of ibogaine.? I have done all the necessary
> > >> testing under the standard protocal and found that, although my liver
> > >> is compromised, it has enzyme level within the acceptable range.? My
> > >> doctor here will send the test data and other health information to
> > >> the doctor in New Zealand, who will hopefully be willing to prescribe
> > >> the methadone to be administered by my NZ provider.? My doctor is on
> > >> holiday until the middle of january, at which point things will
> > >> hopefully move forward so that I
> can do a flood.? If this best option,
> > >> near to home, falls through, fortunately there are back up 
> options, (I
> > >> have canadian citizenship, which might assist an option there, also
> > >> there is Mexico, possibly Holland/Costa Rica as there is a provider
> > >> who works in poth
> of these places) but I would really like to do it in
> > >> NZ as the closeness of NZ and Oz may help to make the treatment
> > >> available in Australia. Ever since I was told of the provider in NZ
> > >> this has seemed lie the optimum option.? After many years I know many
> > >> of the addiction experts here in Oz and will do what I can to 
> push for
> > >> treatment opening up here in the future, hopefully as some form of
> > >> government approved trials.
> > >>
> > >> Okay, after all this crap, is there actually a question??????? Yep
> ?
> > >> there are problems associated with the after-treatment and there 
> are a
> > >> couple of questions I have associated with this.? As the objective is
> > >> that I be able to go on with my writing, return to clarity of mind
> > >> within the shortest possible time, the notion of
> using benzos or any
> > >> other such intrusive symptomatic forms of relief is pretty pointless.
> > >> I would be willing to go back onto a low dose of prozac for a limited
> > >> period, but really I would like to know if there are very
> > >> non-intrusive medications that might help me through this period.
> > >> Melatonin for insomnia has been suggested.? I have not used this, but
> > >> it is natural within the body.? If there are any herbal type things
> > >> that might be helpful, this would be good.
> > >>
> > >> The other question
> ? noribogaine persists within the body for several
> > >> months and is proposed as the active agent in enabling the long term
> > >> behavioural changes needed to get out of on opiate lifestyle.? 
> What is
> > >> the nature of its effect within the body?? I believe it is subtle,
> but
> > >> I wonder if anybody might try to describe how it feels to have this
> > >> active substance within you.? It seems like it has some stimulant
> > >> effects, but does it feel like you?ve had a couple of cups of coffee,
> > >> or you feel more confident, or?.??????? I realise this is very
> > >> difficult but I have read a huge number of people?s accounts and they
> > >> seem to stop at the end of the active process after a few days.? 
> Would
> > >> anyone like to comment on the feeling of the months that follow a
> > >> flood.? Any thoughts would be
> appreciated.? I will learn myself in a
> > >> couple of months but I?d love to know what other people have to say
> > >> about this.? Sometimes I have read:? ?Harry seemed different 
> after the
> > >> flood.?? But they never say in what way.? Any
> thoughts????
> > >>
> > >> Thanks in advance,
> > >>
> > >> David
> > >>
> > >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> > >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> > >>
> > >
> > >?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
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> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 21:39:39 -0500
> From: Chris Mallin <cmallin20 at gmail.com <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Medication
> Message-ID:
> ???
> <CAPeJTGWjsH_ZfcK7RNZnPD5OP_=7uJqp3RKB8Qag3hxKt4KTQQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:7uJqp3RKB8Qag3hxKt4KTQQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hello All,
>
> Good evening!
>
> Quick question.
>
> If someone is talking Lamictal (lamotrigine), but not for seizures or
> bipolar but rather for an attention/cognitive issue, does he have to stop
> talking the Lamictal before the Ibogaine treatment?
>
> In this case, whenever he stops, he gets these side effects from stopping,
> such as pins and needles, etc., which make it very uncomfortable. So would
> he need to stop it weeks before the
> Ibogaine (I mean, will the Lamictal
> hurt the Ibogaine treatment and make it less effective), or can he stay on
> the Lamictal until the Ibogaine treatment (or maybe stop it just days or
> only one week before)?
>
> As always, thank you to all who
> are considerate enough to respond!
>
> Chris
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 20:19:02 -0700
> From: junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Medication
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CA+VSwK+mN2tRe59zhKa59A62tnyLd-RghDWw74=PYhgeok8L2Q at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:PYhgeok8L2Q at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> taper any anti depressants so you dont get those effects.
>
> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 7:39 PM, Chris Mallin <cmallin20 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > Hello All,
> >
> > Good evening!
> >
> > Quick question.
> >
> > If someone is talking Lamictal (lamotrigine), but not for seizures or
> > bipolar but rather for an attention/cognitive issue, does he have to 
> stop
> > talking the Lamictal before the Ibogaine treatment?
> >
> > In this case, whenever he stops, he gets these side effects from
> stopping,
> > such as pins and needles, etc., which make it very uncomfortable. So 
> would
> > he need to stop it weeks before the Ibogaine (I mean, will the Lamictal
> > hurt the Ibogaine treatment and make
> it less effective), or can he stay on
> > the Lamictal until the Ibogaine treatment (or maybe stop it just days or
> > only one week before)?
> >
> > As always, thank you to all who are considerate enough to respond!
> >
> > Chris
> >
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> Message:
> 6
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 13:30:08 +1100
> From: "Andrew" <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>>
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re
> ??? how??? itfeels post flood
> Message-ID: <BAY167-DS4815A7DC8EDE4E26BC5180FE990 at phx.gbl 
> <mailto:BAY167-DS4815A7DC8EDE4E26BC5180FE990 at phx.gbl>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> Hello
> Jim.,
>
> Yep ya got that damn straight
>
> According to the "Ashton Method" I use as a framework for coming off 
> Benzo's, I should be clear and free as a bird well and truly by now!!!
> Then again this method is supposedly "the pick" but is still
> way outdated and I don't believe there is a "One Size Fits All" 
> solution to the life we have been given.BTW XANAX has been labeled 
> "Worse than Heroin" and there is a book of the same name.
> The road we travel is a personal journey specifically tailored for 
> each of us in my belief (and many other's).
> There is no right or wrong way,just the way.
> I have watched Methadonia and High on Crack Street amongst many 
> others, so I do understand the plight of those on Methadone.
> My heart goes out to all who are fighting for their lives with this BS.
> I also watched Detox or Die which is absolutely brilliant.
> GenerationRx,Making a Killing and those Big Pharma doco's are 
> excellent and absolutely
> true!
> Bear in mind that I'm 41 now and was prescribed Xanax for "Panic 
> Disorder" in 2003,so a lot of things have happened since then.Learning 
> in 2007 that the drug I was on had been known to be extremely 
> addictive after as little as 3 weeks use and would
> eventually reach a "cap" of therapeutic dose efficacy since to late 
> 50's is what turned my sails!!!...I was like WTF!!!???...why does my 
> GP keep putting the doses up when it aint gong to do JACK from here on?
> I learned a lot fast and educated my GP,now he's a Benzo-Wise Doctor 
> and very proud of my progress.We are really good mates now after all 
> this and I have his full support which many don't have from their 
> Doc's.Sometimes you just have to take control, as it is YOUR life in 
> their hands.
> Remind them of this,it's the first line in their Oath
>
> There are so many contributing factors to everyone's story that 
> really,in essence,one must really learn to appreciate this fact before 
> one can
> move forward....just think of the scene in The Matrix where Neo gets 
> out of the car and what Trinity says.....
>
> I do realise that Ibogaine is not usually used for Benzo's as it is 
> for Opiates, but one thing we all have in common is that we do "know where
> that road goes" and we "have made a choice already".I'm extremely 
> humbled and overjoyed to be part of MindVox as I know that here,no 
> matter whether it's Cocaine,Speed,Heroin or Pharmaceuticals,we are all 
> searching for ourselves again.
> The ride I have chosen with this withdrawal has slowly unfolded on 
> many levels and taught me through pain and determination a hell of a 
> lot to put it mildly....if I had a dollar for every time a GP or so 
> called specialist has said "It shouldn't take that long...I've seen 
> people come off them quicker" LOL...I have met some of those that have 
> and man, they are just in another mess,just not the one they were in.
> I chose the road less travelled and will be far
> richer for the experience...an experience I will pay back to others in 
> the same position.
> It is my duty of care and also part of my wonderful story.
>
> For myslef, like Aya,Tryptamines and Amanita showed me in pieces of a 
> puzzle if you will, Ibo is part of
> my path to work out "why I made the choice"
> To put things in persective,as someone said: "Last time I checked,we 
> all have an expiration date!".
> I'll be damned if I don't nut this out before that comes around
>
> I don't expect Ibo to do anything more than what I put in,but it is on 
> my path, as I am a warrior,teacher,student and a healer at heart. It 
> will happen when the boat arrives and the boat always arrives on time
>
> The world we live in is supposed to be crazy,not us....this I see IS 
> the true nature of things.
> This is where the "Big Pharma,Big X-factor" comes in as I see it.
> There are definitely Elite and they know only power,lust and 
> greed.They also know the
> mechanics behind the human race.
> We have Love,Compassion,the ability for Reason,Forgiveness and a sense 
> of Unity.These "Types" have none of these attributes and so place us 
> in useful positions(to them) with the aid of these addictive drugs.
> If you were heartless and
> lazy,wouldn't you?
> Some are to dumb us down to slow our natural progression,some to 
> improve production like ants with a dozen beers after work to put us 
> back again and some deemed illicit,yet reasonably tolerated,so we 
> think we are getting away with it and need these drugs.So we take more 
> and the seeking becomes the addiction.
> Very clever design,but flawed by nature if analyzed in this light.
> The very things they try to instill in some of us use fear based 
> tactics as their only tool.
> This is why there is an arbitrary scale for punishable and allowable 
> drug use.
> Is it any wonder that right now the Military troops from Afghanistan 
> are speaking out and don't want
> war?
> Is it any wonder that Opium production which,when the US was working 
> trade deals out for Oil,was nearly Zero as compared to post 
> "False-Flag" 911 which are now up 75%?!....The US needs that Heroin!!
> Not to mention the prescription drug side of things and the huge profits
> and pay-offs everyone gets for passing this crap down the line.
> Yes it's all about money.
>
> I would strongly recommend anyone who seeks the road of healing, to 
> watch(even rewatch) The Matrix Trilogy and the Animatrix,then watch 
> Kymatica,then "Philosophy and The Matrix".
>
> Umm and please remember to help fight Chevron by donating whatever you 
> can afford to help save the Amazon, via Amazonwatch.Every dollar 
> counts,and they are counting on us as much as we have on them.
>
> Thanks for the replies,comments and the chance to speak.
>
> The catch-cry from our home-grown Aussie hip-hop dudes,Bliss and Esso 
> goes out to you guys.... "Peace,Love and Unity"
>
> Take care my new friends, we will win.
>
> Andrew...
>
>
>
>
>
> From: Jim Hadey3
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 5:57 AM
> To: The Ibogaine List
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re 
> how itfeels post flood
>
>
> Hello
> Andrew,
>
> Seems like you do not have much trust in the drug companies.? Just a 
> day or two ago I looked up Methadone and oh man you got to read it to 
> believe it.? It says an addict uses heroin then switches over to 
> Methadone where they can get a correct dose of quality pharmaceutical 
> medicine.? Then when stable they can detox at the rate of 5 to 10mg 
> per week.? Oh come on 5 to 10 mg per week - no way.
>
> Everyone who tried Methadone has said it is harder to quit than most 
> anything except sub.? It was much like a infomercial only you read 
> it.? Now here is the part where ya got to pay attention:? It says it 
> may be a two or three year program.? OK if you can
> detox at 5 mg a week and you start with less than 100mg you should be 
> off in a year, Right?? That's the math.? Seems like it has not been 
> updated since 1969 or so.
>
> Best,
>
> ? - JIM
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 8:08 PM, David Ray
> <trees.and.rain at gmail.com <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> ? Thanks all, Faith in particular.? I took a test dose of 250mg TA a few
> ? weeks back as I was concerned about going overseas and finding that I
> ? couldn't tolerate Ibo, an allergic reaction or vomitted it up, in
> ? which case I would have been in real trouble.? I assumed that this
> ? dose was high enough to be a good test, but low enough to not have any
> ? significant effect. However, after a few hours, it did begin to have
> ? an effect.? A little like mushrooms or LSD, but it felt almost like an
> ? animal presence inside me.? The next day still getting a bit
> of
> ? peripheral visual distortion.? Funny dreams for a few days.? And for a
> ? few hours there was the vaguely insightful dreaming I've read about.
> ? But
> for the week that followed I could still feel its presence inside
> ? me, which is why I asked the question.? I like to be prepared.? This
> ? tells me that I cannot be prepared, but obviously what I want is
> ? something pretty dramatic, so I guess I just need to be ready to hold
> ? on for the ride.? Lots of very helpful information.? Thanks again.
> ? David
>
>
> ? On 08/01/2012, Andrew <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> ? > Hi David,I'm in Oz too and coming off long-term,high-dose Benzo's 
> atm and
> ? > lowering my Alc intake too which are both minimal now.
> ? > I ramped the intake and strength(as I home-brew) down slowly as I 
> have the
> ? > Benzo's as I was on 6mg Xan a
> day and drinking to blackout stages...I'm
> ? > lucky to have survived.Alcohol goes
> really well with Xanax....in the
> ? > beginning ;)
> ? >
> ? > I too am looking at resetting soon,as my addiction was 
> "Accidental"...well
> ? > basically I was prescribed Xanax and went through the stages of rapid
> ? > dependence and tolerance to quite a high dose before I instigated 
> the taper
> ? > withdrawal over to Valium and I'm nearly at the sticky end after 4 
> years
> ? > detoxing....yes it's a long time I know,but everyone is different 
> in this
> ? > respect.I want full functionality back and there have been many 
> setbacks
> ? > along this path.I take it only now to abate symptoms as I 
> reduce,not because
> ? > I get high.It's all pain.
> ? >
> ? > I just read the responses as well as your post and I can say that 
> T.Iboga
> ? > plants are available as well as seeds from www.herbalistics.com.au 
> , as is
> ?
> > Kanna.
> ?
> > Darren is a top bloke and will look after you and he told me 
> recently he has
> ? > seedlings growing now, as you will see there is none in stock atm. 
> I was a
> ? > member of an ethnobotany forum for many years and am still a member of
> ? > another here in Aus.
> ? > I wouldn't recommend the corroboree for reasons I won't go into.
> ? > OK BIG ego problems,thus my absence and Darrens ;)
> ? > Anyway I deter,Sceletium works quite well as I have used it in the 
> past
> ? > mainly as a snuff preparation but I have used it sublingually too.
> ? > I found snuff was easier to guage as the dose is felt rapidly and 
> you get
> ? > used to eyeing up how much to use.It's also smokeable and a crushed
> ? > match-head is roughly a dose.The same for snuff.
> ? > It is however something that you would use infrequently,it seems 
> to work
> ? > better that
> way.
> ? > The plants are readily
> available too and the process is traditionally
> ? > fermentation in a leather pouch.
> ? > Sub-threshold doses of a certain fungus have been reported to be 
> of use too.
> ? > Also maybe look into Hemia Salcifolia as it has some desirable 
> properties
> ? > for pain and a non-benzo non-addictive alternative in it's action.
> ? > The immature seed heads are hand picked and dried in a warm shady
> ? > position.Then they can be crushed and smoked or vapourised.
> ? > I have used all these and lotus stamens to help me through
> ? > pain,cramps,spasms etc.
> ? > At one point I employed Mandrake,but you really need to know how 
> to prepare
> ? > it and how much to use....I was in extreme withdrawal pain and 
> could not
> ? > sleep.
> ? > These days I use binaural beats(528Hz is good),self-hypnosis and
> meditation
> ? > and I'm not depressed.
> ? > Points to note with Sceletium and Prozac are NOT to mix them
> as you probably
> ? > know and also to understand what the Prozac has actually done to 
> you're
> ? > brain.
> ? > Prozac contains mostly Sodium Fluoride which calcifies the Pineal 
> Gland and
> ? > also causes Fluorosis, so look those up and learn about the Pineal's
> ? > importance in your mental health and sleep.
> ? > Personally I'd steer clear of Pharma's,there are other ways,plus 
> Prozac has
> ? > a bad rep for suicidality.Congrats on getting off them!
> ? > Melatonin works great for some to reset the sleep phases,though 
> those would
> ? > already be interfered with by the other drugs in your system.
> ? > Still you could use it and gauge your reaction(usually the 2nd 
> night is when
> ? > the reset happens).
> ? > Pure
> Melatonin is what you want, somewhere around the 2mg mark, not the
> ? > stuff from the chemist as it is like a tissue salt and not active 
> enough.
> ? > If the dose is too high
> you will feel drowsy and off balance for a few hours
> ? > in the morning.Once again,use intermittently.
> ? > Bear in mind that it is now illegal under the stupid analogues 
> clause as is
> ? > GABA, though you can get it easily enough.
> ? > Sunlight(vitamin D3 synthesis) has proven to have more efficacy than
> ? > Prozac.Exposure to the back of the knees seems to be the best.
> ? > Don't believe the melanoma hype,studies show more incidences in 
> those who
> ? > sit under fluorescent lights doing desk work than tradesman, which 
> I was for
> ? > 15 years installing Airconditioners in the blistering summer heat on
> ? > roof-tops.Funny enough, it's Desk-Jockey's that seem to have a
> higher
> ? > incidence of depression as well.
> ? > I also had my time with anti-depressants many years ago,though luckily
> ? > briefly, as my system reacted to them all quite rapidly thank God.
> ? > Check out the CCHR's
> website and see for yourself how we have been grossly
> ? > mislead by these dollars for Doc's BS.
> ? > They are releasing another video soon exposing the DSM!
> ? > My heart goes out to all who have been given Pharma's that are 
> worse than
> ? > pure H as I've watched a lot of Doco's on the subject and know 
> exactly why
> ? > they prescribe it....it's inhumane IMHO.
> ? > For maintaining and assessing your mental-health,there are really 
> good sites
> ? > like moodgym for C.B.T. so go on the hunt for those sites.They are 
> really
> ? > good and Bronwyn Fox has some excellent CD's and media available 
> especially
> ? > on
> mindful-meditation.
> ? > There is no science behind mood altering pharmaceuticals and most 
> if not all
> ? > do damage to the receptor sites.IMO GP's handing these out is 
> ludicrous but
> ? > they get a kickback,so...yeah.
> ? > Also it's no surprise that the push for expanding Methadone
> sales came from
> ? > the then Prime Minister's "plight".IMHO it was a believable 
> brainwashing
> ? > exercise to make them look good,for the public to embrace it out of
> ? > sympathy.
> ? > Problem,reaction,solution...this is how Governments work.
> ? > All here would know pure H is not dangerous at the correct 
> dosage,it used to
> ? > be available at the chemist and was in Coca Cola.
> ? > There is most probably absolutely nothing wrong with your 
> brain,just you're
> ? > thoughts.This is where CBT, especially mindful-meditation and 
> exercise come
> ? >
> in.
> ? > We are built to repair ourselves.We have the ingredients but have been
> ? > talked out of it with fake labels/conditions/crap food and thus the
> ? > proliferation of Pharmaceuticals purely for bloody money!
> ? > My PC has been out of action for quite a while now so I have only just
> ? > opened up my inbox and am trying to catch
> up....still can't believe Obama
> ? > signed away American's Civil Liberties and we have US troops coming to
> ? > settle in Darwin o,O!
> ? > Chevron's been put back into place,but it looks like they are 
> going to try
> ? > to drag this out again,so support Amazon Watch guys....if ever we 
> needed
> ? > Shaman presence and maintain the diversity of the plants and 
> culture in the
> ? > world it is now.
> ? > Sorry for the pretty random post, but I missed a dose today,been 
> offline and
> ? > am really
> starting to feel like shit,so a lot is coming out.
> ? > It's getting really hard to concentrate now and I'm going through bad
> ? > inter-dose withdrawals as I type which will pan out over the next few
> ? > weeks,so I hope to keep track and wish you well mate.
> ? > You might just find someone in Oz too,just keep posting and feel 
> free to
> ? > keep in touch as I will be looking for treatment in the very
> near future
> ? > too.
> ? >
> ? > Cheers for now and take care all.
> ? >
> ? > Andrew...
> ? >
> ? >
> ? >
> ? > --------------------------------------------------
> ? > From: "David Ray" <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> ? > Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 2:31 PM
> ? > To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> ? > Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re how
> ? > itfeels post flood
> ? >
> ? >> Hi Folks,
> ? >>
> ? >> Apologies in advance for the length of this question, but I need to
> ? >> give considerable background to get to what I want to ask about. Also
> ? >> a bit of a picture of Australia might help as I?m sure there are 
> major
> ? >> differences
> between Oz and the USA.? Culturally Oz has some closer
> ? >> connections to UK and Europe. Cultural difference and the differences
> ? >> in the use and availability of different drugs make a difference to
> ? >> how the addiction profile is dealt with.? For instance, we have a
> ? >> pretty great health care system although
> it has the stresses and
> ? >> delays you might expect from ?rational? economic approaches to
> ? >> management.? I can go to a doctor free of charge, or with a small
> ? >> co-payment and the government pays most or all of the fee.? Blood
> ? >> testing is free and a detailed heart analysis (echo-cardiogram) cost
> ? >> about $220 but I get back about 80% from the government health 
> agency.
> ? >> The status of ibogaine in australia is the same as in the USA ?
> ? >> banned. If I had recently ordered 2 grams of TA from ibogaworld, for
> ? >>
> example, the government would have classified that at a level with the
> ? >> importation of 2 grams of pure heroin and I would have been 
> liable for
> ? >> a jail sentence of months or years.? Had ibogaworld posted it 
> labelled
> ? >> as some innocuous herb that it vaguely
> resembled, I might have
> ? >> received it safely, but this is purely hypothetical of course.
> ? >> Reliable Canadian sources have, quite rightly, refused to post
> ? >> ibogaine to me here in australia in the past because of its legal
> ? >> status.? I have read about ibogaine for more than a decade and have
> ? >> always thought that I would use it at some stage when it became 
> viable
> ? >> in Australia, when the difficulties of methadone became 
> unbearable.? I
> ? >> have learned that there have been some treatments in Australia, in
> ? >> Queensland, the tropical north.? I think that these were done by
> some
> ? >> people I?ve since contacted who are now in the UK. I?ve tried to
> ? >> contact people listed as ibo providers in the past but have never got
> ? >> a reply so I think they came and went quite
> quickly and were gone,
> ? >> quit, jailed or whatever before I learned of them. I suspect that
> ? >> there may be other underground ibo groups, probably in north
> ? >> queensland, where the product could be successfully grown, but 
> this is
> ? >> only a guess.? Seeds can be legally purchased.? It is just the 
> refined
> ? >> product that is highly illegal to import. I?ve never been in a
> ? >> financial situation where I could think of travelling to Holland or
> ? >> Mexico to get a treatment.? Methadone maintenace treatment was vastly
> ? >> expanded in the late 80s after a drug conference in 1986 triggered by
> ? >> the addiction of the then prime minister?s
> daughter.? At that time
> ? >> there were about 200 people on methadone maintenance in Victoria, the
> ? >> state where I live. About a quarter of
> the australian population live
> ? >> in this state ? about 5 million people out of 20+ million.? Within a
> ? >> couple of years about 3000 people were on methadone.? Now there are
> ? >> tens of thousands.? In the last decade subutex has become popular and
> ? >> there are thousands also on that.? Many authorities prefer it because
> ? >> of its agonist/antagonist nature, despite the factor that methadone?s
> ? >> overall success rate is significantly higher.? I went from methadone
> ? >> to subutex for a couple of months. I hate the stuff and was overjoyed
> ? >> to return to methadone, but some people prefer it.? Some hate
> ? >> methadone.? I think one of the problems of methadone is that it is
> ? >> more subtle in
> effect, but also goes very poorly with other
> ? >> substances.?
> Alcohol can cause nasty side effects combined with
> ? >> methadone, like death by suffocation in your sleep. The diuretic
> ? >> effect of alcohol also tends to flush the methadone from your system,
> ? >> further screwing the effect.? Combined with benzos it tends to send
> ? >> you into zombieland.? As I use it by itself it works well for me.? Or
> ? >> has worked reasonably well, despite its difficulties.
> ? >>
> ? >>
> ? >> I?ve been on methadone for 25 years roughly, with a couple of breaks
> ? >> of a month or two ? firstly a return to heroin about 20 years back,
> ? >> then subutex about 3 years back..? I don?t smoke, or drink any more,
> ? >> although the idea that I might give up drinking would have been
> ? >> unimaginable to me until I stabilised on methadone and gradually
> gave
> ? >> up drinking.? I have hep C which I most likely got about 35 years 
> ago.
> ? >> Around 95% of Aus junkies in my age group have hep C, most of them
> ? >> got in when it was unknown and sharing syringes was common.? Many of
> ? >> my friends who kept drinking are now dead from cirrhosis and related
> ? >> liver problems.? I?ve always hated benzos for the way they cloud the
> ? >> mind, although I?ve used them for short periods a few times.? When
> ? >> methadone maintenance initially became available I was offered one of
> ? >> ten places on an early trial program.? I turned it down as you?d have
> ? >> to agree to stay on methadone for 4 years (we were all long term
> ? >> multiple relapse junkies who were offered places.)? No way I?d still
> ? >> be on methadone for four years, I
> thought.? 6 months later, for legal
> ? >> reasons (conditional good
> behaviour bond that enabled me to avoid a 6
> ? >> month jail sentence on appeal) I was under the supervision of a
> ? >> government treatment agency and got on methadone.? Over the years 
> I?ve
> ? >> gone up and down but, apart from the couple of months noted above,
> ? >> have been on methadone since then.? The only other drug I?ve taken is
> ? >> prozac, then effexor, then back to prozac.? Lifelong depression 
> is one
> ? >> of the root excuses for the H addiction.? H is a very good
> ? >> anti-depressant.? It is also one of the few anti-depressants that I
> ? >> can tolerate, as it doesn?t muddy the brain and make me
> ? >> non-functional. Until prozac came along I could never tolerate any of
> ? >> the antidepressants that
> were prescribed for me.? Too muddy, too
> ? >> drowsy, too hangovery.? Now I have tapered off prozac.? While on
> ? >> methadone I have done an
> arts degree (practically worthless, but I met
> ? >> some good people and learned a few things).? I have also worked
> ? >> fulltime for many years.? Just jobs that meant nothing but provided
> ? >> income.? About 8 years ago hep C became very debilitating and I gave
> ? >> up full time work when redundancy became available, after having to
> ? >> take extended leave, most of it unpaid towards the end.? That?s the
> ? >> time that I decided to move to the country/coast, live cheaply in a
> ? >> cabin and try to get some decent writing done.? In the nineties I
> ? >> published a number of short stories and poems in little lit mags but
> ? >>
> it?s mainly been something for myself.? In the last few years the
> ? >> poems and stories I?ve been writing have seemed right to me for the
> ? >> first time.? I?ve always muddled through my own simple idiot tunes on
> ? >> the
> guitar, and in the last few years I?ve had poems turn into songs
> ? >> (when I was younger attempts at public performance were only possible
> ? >> when blind drunk and they still terrified me ? didn?t go well).? 
> ? The
> ? >> reason I?m giving this biographical crapolla is to explain that the
> ? >> writing is what is important.? Methadone has been like a protective
> ? >> barrier so that I can be very emotionally open, thus enabling the
> ? >> writing, while being protected from the chaos of the modern world 
> (the
> ? >> forest is also a major protection).? As the years go on I
> find that
> ? >> the methadone becomes more intrusive and begins to make clarity of
> ? >> mind, and hence writing, to be harder.? Likewise the side effects of
> ? >> the prozac seemed to become stronger.? I?ve found that reducing
> ? >> methadone, even slowly tends to lead to major depression and
> lethargy,
> ? >> meaning I can?t write.? So Ibogaine becomes much more desirable, to
> ? >> the point that I will be doing a flood when the arrangements can be
> ? >> made.? Hopefully in New Zealand, where it has been legal on
> ? >> prescription for about 16 months now.? I have a very good person in
> ? >> New Zealand who is in the process of lining up a doctor who can be
> ? >> made aware of the benefits of ibogaine.? I have done all the 
> necessary
> ? >> testing under the standard protocal and found
> that, although my liver
> ? >> is compromised, it has enzyme level within the acceptable range.? My
> ? >> doctor here will send the test data and other health information to
> ? >> the doctor in New Zealand, who will hopefully be willing to prescribe
> ? >> the methadone to be administered by my NZ provider.? My doctor is on
> ? >> holiday until the middle of january,
> at which point things will
> ? >> hopefully move forward so that I can do a flood.? If this best 
> option,
> ? >> near to home, falls through, fortunately there are back up 
> options, (I
> ? >> have canadian citizenship, which might assist an option there, also
> ? >> there is Mexico, possibly Holland/Costa Rica as there is a provider
> ? >> who works in poth of these places) but I would really like to do 
> it in
> ? >> NZ as the closeness of NZ and
> Oz may help to make the treatment
> ? >> available in Australia. Ever since I was told of the provider in NZ
> ? >> this has seemed lie the optimum option.? After many years I know many
> ? >> of the addiction experts here in Oz and will do what I can to 
> push for
> ? >> treatment opening up here in the future, hopefully as some form of
> ? >> government approved trials.
> ? >>
> ? >> Okay, after all this crap, is there
> actually a question??????? Yep ?
> ? >> there are problems associated with the after-treatment and there 
> are a
> ? >> couple of questions I have associated with this.? As the objective is
> ? >> that I be able to go on with my writing, return to clarity of mind
> ? >> within the shortest possible time, the notion of using benzos or any
> ? >> other such intrusive symptomatic forms
> of relief is pretty pointless.
> ? >> I would be willing to go back onto a low dose of prozac for a limited
> ? >> period, but really I would like to know if there are very
> ? >> non-intrusive medications that might help me through this period.
> ? >> Melatonin for insomnia has been suggested.? I have not used this, but
> ? >> it is natural within the body.? If there are any herbal type things
> ? >> that might be helpful, this would be good.
> ? >>
> ? >> The other question ?
> noribogaine persists within the body for several
> ? >> months and is proposed as the active agent in enabling the long term
> ? >> behavioural changes needed to get out of on opiate lifestyle.? 
> What is
> ? >> the nature of its effect within the body?? I believe it is 
> subtle, but
> ? >> I wonder if anybody might try to
> describe how it feels to have this
> ? >> active substance within you.? It seems like it has some stimulant
> ? >> effects, but does it feel like you?ve had a couple of cups of coffee,
> ? >> or you feel more confident, or?.??????? I realise this is very
> ? >> difficult but I have read a huge number of people?s accounts and they
> ? >> seem to stop at the end of the active process after a few days.? 
> Would
> ? >> anyone like to comment on the feeling of the months that follow a
> ? >> flood.? Any thoughts would be appreciated.? I will learn myself in a
> ?
> >> couple of months but I?d love to know what other people have to say
> ? >> about this.? Sometimes I have read:? ?Harry seemed different 
> after the
> ? >> flood.?? But they never say in what way.? Any thoughts????
> ?
> >>
> ? >> Thanks in advance,
> ? >>
> ? >> David
> ? >>
> ? >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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>
>
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>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2012 20:26:50 -0800 (PST)
> From: Eboka Man <ebokaman at ymail.com <mailto:ebokaman at ymail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Dear Ibogaine List
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326169610.61434.YahooMailNeo at web121902.mail.ne1.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326169610.61434.YahooMailNeo at web121902.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I did opiates a few days after an ibogaine flood, and it not only took 
> less to feel it, but it was also not pleasant, like opiates used to be.?
> It could have been because the iboga alkaloids also potentiate 
> opioids, but I had detoxed without iboga before and remained clean for 
> as many as 3 weeks, and it still took me pretty much my normal dose to 
> get where I needed to when I relapsed.?
>
>
> I was
> doing 3-5 bags to get well, and after a detox without iboga, I 
> remained clean for 3 weeks.? After 3 weeks of being pretty miserable, 
> I did 3 bags, and it made me feel better and I got a bit of a buzz.? 
> After doing an iboga detox, a few days later, I tried heroin, and 
> because I was told it would "reset" my tolerance, I was cautious, and 
> did one bag.? It felt as if I had done my normal 3-5 bags, only not as 
> pleasant.? I would have gotten really sick, had I used my normal 3-5 
> bags.? I am not sure if this is the "proof" you are asking for, but 
> that's how it worked for me.
>
> There is also a PDF in which they documented what is called dirty 
> maintenance, where people used iboga with their pain
> meds, so they could reduce their tolerance to their meds, so that they 
> were more effective.? The PDF is here: 
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/Articles/MAPS-Ibogaine2.pdf? Scroll down 
> to page 23, where it says, "Dirty Maintenance" for actual documented 
> details.
>
> Hope this helps!
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Aiden Jacobs <aiden.panos at gmail.com <mailto:aiden.panos at gmail.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Friday, January 6, 2012 1:12 PM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Dear Ibogaine List
>
>
> Dear Ibogaine List,
>
> Happy new year to all. I am new to the list, and plan on doing 
> Ibogaine shortly. I am in a situation which requires me to be on 
> opiate painkillers. While researching the concept of
> tolerance to painkiller medications, I came across an article on 
> Mindvox which describes how Ibogaine works terrific to reduce 
> tolerance down to almost the starting point. I did a lot of digging 
> and exploring after that, and it seems as if everyone (ranging from
> professionals to providers to "patients") all agree that Ibogaine does 
> work to "reset" tolerance (this was discussed in a recent post on this 
> Ibogaine forum).
>
> What I would like to ask is -- how do we know that Ibogaine resets 
> tolerance? If a person does Ibogaine and a month later they take the 
> medicine again, their tolerance would be back way down anyhow.
>
> The only way to know that it resets tolerance is to have someone 
> tolerant to opiates do the Ibogaine, and within a few days take the 
> opiate medication. Then we would know if the tolerance is reset.
>
> So I would love to hear back as to "how" and "why" it became so well 
> accepted and agreed upon by everyone in the Ibogaine
> community that it does reset tolerance.
>
> Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Warm wishes,
>
> Aiden
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 05:12:07 -0500
> From: sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine
> List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Medication
> Message-ID: <384E25AF-0C3A-4E7C-BA2E-6FD28E21E259 at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:384E25AF-0C3A-4E7C-BA2E-6FD28E21E259 at yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> A slower wean should help ... I would not have it in the system.
>
> Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
>
> On Jan 9, 2012, at 10:19 PM, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > taper any anti depressants so you dont get those effects.
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 7:39 PM, Chris Mallin <cmallin20 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > Hello All,
> >
> > Good evening!
> >
> > Quick question.
> >
> > If someone is talking Lamictal (lamotrigine), but not for seizures 
> or bipolar but rather for an attention/cognitive issue, does he have 
> to stop talking the
> Lamictal before the Ibogaine treatment?
> >
> > In this case, whenever he stops, he gets these side effects from 
> stopping, such as pins and needles, etc., which make it very 
> uncomfortable. So would he need to stop it weeks before the Ibogaine 
> (I mean, will the Lamictal hurt the Ibogaine treatment and make it 
> less effective), or can he stay on the Lamictal until the Ibogaine 
> treatment (or maybe stop it just days or only one week before)?
> >
> > As always, thank you to all who are considerate enough to respond!
> >
> > Chris
> >
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
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> >
> >
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> Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 08:09:03 -0700
> From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]
> Medication
> Message-ID: <4F0C548F.2000402 at mtciep.com 
> <mailto:4F0C548F.2000402 at mtciep.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> No kidding, sister, any remanent of an anti-convulsant with Ibo would be
> a concern, I would imagine.
>
> ___________________
> Edward
> edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/10/2012 3:12 AM, sister wrote:
> > A slower wean should help ... I would not have it in the system.
> >
> > Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >
> > On Jan 9, 2012, at 10:19 PM, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>
> > <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >> taper any anti depressants so you dont get those effects.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 7:39 PM, Chris Mallin <cmallin20 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>
> >> <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>? ?? Hello All,
> >>
> >>? ?? Good evening!
> >>
> >>? ?? Quick question.
> >>
> >>? ?? If someone is talking Lamictal (lamotrigine), but not for
> >>? ?? seizures or bipolar but rather for an attention/cognitive issue,
> >>? ?? does he have to
> stop talking the Lamictal before the Ibogaine
> >>? ?? treatment?
> >>
> >>? ?? In this case, whenever he stops, he gets these side effects
> from
> >>? ?? stopping, such as pins and needles, etc., which make it very
> >>? ?? uncomfortable. So would he need to stop it weeks before the
> >>? ?? Ibogaine (I mean, will the Lamictal hurt the Ibogaine treatment
> >>? ?? and make it less effective), or can he stay on the Lamictal until
> >>? ?? the Ibogaine treatment (or maybe stop it just days or only one
> >>? ?? week before)?
> >>
> >>? ?? As always, thank you to all who are considerate enough to respond!
> >>
> >>? ?? Chris
> >>
> >>
> >>? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >>? ? ? -=[)
> :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >
> >
> >? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 21:07:51 +1100
> From: David Ray <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts re
> ??? how itfeels post flood
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAD_M9k0otoQ8L2zbQXWoD-F+yakppexNZbJpPw5_9m31ZL0rjg at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:yakppexNZbJpPw5_9m31ZL0rjg at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> As I started this post I think I should make something about my point
> of view clear.? I used a whole range of drugs for a long time.
> Hallucinogens like LSD, mescaline, mushrooms, gave me as certain
> amount of knowledge.? But they distort processes of the mind, they
> don't show god to you.? I ended up using heroin because it
> was the
> purest and cleanest painkiller.? It did not cause damage in the way
> that alcohol does.? It does not close down consciousness as the benzos
> do.? I went to prozac because it worked with very little in the way of
> side effects.? However it is only good over the relatively short term.
> Now I take only methadone.? It has served me well.? It has enabled me
> to live my life without closing down consciousness.? That is why I
> always found benzos utterly unbearable.? I assume that these drugs
> effect people in different ways but at the same time I've found that
> people who combine methadone with alcohol or benzos turn to zombies
> and say methadone is to blame.? The opiates are better drugs than
> opioids like methadone, but of the pharma opioids I find methadone
> much cleaner than pethidine or palfium or any of the non-opiate
> derived? others.? Likewise I find methadone
> cleaner than the codeine
> variants that currently
> have 1.4 million people addicted in the USA.
> The notion of getting off methadone and using a bit of valium to keep
> me cool is the same as getting off beer onto methylated spirits.? So
> that's where this post comes from.? I'm concerned about having
> noribogaine in my system for 6 months although the risk benefit
> analysis tells me it's worthwhile.? So I don't regard methadone as a
> horrible evil.? It is better and cleaner than suboxone which I tried
> for a couple of months.? Methadone is one of the best tools that a
> junkie can find to get off the heroin cycle of crime and misery.?? It
> is the crime and misery that is the problem, not the heroin.? Heroin
> was legal in Australia until the 60s and was used for major pain, such
> as childbirth.? Many doctors got addicted to it.? Doctors familiar
> with this situation all said they would
> be much happier with a heroin
> addicted doctor operating on them than an alcoholic.? An
> alcoholic is
> impaired 100% of the time.? On a level dose a heroin addict is highly
> functional.? Likewise there is no benzo dose that does not impair
> consciousness.? People have a right to make that choice if they wish.
> I feel that I might be able to write better if I get off methadone.
> It is highly addictive and very hard to get off, but being on it at a
> medium or lower dose without hypnotics like alcohol or benzos enables
> a pretty alert and conscious lifestyle (for many people anyway).? One
> of the things I really miss is that I can't do a vipassana meditation
> course while on methadone, or it would be wasted anyhow.? I have no
> interest at all in discovering god through hallucinogens.? I want
> clarity of mind and that is why I'll be using ibogaine.? I feel the
> experience would be valuable for
> other reasons but that is a side
> benefit.? What I want is a reasonably painless (Although I expect
> fairly terrifying
> and difficult) addiction interruption.? At the same
> time I don't particularly want to use purified noribogaine which works
> without the dream stage because I believe the dream stage is part of a
> more substantive mental reset without which the addiction reset is
> less likely to work.? However I may be completely wrong about this.? I
> also dearly hope that ibogaine moves into the greater safety of the
> conventional medical system, despite its monstrous problems.? That way
> hundreds and thousands may benefit in safety, rather than a few in the
> underground clinics, although these remain essential to the
> continuance of research. I rely on two people for this attitude.
> Howard Lotsof said that ibogaine should be used in a medical
> environment if at all possible.? Deborah Mash, the
> most massively
> experienced neurologist, says that ibogaine should "never ever" be
> used outside of a hospital environment.? However I believe that
> people
> should be free to take that risk if they wish.? But it is a risk.? If
> one in 300 heroin users died I would have died many times over.
> Anyhow, that's where I come from and the reason for this post.? It is
> not a matter of escaping some terrible evil of methadone or heroin, it
> is a mater of making best use of the options available so that I can
> make the best life possible for myself.? Pharmas are massively corrupt
> and misdirected because of profit drive.? They are not evil.? The
> current treatment modalities for addiction are not horrific or evil,
> but they do have major side effects.? It is incredibly difficult to
> make informed choices about drugs and treatments when you're
> depressed, scared, sick etc. but that's what I'm trying
> to do - become
> informed about a drug so I know what I'm getting into.? Not battling
> evil or seeking god in a drug.? A lot of people may find this
> offensive.? That's the nature of
> the world.? I hope this drug will
> become available to godseekers, fools like me, even funny looking
> aliens if they need it.? But I'm about gaining knowledge, not fighting
> evil people who manipulate me.? I've screwed up all on my own, without
> the help of evil conspiracies dragging me down.
>
> On 10/01/2012, Andrew <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> > Hello Jim.,
> >
> > Yep ya got that damn straight
> >
> > According to the "Ashton Method" I use as a framework for coming off
> > Benzo's, I should be clear and free as a bird well and truly by now!!!
> > Then again this method is supposedly "the pick" but is
> still way outdated
> > and I don't believe there is a "One Size Fits All" solution to the 
> life we
> > have been given.BTW XANAX has been labeled "Worse than Heroin" and 
> there is
> > a book of the same
> name.
> > The road we travel is a personal journey specifically tailored for 
> each of
> > us in my belief (and many other's).
> > There is no right or wrong way,just the way.
> > I have watched Methadonia and High on Crack Street amongst many 
> others, so I
> > do understand the plight of those on Methadone.
> > My heart goes out to all who are fighting for their lives with this BS.
> > I also watched Detox or Die which is absolutely brilliant.
> > GenerationRx,Making a Killing and those Big Pharma doco's are 
> excellent and
> > absolutely true!
> > Bear in mind that I'm 41 now and was prescribed Xanax for "Panic 
> Disorder"
> > in 2003,so a lot of things have happened since then.Learning in 2007
> that
> > the drug I was on had been known to be extremely addictive after as 
> little
> > as 3 weeks use and would eventually reach a "cap" of therapeutic dose
> > efficacy since to late 50's is what turned my
> sails!!!...I was like
> > WTF!!!???...why does my GP keep putting the doses up when it aint 
> gong to do
> > JACK from here on?
> > I learned a lot fast and educated my GP,now he's a Benzo-Wise Doctor and
> > very proud of my progress.We are really good mates now after all 
> this and I
> > have his full support which many don't have from their 
> Doc's.Sometimes you
> > just have to take control, as it is YOUR life in their hands.
> > Remind them of this,it's the first line in their Oath
> >
> > There are so many contributing factors to everyone's story that 
> really,in
> > essence,one must really learn to appreciate this fact before one can 
> move
> > forward....just think of the scene in The Matrix
> where Neo gets out of the
> > car and what Trinity says.....
> >
> > I do realise that Ibogaine is not usually used for Benzo's as it is for
> > Opiates, but one thing we all have in common is that we do
> "know where that
> > road goes" and we "have made a choice already".I'm extremely humbled and
> > overjoyed to be part of MindVox as I know that here,no matter 
> whether it's
> > Cocaine,Speed,Heroin or Pharmaceuticals,we are all searching for 
> ourselves
> > again.
> > The ride I have chosen with this withdrawal has slowly unfolded on many
> > levels and taught me through pain and determination a hell of a lot 
> to put
> > it mildly....if I had a dollar for every time a GP or so called 
> specialist
> > has said "It shouldn't take that long...I've seen people come off them
> > quicker" LOL...I have met some of those that have and man, they are 
> just in
> > another mess,just not the one they were in.
> >
> I chose the road less travelled and will be far richer for the
> > experience...an experience I will pay back to others in the same 
> position.
> > It is my duty of care and also part of my wonderful
> story.
> >
> > For myslef, like Aya,Tryptamines and Amanita showed me in pieces of 
> a puzzle
> > if you will, Ibo is part of my path to work out "why I made the choice"
> > To put things in persective,as someone said: "Last time I checked,we all
> > have an expiration date!".
> > I'll be damned if I don't nut this out before that comes around
> >
> > I don't expect Ibo to do anything more than what I put in,but it is 
> on my
> > path, as I am a warrior,teacher,student and a healer at heart. It will
> > happen when the boat arrives and the boat always arrives on time
> >
> > The world we live in is supposed to be crazy,not us....this I see IS the
> > true nature of things.
> > This is where the "Big
> Pharma,Big X-factor" comes in as I see it.
> > There are definitely Elite and they know only power,lust and 
> greed.They also
> > know the mechanics behind the human race.
> > We have
> Love,Compassion,the ability for Reason,Forgiveness and a sense of
> > Unity.These "Types" have none of these attributes and so place us in 
> useful
> > positions(to them) with the aid of these addictive drugs.
> > If you were heartless and lazy,wouldn't you?
> > Some are to dumb us down to slow our natural progression,some to improve
> > production like ants with a dozen beers after work to put us back 
> again and
> > some deemed illicit,yet reasonably tolerated,so we think we are 
> getting away
> > with it and need these drugs.So we take more and the seeking becomes the
> > addiction.
> > Very clever design,but flawed by nature if analyzed in this light.
> > The very things they try to instill in some of us use fear based
> tactics as
> > their only tool.
> > This is why there is an arbitrary scale for punishable and allowable 
> drug
> > use.
> > Is it any wonder that right now the Military troops from
> Afghanistan are
> > speaking out and don't want war?
> > Is it any wonder that Opium production which,when the US was working 
> trade
> > deals out for Oil,was nearly Zero as compared to post "False-Flag" 
> 911 which
> > are now up 75%?!....The US needs that Heroin!!
> > Not to mention the prescription drug side of things and the huge 
> profits and
> > pay-offs everyone gets for passing this crap down the line.
> > Yes it's all about money.
> >
> > I would strongly recommend anyone who seeks the road of healing, to
> > watch(even rewatch) The Matrix Trilogy and the Animatrix,then watch
> > Kymatica,then "Philosophy and The Matrix".
> >
> > Umm and please remember to help fight Chevron by donating whatever you
> can
> > afford to help save the Amazon, via Amazonwatch.Every dollar 
> counts,and they
> > are counting on us as much as we have on them.
> >
> > Thanks for the replies,comments and
> the chance to speak.
> >
> > The catch-cry from our home-grown Aussie hip-hop dudes,Bliss and 
> Esso goes
> > out to you guys.... "Peace,Love and Unity"
> >
> > Take care my new friends, we will win.
> >
> > Andrew...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Jim Hadey3
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 5:57 AM
> > To: The Ibogaine List
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts 
> re how
> > itfeels post flood
> >
> >
> > Hello Andrew,
> >
> > Seems like you do not have much trust in the drug companies.? Just a 
> day or
> > two ago I looked up Methadone and oh man you got to read it to 
> believe it.
> > It says an addict uses heroin then switches over
> to Methadone where they can
> > get a correct dose of quality pharmaceutical medicine.? Then when stable
> > they can detox at the rate of 5 to 10mg per week.? Oh come on 5 to 10 mg
> per
> > week - no way.
> >
> > Everyone who tried Methadone has said it is harder to quit than most
> > anything except sub.? It was much like a infomercial only you read 
> it.? Now
> > here is the part where ya got to pay attention:? It says it may be a 
> two or
> > three year program.? OK if you can detox at 5 mg a week and you 
> start with
> > less than 100mg you should be off in a year, Right?? That's the 
> math.? Seems
> > like it has not been updated since 1969 or so.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> >?? - JIM
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 8:08 PM, David Ray <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >?? Thanks all, Faith in particular.? I took a test dose of 250mg TA a few
> >?? weeks back as I was concerned about going overseas and finding that I
> >?? couldn't tolerate Ibo, an
> allergic reaction or vomitted it up, in
> >?? which case I would have been in real trouble.? I assumed that this
> >?? dose was high enough to be a good test, but low enough to not have any
> >?? significant effect. However, after a few hours, it did begin to have
> >?? an effect.? A little like mushrooms or LSD, but it felt almost like an
> >?? animal presence inside me.? The next day still getting a bit of
> >?? peripheral visual distortion.? Funny dreams for a few days.? And for a
> >?? few hours there was the vaguely insightful dreaming I've read about.
> >?? But for the week that followed I could still feel its presence
> inside
> >?? me, which is why I asked the question.? I like to be prepared.? This
> >?? tells me that I cannot be prepared, but obviously what I want is
> >?? something pretty dramatic, so I guess I just need to be ready to
> hold
> >?? on for the ride.? Lots of very helpful information.? Thanks again.
> >?? David
> >
> >
> >?? On 08/01/2012, Andrew <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> >?? > Hi David,I'm in Oz too and coming off long-term,high-dose 
> Benzo's atm
> > and
> >?? > lowering my Alc intake too which are both minimal now.
> >?? > I ramped the intake and strength(as I home-brew) down slowly as 
> I have
> > the
> >?? > Benzo's as I was on 6mg Xan a day and drinking to blackout 
> stages...I'm
> >?? > lucky to have
> survived.Alcohol goes really well with Xanax....in the
> >?? > beginning ;)
> >?? >
> >?? > I too am looking at resetting soon,as my addiction was
> > "Accidental"...well
> >?? > basically I was prescribed Xanax and
> went through the stages of rapid
> >?? > dependence and tolerance to quite a high dose before I 
> instigated the
> > taper
> >?? > withdrawal over to Valium and I'm nearly at the sticky end after 
> 4 years
> >?? > detoxing....yes it's a long time I know,but everyone is different in
> > this
> >?? > respect.I want full functionality back and there have been many 
> setbacks
> >?? > along this path.I take it only now to abate symptoms as I reduce,not
> > because
> >?? > I get high.It's all pain.
> >?? >
> >?? > I just read the responses as well as your post and I can say that
> >
> T.Iboga
> >?? > plants are available as well as seeds from 
> www.herbalistics.com.au , as
> > is
> >?? > Kanna.
> >?? > Darren is a top bloke and will look after you and he told me 
> recently he
> > has
> >?? > seedlings
> growing now, as you will see there is none in stock atm. I was
> > a
> >?? > member of an ethnobotany forum for many years and am still a 
> member of
> >?? > another here in Aus.
> >?? > I wouldn't recommend the corroboree for reasons I won't go into.
> >?? > OK BIG ego problems,thus my absence and Darrens ;)
> >?? > Anyway I deter,Sceletium works quite well as I have used it in 
> the past
> >?? > mainly as a snuff preparation but I have used it sublingually too.
> >?? > I found snuff was easier to guage as the dose is felt rapidly 
> and you
> > get
> >?? > used to eyeing up how much to
> use.It's also smokeable and a crushed
> >?? > match-head is roughly a dose.The same for snuff.
> >?? > It is however something that you would use infrequently,it seems 
> to work
> >?? > better that way.
> >?? > The plants are
> readily available too and the process is traditionally
> >?? > fermentation in a leather pouch.
> >?? > Sub-threshold doses of a certain fungus have been reported to be 
> of use
> > too.
> >?? > Also maybe look into Hemia Salcifolia as it has some desirable
> > properties
> >?? > for pain and a non-benzo non-addictive alternative in it's action.
> >?? > The immature seed heads are hand picked and dried in a warm shady
> >?? > position.Then they can be crushed and smoked or vapourised.
> >?? > I have used all these and lotus stamens to help me through
> >?? > pain,cramps,spasms
> etc.
> >?? > At one point I employed Mandrake,but you really need to know how to
> > prepare
> >?? > it and how much to use....I was in extreme withdrawal pain and 
> could not
> >?? > sleep.
> >?? > These days I use binaural
> beats(528Hz is good),self-hypnosis and
> > meditation
> >?? > and I'm not depressed.
> >?? > Points to note with Sceletium and Prozac are NOT to mix them as you
> > probably
> >?? > know and also to understand what the Prozac has actually done to 
> you're
> >?? > brain.
> >?? > Prozac contains mostly Sodium Fluoride which calcifies the 
> Pineal Gland
> > and
> >?? > also causes Fluorosis, so look those up and learn about the Pineal's
> >?? > importance in your mental health and sleep.
> >?? > Personally I'd steer clear of Pharma's,there are other ways,plus 
> Prozac
> >
> has
> >?? > a bad rep for suicidality.Congrats on getting off them!
> >?? > Melatonin works great for some to reset the sleep phases,though 
> those
> > would
> >?? > already be interfered with by the other drugs in your system.
> >??
> > Still you could use it and gauge your reaction(usually the 2nd night is
> > when
> >?? > the reset happens).
> >?? > Pure Melatonin is what you want, somewhere around the 2mg mark, 
> not the
> >?? > stuff from the chemist as it is like a tissue salt and not active
> > enough.
> >?? > If the dose is too high you will feel drowsy and off balance for 
> a few
> > hours
> >?? > in the morning.Once again,use intermittently.
> >?? > Bear in mind that it is now illegal under the stupid analogues 
> clause as
> > is
> >?? > GABA, though you can get it easily enough.
> >?? >
> Sunlight(vitamin D3 synthesis) has proven to have more efficacy than
> >?? > Prozac.Exposure to the back of the knees seems to be the best.
> >?? > Don't believe the melanoma hype,studies show more incidences in 
> those
> > who
> >?? > sit
> under fluorescent lights doing desk work than tradesman, which I was
> > for
> >?? > 15 years installing Airconditioners in the blistering summer heat on
> >?? > roof-tops.Funny enough, it's Desk-Jockey's that seem to have a 
> higher
> >?? > incidence of depression as well.
> >?? > I also had my time with anti-depressants many years ago,though 
> luckily
> >?? > briefly, as my system reacted to them all quite rapidly thank God.
> >?? > Check out the CCHR's website and see for yourself how we have been
> > grossly
> >?? > mislead by these dollars for Doc's BS.
> >?? > They are
> releasing another video soon exposing the DSM!
> >?? > My heart goes out to all who have been given Pharma's that are worse
> > than
> >?? > pure H as I've watched a lot of Doco's on the subject and know 
> exactly
> > why
> >?? > they
> prescribe it....it's inhumane IMHO.
> >?? > For maintaining and assessing your mental-health,there are 
> really good
> > sites
> >?? > like moodgym for C.B.T. so go on the hunt for those sites.They are
> > really
> >?? > good and Bronwyn Fox has some excellent CD's and media available
> > especially
> >?? > on mindful-meditation.
> >?? > There is no science behind mood altering pharmaceuticals and 
> most if not
> > all
> >?? > do damage to the receptor sites.IMO GP's handing these out is 
> ludicrous
> > but
> >?? > they get a kickback,so...yeah.
> >?? > Also it's no
> surprise that the push for expanding Methadone sales came
> > from
> >?? > the then Prime Minister's "plight".IMHO it was a believable 
> brainwashing
> >?? > exercise to make them look good,for the public to embrace it out of
> >?? >
> sympathy.
> >?? > Problem,reaction,solution...this is how Governments work.
> >?? > All here would know pure H is not dangerous at the correct dosage,it
> > used to
> >?? > be available at the chemist and was in Coca Cola.
> >?? > There is most probably absolutely nothing wrong with your brain,just
> > you're
> >?? > thoughts.This is where CBT, especially mindful-meditation and 
> exercise
> > come
> >?? > in.
> >?? > We are built to repair ourselves.We have the ingredients but 
> have been
> >?? > talked out of it with fake labels/conditions/crap food and thus the
> >?? >
> proliferation of Pharmaceuticals purely for bloody money!
> >?? > My PC has been out of action for quite a while now so I have 
> only just
> >?? > opened up my inbox and am trying to catch up....still can't believe
> > Obama
> >??
> > signed away American's Civil Liberties and we have US troops coming to
> >?? > settle in Darwin o,O!
> >?? > Chevron's been put back into place,but it looks like they are 
> going to
> > try
> >?? > to drag this out again,so support Amazon Watch guys....if ever 
> we needed
> >?? > Shaman presence and maintain the diversity of the plants and 
> culture in
> > the
> >?? > world it is now.
> >?? > Sorry for the pretty random post, but I missed a dose today,been 
> offline
> > and
> >?? > am really starting to feel like shit,so a lot is coming out.
> >?? > It's getting really hard to concentrate
> now and I'm going through bad
> >?? > inter-dose withdrawals as I type which will pan out over the 
> next few
> >?? > weeks,so I hope to keep track and wish you well mate.
> >?? > You might just find someone in Oz too,just keep
> posting and feel free to
> >?? > keep in touch as I will be looking for treatment in the very 
> near future
> >?? > too.
> >?? >
> >?? > Cheers for now and take care all.
> >?? >
> >?? > Andrew...
> >?? >
> >?? >
> >?? >
> >?? > --------------------------------------------------
> >?? > From: "David Ray" <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> >?? > Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 2:31 PM
> >?? > To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >?? > Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibo flood symptomatic relief + and thoughts 
> re how
> >?? > itfeels post flood
> >?? >
> >?? >> Hi Folks,
> >??
> >>
> >?? >> Apologies in advance for the length of this question, but I need to
> >?? >> give considerable background to get to what I want to ask 
> about. Also
> >?? >> a bit of a picture of Australia might help as I?m sure there 
> are major
> >?? >> differences between Oz and the USA.? Culturally Oz has some closer
> >?? >> connections to UK and Europe. Cultural difference and the 
> differences
> >?? >> in the use and availability of different drugs make a difference to
> >?? >> how the addiction profile is dealt with.? For instance, we have a
> >?? >> pretty great
> health care system although it has the stresses and
> >?? >> delays you might expect from ?rational? economic approaches to
> >?? >> management.? I can go to a doctor free of charge, or with a small
> >?? >> co-payment and
> the government pays most or all of the fee.? Blood
> >?? >> testing is free and a detailed heart analysis (echo-cardiogram) 
> cost
> >?? >> about $220 but I get back about 80% from the government health 
> agency.
> >?? >> The status of ibogaine in australia is the same as in the USA ?
> >?? >> banned. If I had recently ordered 2 grams of TA from 
> ibogaworld, for
> >?? >> example, the government would have classified that at a level 
> with the
> >?? >> importation of 2 grams of pure heroin and I would have been 
> liable for
> >?? >> a jail sentence of months or years.? Had
> ibogaworld posted it labelled
> >?? >> as some innocuous herb that it vaguely resembled, I might have
> >?? >> received it safely, but this is purely hypothetical of course.
> >?? >> Reliable Canadian sources have, quite rightly, refused to
> post
> >?? >> ibogaine to me here in australia in the past because of its legal
> >?? >> status.? I have read about ibogaine for more than a decade and have
> >?? >> always thought that I would use it at some stage when it became 
> viable
> >?? >> in Australia, when the difficulties of methadone became 
> unbearable.? I
> >?? >> have learned that there have been some treatments in Australia, in
> >?? >> Queensland, the tropical north.? I think that these were done 
> by some
> >?? >> people I?ve since contacted who are now in the UK. I?ve tried to
> >?
> >> contact people listed as ibo providers in the past but have never got
> >?? >> a reply so I think they came and went quite quickly and were gone,
> >?? >> quit, jailed or whatever before I learned of them. I suspect that
> >?? >> there may be other
> underground ibo groups, probably in north
> >?? >> queensland, where the product could be successfully grown, but 
> this is
> >?? >> only a guess.? Seeds can be legally purchased.? It is just the 
> refined
> >?? >> product that is highly illegal to import. I?ve never been in a
> >?? >> financial situation where I could think of travelling to Holland or
> >?? >> Mexico to get a treatment.? Methadone maintenace treatment was 
> vastly
> >?? >> expanded in the late 80s after a drug conference in 1986 
> triggered by
> >?? >> the addiction of the then
> prime minister?s daughter.? At that time
> >?? >> there were about 200 people on methadone maintenance in 
> Victoria, the
> >?? >> state where I live. About a quarter of the australian 
> population live
> >?? >> in this state ? about 5 million people out of 20+ million.?
> Within a
> >?? >> couple of years about 3000 people were on methadone.? Now there are
> >?? >> tens of thousands.? In the last decade subutex has become 
> popular and
> >?? >> there are thousands also on that.? Many authorities prefer it 
> because
> >?? >> of its agonist/antagonist nature, despite the factor that 
> methadone?s
> >?? >> overall success rate is significantly higher.? I went from 
> methadone
> >?? >> to subutex for a couple of months. I hate the stuff and was 
> overjoyed
> >?? >> to return to methadone, but
> some people prefer it.? Some hate
> >?? >> methadone.? I think one of the problems of methadone is that it is
> >?? >> more subtle in effect, but also goes very poorly with other
> >?? >> substances.? Alcohol can cause nasty side effects combined with
> >?? >> methadone, like
> death by suffocation in your sleep. The diuretic
> >?? >> effect of alcohol also tends to flush the methadone from your 
> system,
> >?? >> further screwing the effect.? Combined with benzos it tends to send
> >?? >> you into zombieland.? As I use it by itself it works well for 
> me.? Or
> >?? >> has worked reasonably well, despite its difficulties.
> >?? >>
> >?? >>
> >?? >> I?ve been on methadone for 25 years roughly, with a couple of 
> breaks
> >?? >> of a month or two ? firstly
> a return to heroin about 20 years back,
> >?? >> then subutex about 3 years back..? I don?t smoke, or drink any 
> more,
> >?? >> although the idea that I might give up drinking would have been
> >?? >> unimaginable to me until I stabilised on methadone and 
> gradually gave
> >?? >> up drinking.? I have hep
> C which I most likely got about 35 years ago.
> >?? >> Around 95% of Aus junkies in my age group have hep C, most of them
> >?? >> got in when it was unknown and sharing syringes was common.? 
> Many of
> >?? >> my friends who kept drinking are now dead from cirrhosis and 
> related
> >?? >> liver problems.? I?ve always hated benzos for the way they 
> cloud the
> >?? >> mind, although I?ve used them for short periods a few times.? When
> >?? >> methadone maintenance initially became
> available I was offered one of
> >?? >> ten places on an early trial program.? I turned it down as 
> you?d have
> >?? >> to agree to stay on methadone for 4 years (we were all long term
> >?? >> multiple relapse junkies who were offered places.)? No way I?d 
> still
> >?? >> be on methadone for four years, I thought.? 6 months later,
> for legal
> >?? >> reasons (conditional good behaviour bond that enabled me to 
> avoid a 6
> >?? >> month jail sentence on appeal) I was under the supervision of a
> >?? >> government treatment agency and got on methadone.? Over the 
> years I?ve
> >?? >> gone up and down but, apart from the couple of months noted above,
> >?? >> have been on methadone since then.? The only other drug I?ve 
> taken is
> >?? >> prozac, then effexor, then back to prozac.?
> Lifelong depression is one
> >?? >> of the root excuses for the H addiction.? H is a very good
> >?? >> anti-depressant.? It is also one of the few anti-depressants that I
> >?? >> can tolerate, as it doesn?t muddy the brain and make me
> >?? >> non-functional. Until prozac came along I could never tolerate 
> any of
> >?? >> the antidepressants
> that were prescribed for me.? Too muddy, too
> >?? >> drowsy, too hangovery.? Now I have tapered off prozac.? While on
> >?? >> methadone I have done an arts degree (practically worthless, 
> but I met
> >?? >> some good people and learned a few things).? I have also worked
> >?? >> fulltime for many years.? Just jobs that meant nothing but provided
> >?? >> income.? About 8 years ago hep C became very debilitating and I
> gave
> >?? >> up full time work when redundancy became available, after having to
> >?? >> take extended leave, most of it unpaid towards the end.? That?s the
> >?? >> time that I decided to move to the country/coast, live cheaply in a
> >?? >> cabin and try to get some decent writing done.? In the nineties I
> >?? >> published a number of short stories and poems in little lit mags
> but
> >?? >> it?s mainly been something for myself.? In the last few years the
> >?? >> poems and stories I?ve been writing have seemed right to me for the
> >?? >> first time.? I?ve always muddled through my own simple idiot 
> tunes on
> >?? >> the guitar, and in the last few years I?ve had poems turn into 
> songs
> >?? >> (when I was younger attempts at public performance were only 
> possible
> >?
> >> when blind drunk and they still terrified me ? didn?t go well).? ? The
> >?? >> reason I?m giving this biographical crapolla is to explain that the
> >?? >> writing is what is important.? Methadone has been like a protective
> >?? >> barrier so that I can be very emotionally open, thus enabling the
> >?? >> writing, while being protected from the chaos of the modern 
> world (the
> >?? >> forest is
> also a major protection).? As the years go on I find that
> >?? >> the methadone becomes more intrusive and begins to make clarity of
> >?? >> mind, and hence writing, to be harder.? Likewise the side 
> effects of
> >?? >> the prozac seemed to become stronger.? I?ve found that reducing
> >?? >> methadone, even slowly tends to lead to major depression and 
> lethargy,
> >?? >>
> meaning I can?t write.? So Ibogaine becomes much more desirable, to
> >?? >> the point that I will be doing a flood when the arrangements can be
> >?? >> made.? Hopefully in New Zealand, where it has been legal on
> >?? >> prescription for about 16 months now.? I have a very good person in
> >?? >> New Zealand who is in the process of lining up a doctor who can be
> >?? >> made aware of the benefits of ibogaine.? I have done all the
> necessary
> >?? >> testing under the standard protocal and found that, although my 
> liver
> >?? >> is compromised, it has enzyme level within the acceptable 
> range.? My
> >?? >> doctor here will send the test data and other health information to
> >?? >> the doctor in New Zealand, who will hopefully be willing to 
> prescribe
> >?? >> the methadone to be
> administered by my NZ provider.? My doctor is on
> >?? >> holiday until the middle of january, at which point things will
> >?? >> hopefully move forward so that I can do a flood.? If this best 
> option,
> >?? >> near to home, falls through, fortunately there are back up 
> options, (I
> >?? >> have canadian citizenship, which might assist an option there, also
> >?? >> there is Mexico, possibly Holland/Costa Rica as there is a provider
> >?? >>
> who works in poth of these places) but I would really like to do it in
> >?? >> NZ as the closeness of NZ and Oz may help to make the treatment
> >?? >> available in Australia. Ever since I was told of the provider in NZ
> >?? >> this has seemed lie the optimum option.? After many years I 
> know many
> >?? >> of the addiction experts here in Oz and will do
> what I can to push for
> >?? >> treatment opening up here in the future, hopefully as some form of
> >?? >> government approved trials.
> >?? >>
> >?? >> Okay, after all this crap, is there actually a question??????? 
> Yep ?
> >?? >> there are problems associated with the after-treatment and 
> there are a
> >?? >> couple of questions I have associated with this.? As the 
> objective is
> >?? >> that I be able to go on with my writing, return to
> clarity of mind
> >?? >> within the shortest possible time, the notion of using benzos 
> or any
> >?? >> other such intrusive symptomatic forms of relief is pretty 
> pointless.
> >?? >> I would be willing to go back onto a low dose of prozac for a 
> limited
> >?? >> period, but really I would like to know if there are very
> >?? >>
> non-intrusive medications that might help me through this period.
> >?? >> Melatonin for insomnia has been suggested.? I have not used 
> this, but
> >?? >> it is natural within the body.? If there are any herbal type things
> >?? >> that might be helpful, this would be good.
> >?? >>
> >?? >> The other question ? noribogaine persists within the body for 
> several
> >?? >> months and is proposed as the active agent in enabling the long 
> term
> >?? >>
> behavioural changes needed to get out of on opiate lifestyle.? What is
> >?? >> the nature of its effect within the body?? I believe it is 
> subtle, but
> >?? >> I wonder if anybody might try to describe how it feels to have this
> >?? >> active substance within you.? It seems like it has some stimulant
> >?? >> effects, but
> does it feel like you?ve had a couple of cups of coffee,
> >?? >> or you feel more confident, or?.??????? I realise this is very
> >?? >> difficult but I have read a huge number of people?s accounts 
> and they
> >?? >> seem to stop at the end of the active process after a few 
> days.? Would
> >?? >> anyone like to comment on the feeling of the months that follow a
> >?? >> flood.? Any thoughts would be appreciated.? I will learn myself 
> in a
> >?? >> couple of months but I?d love to know
> what other people have to say
> >?? >> about this.? Sometimes I have read:? ?Harry seemed different 
> after the
> >?? >> flood.?? But they never say in what way.? Any thoughts????
> >?? >>
> >?? >> Thanks in advance,
> >?? >>
> >?? >> David
> >?
> >>
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> > 
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 08:49:51 -0800 (PST)
> From: Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326214191.90069.YahooMailNeo at web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326214191.90069.YahooMailNeo at web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
>
> I am looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in Gabon, 
> or possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an addict, aside 
> from a slightly unhealthy relationship
> with cannabis. I am seeking visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to 
> address some inner emotional/psychic damage. I would like to 
> experience this with the Bwiti. I have heard of organizations that 
> will host travelers and staff doctors trained in western medicine in 
> addition to working with the
> local shamans.
>
> Can anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the right 
> direction? Any advice will be welcomed and ?greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
> Ted
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 16:02:02 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326240122.24453.YahooMailNeo at web84006.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326240122.24453.YahooMailNeo at web84006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Ted,
> I am sorry I cant help but someone may come by to help.? If not you 
> might want to go to face book and? look up Demetri.. he is Bwitti and 
> I am sure can be of help.
> I would like to ask if you would be willing to come back and share 
> your experince?? I for one would love to hear what it was like for you.?
> Welcome
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 11:49
> AM
> >Subject: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> >
> >
> >Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
> >
> >
> >I am looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in Gabon, 
> or possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an addict, aside 
> from a slightly unhealthy relationship with cannabis. I am seeking 
> visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to address some inner 
> emotional/psychic damage. I would like to experience this with the 
> Bwiti. I have heard of organizations that will host travelers and 
> staff doctors trained in western medicine in addition to working with 
> the local shamans.
> >
> >
> >Can
> anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the right 
> direction? Any advice will be welcomed and ?greatly appreciated.
> >
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Ted
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
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> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 19:05:11 -0500
> From: Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in
> Gabon
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAEoZqz2nbNu4cunBP4rq6bjPbb3BuensyF+F7ASpv6TRSiM_YA at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:F7ASpv6TRSiM_YA at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Ted,
>
> Do you think that Ibo is going to do more for ya because you consume it in
> Africa rather than the USA??? I mean no disrespect for if you want to go
> and feel that it will help by all means go but the answer may lie in you
> and the Ibo brings it out so ya can deal with it.? Kind of reminds me of
> the time when the Beatles went to India to meditate with some yoga guy.? I
> mean why did they have to go to India couldn't
> they meditate in England??
> Anyway, I hope you find what your looking for if so please drop us a line
> and let us know.
>
> Wishing you the best,
>
> ? - JIM
>
> On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> > Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
> >
> > I am looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in Gabon, or
> > possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an addict, aside 
> from a
> > slightly unhealthy relationship with cannabis. I am seeking
> > visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to address some inner
> > emotional/psychic damage. I would like to experience this with the 
> Bwiti. I
> > have heard of organizations that will host travelers and staff doctors
> > trained in western medicine in addition to working with the local 
> shamans.
> >
> > Can
> anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the right
> > direction? Any advice will be welcomed and? greatly appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Ted
> >
> >
> >? -=[) :::::::
> MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
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> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 17:12:16 -0700
> From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> Message-ID: <4F0CD3E0.9070606 at mtciep.com 
> <mailto:4F0CD3E0.9070606 at mtciep.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Good and Valid points Jim.
>
> Wishing you well Ted.
>
> ___________________
> Edward
> edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/10/2012 5:05 PM, Jim Hadey3 wrote:
> > Hi Ted,
> >
> > Do you think that Ibo is going to do more for ya because you consume
> > it in Africa rather than the USA??? I mean no disrespect for if you
> > want to go and
> feel that it will help by all means go but the answer
> > may lie in you and the Ibo brings it out so ya can deal with it.? Kind
> > of reminds me
> of the time when the Beatles went to India to meditate
> > with some yoga guy.? I mean why did they have to go to India couldn't
> > they meditate in England??? Anyway, I hope you find what your looking
> > for if so please drop us a line and let us know.
> >
> > Wishing you the best,
> >
> >?? - JIM
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>
> > <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >? ?? Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
> >
> >? ?? I am looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in
> >?
> ?? Gabon, or possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an
> >? ?? addict, aside from a slightly unhealthy
> relationship with
> >? ?? cannabis. I am seeking visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to
> >? ?? address some inner emotional/psychic damage. I would like to
> >? ?? experience this with the Bwiti. I have heard of organizations that
> >? ?? will host travelers and staff doctors trained in western medicine
> >? ?? in addition to working with the local shamans.
> >
> >? ?? Can anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the
> >? ?? right direction? Any advice will be welcomed and? greatly 
> appreciated.
> >
> >? ?? Thanks,
> >? ?? Ted
> >
> >
> >? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >? ?? (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? ? ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 16:45:24 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326242724.58591.YahooMailNeo at web84002.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326242724.58591.YahooMailNeo at web84002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I would love to go to Africa.? Maybe not for Iboga but just to go and 
> see the land.? If I had the money that is.? Sometimes one goes just to 
> experience the Country, culture and the people.? I for one, if I could 
> would love to travel.? There is nothing like being there to get a true 
> feel for the culture.
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 7:05 PM
> >Subject: Re:
> [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> >
> >
> >Hi Ted,
> >
> >Do you think that Ibo is going to do more for ya because you consume 
> it in Africa rather than the USA??? I mean no disrespect for if you 
> want to go and feel that it will help by all means go but the answer 
> may lie in you and the Ibo brings it out so ya can deal with it.? Kind 
> of reminds me of the time when the Beatles went to India to meditate 
> with some yoga guy.? I mean why did they have to go to India couldn't 
> they meditate in England??? Anyway, I hope you find what your looking 
> for if so please drop us a line and let us know.
> >
> >Wishing you the best,
> >
> >? - JIM
> >
> >
> >On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>> wrote:
> >
> >Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
> >>
> >>
> >>I
> am
> looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in Gabon, or 
> possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an addict, aside 
> from a slightly unhealthy relationship with cannabis. I am seeking 
> visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to address some inner 
> emotional/psychic damage. I would like to experience this with the 
> Bwiti. I have heard of organizations that will host travelers and 
> staff doctors trained in western medicine in addition to working with 
> the local shamans.
> >>
> >>
> >>Can anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the 
> right direction? Any advice will be welcomed and ?greatly appreciated.
> >>
> >>
> >>Thanks,Ted
> >>
> >>?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >>?-=[) ::::
> Change
> Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 23:50:32 +0000 (GMT)
> From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> To: The
> Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326239432.90755.YahooMailNeo at web132504.mail.ird.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326239432.90755.YahooMailNeo at web132504.mail.ird.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count 
> while your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any 
> difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am 
> wondering whats the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a 
> EKG or whatever test knowing it could have influenced the tests for 
> the better if I wasnt on opiates, so if anybody can advise I would
> appreaciate
> it.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk 
> <mailto:gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Friday, 6 January 2012, 16:15
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
>
>
> It took away 100% of my acute wd's .. for maybe 24-36 hours.. I was in 
> full wd before i took it and an hour i was fine.. (just tripping :) 
> after that they slowly crept back in but by taking the TA and RB I had 
> left It was controllable to probabyl 80-90% of how bad it would have 
> been without.. just sneezing and lethargic.. nothing compared with 
> coming off 60mg methadone cold..
>
>
>
>
> On 6 January 2012 16:10, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> i found that with sub there was a point that i couldnt go any lower... 
> my point was 2mg.. i COULNT go lower... panic would set in and i would 
> do anything to get my drugs.. anway, if you want ibogaine to do 95% of 
> the work or not do it at all, it doesnt sound like you dont want to 
> get clean to begin with.. hell i would of been happy with any 
> relief... let alone 95%.. its more like 80% of symptoms.. it takes a 
> raging flu and changes it to a bad cold...
> >it sounds like you may need more time using before your ready to 
> quit.. hopefully by then you havent ruined your life... best of wishes
> >junkboy
> >
> >
> >?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >?-=[) :::: Change Account Settings
> ::
> [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 23:50:55 +0000 (GMT)
> From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326239455.83047.YahooMailNeo at web132501.mail.ird.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326239455.83047.YahooMailNeo at web132501.mail.ird.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count while
> your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any
> difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am
> wondering whats the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a 
> EKG or whatever test knowing it could have influenced the tests for the
> better if I wasnt on opiates, so if anybody can advise I would
> appreaciate it.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: David Ray
> <trees.and.rain at gmail.com <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Sunday, 8 January 2012, 1:51
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
>
> Donny, to give a bit of understanding.? Opioids (heroin type drugs)
> work because they connect chemically to a group of 3 neuron receptors
> in the brain (there are more than this but these are the main ones).
> The chemicals that connect are in two main groups called agonists
> (activators) and antagonists (blockers).? Amongst the agonists (like
> heroin morphine etc) there are some called competitive and some called
> non-competitive.? Heroin and morphine are non-competitive, meaning
> that you can take one, then the other will add to the effect if taken.
> Nor-ibogaine, the active component
> of
> ibogaine HCL is
> non-competitive, so it increases the effect of other opiates.? Subutex
> is a competitive agonist/antagonist.? It is a bit active, but it also
> blocks the receptors so that other drugs won't work. This means that
> it actively works against ibo and makes the process that much harder.
> But it is relatively short acting.? In a month or less it is
> completely gone from your system, at which point the MScontin or
> whatever you've replaced it with is all that you have to deal with.
> Which means that ibo has the maximum probability of success.? Other
> factors for you to consider, however, are that you are already on a
> dose of subutex that is lower than many people could tolerate.? Many
> people at that level would be already feeling like crap.? That means
> you're already going well if you're feeling okay at that level.? A lot
> of people step off subutex at that level without major consequences.
> It might be worth
> your while reducing and quitting the subutex and see
> what happens.? If it is too painful, then go onto the MSContin, get
> yourself stabilised and then give the ibo a go. Ibo is a dangerous
> drug and not to be taken lightly, though, so don't use it if you don't
> need it. You really are in a great position to get clean.? Some
> psychological support of whatever kind you can find and works for you
> would be really useful.? And if you go the ibo route you should get an
> experienced provider.? Even if you're young and healthy you really
> need someone reliable and experienced to look after you.? Also, many
> people relapse many times before getting clean, so don't beat yourself
> up if that happens.? You learn a bit more each time.? (I posted this
> on another listing, then realised this is the main one so I've copied
> it here as it may have some value.? Then again, maybe not, but it's
> the thought that counts)? Good luck.
>
> On
> 07/01/2012, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> 
> wrote:
> > i was on as much sub as i wanted for a couple years. two i think. then i
> > tapered down to 2mg for a couple months.. then i did a ta 4g of extract
> > with a 1.5g booster at 3 months...and random root bark boosters.
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 8:33 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >
> >> Sorry I asked how long you was on sub, few months? Few years? what was
> >> your highest dose? I thought somebody would remember their highest dose
> >> and
> >> how long rougly they were on sub before a flood dose...Sorry for asking
> >> the
> >> same question its just that I may have missed if you said the 
> duration of
> >> sub you was
> on...So what type of Iboga/Ibogaine did you use for a flood
> >> dose? mind Your one of only 2 people on this site who have said 
> they came
> >> off sub with Iboga and stayed clean..The rest of fols on other 
> forums and
> >> outside the net all claim Iboga/Ibogaine doesnt do much for sub 
> users and
> >> they either relapsed because of depression and PAWS post-sub or went to
> >> methadone...So it's just I would like to have much information and 
> detail
> >> as possible in how long you was on sub, what your highest maintence 
> dose
> >> was and what type of Iboga-Ibogaine you used, and how many 
> boosters, the
> >> more info the more prepared I can get and gives me hope.
> >>
> >>?? ------------------------------
> >> *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 15:02
> >>
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >> i came off of 2mg sub with no problems... 23mg/k flood and a 
> booster at 3
> >> months... worked fine...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 17:07:07 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326244027.29987.YahooMailNeo at web84007.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326244027.29987.YahooMailNeo at web84007.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> you can get both the EKG and all blood test.? The sub should not 
> affect any of
> it.
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:50 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count 
> while your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any 
> difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am 
> wondering whats the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a 
> EKG or whatever test knowing it could have influenced the tests for 
> the better if I wasnt on opiates, so if anybody can advise I would 
> appreaciate
> it.
> >
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________
> >From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk 
> <mailto:gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Friday, 6 January 2012, 16:15
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >It took away 100% of my acute wd's .. for maybe 24-36 hours.. I was 
> in full wd before i took it and an hour i was fine.. (just tripping :) 
> after that they slowly crept back in but by taking the TA and RB I had 
> left It was controllable to probabyl 80-90% of how bad it would have 
> been without.. just sneezing and lethargic.. nothing compared with 
> coming off 60mg methadone cold..
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On 6 January 2012 16:10, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >i found that with sub there was a point that i couldnt go any 
> lower... my point was 2mg.. i COULNT go lower... panic would set in 
> and i would do anything to get my drugs.. anway, if you want ibogaine 
> to do 95% of the work or not do it at all, it doesnt sound like you 
> dont want to get clean to begin with.. hell i would of been happy with 
> any relief... let alone 95%.. its more like 80% of symptoms.. it takes 
> a raging flu and changes it to a bad cold...
> >>it sounds like you may need more time using before your ready to 
> quit.. hopefully by then you havent ruined your life... best of wishes
> >>junkboy
> >>
> >>
> >>?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>(][%] ?:: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine :: ?[%][)
> >>?-=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
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>
> Message: 19
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 21:19:09 -0800 (PST)
> From: Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326259149.78396.YahooMailNeo at web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326259149.78396.YahooMailNeo at web30508.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> My interest
> in
> traveling to Africa lies in the idea that the Bwiti people are the 
> ones who have been practicing this shamanic tradition for thousands of 
> years. I believe this makes them the most qualified to administer the 
> iboga, guide the experience, and interpret certain visions therein. 
> Perhaps this is what the Beatles were seeking in India as well?
>
> I know that this intuition is very strong, and I feel it is important 
> to heed : )
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 5:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Looking for an iboga outfit in Gabon
>
> Good and Valid points Jim.
>
> Wishing you well Ted.
>
> ___________________
> Edward
> edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/10/2012 5:05 PM, Jim Hadey3 wrote:
> > Hi Ted,
> >
> > Do you think that Ibo is going to do more for ya because you consume 
> it in Africa rather than the USA??? I mean no disrespect for if you 
> want to go and feel that it will help by all means go but the answer 
> may lie in you and the Ibo brings it out so ya can deal with it.? Kind 
> of reminds me of the time when the Beatles went to India to meditate 
> with some yoga guy.? I mean why did they have to go to India couldn't 
> they meditate in England??? Anyway, I hope you find what your looking 
> for if so please drop us a line and let us know.
> >
> > Wishing you the best,
> >
> >?? - JIM
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 11:49 AM, Ted <bigbadbula at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:bigbadbula at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >? ?? Thanks everyone for supporting this list : )
> >
> >? ?? I am looking for recommendations for outfits for westerners in
> >? ?? Gabon, or possibly Camaroon. I am a 32 year old male and not an
> >? ?? addict, aside from a slightly unhealthy relationship with
> >? ?? cannabis. I am seeking visionary/spiritual insight, as well as to
> >? ?? address some inner emotional/psychic damage. I would like to
> >? ?? experience this with the Bwiti. I have heard of organizations that
> >? ?? will host travelers and staff doctors trained in western medicine
> >? ?? in addition to working with the local shamans.
> >
> >? ?? Can anyone recommend such a program, or perhaps point me in the
> >? ?? right direction? Any advice will be
> welcomed and? greatly appreciated.
> >
> >?
> ?? Thanks,
> >? ?? Ted
> >
> >
> >? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 20
> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 23:51:22 +0000 (GMT)
> From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326239482.78711.YahooMailNeo at web132503.mail.ird.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326239482.78711.YahooMailNeo at web132503.mail.ird.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count while
> your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any
> difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am
> wondering whats the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a 
> EKG or whatever test knowing it could have influenced the tests for the
> better if I wasnt on opiates, so if anybody can advise I would
> appreaciate it.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 15:02
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
>
>
> i came off of 2mg sub with no problems... 23mg/k flood and a booster 
> at 3 months... worked fine...
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 11:53 PM, Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
>
> @junkboy how long were you on sub for? did you be far away from sub 
> prior to Ibogaine/Iboga? if folks are getting withdrawals even from a 
> short acting opiate such as MScontin/Zamorph even by being clean for 
> 24 hours post-Iboga-Ibogaine then how is one going to cope from sub 
> (which is a long acting opiate) duting Iboga trip and after?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________
> > From: junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine
> List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 2:44
> >
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> >
> >i got down to 2mg a day of sub and one flood with a booster at 3 
> months did it for me.
> >
> >
> >On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 6:56 PM, star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >well, he was on 8 mg for two years, then he got off two weeks and did 
> ibogaine hcl flood... he was good for 5 months but relapsed when his 
> older?left his sub out when he was living here, After he relapsed he 
> was taking about 4 mg a day for a couple months, maybe 3 and?did 
> another flood, he has been clean for about 6 months.? He works out a 
> lot and completely changed his diet. His older brother who is still
> on?sub
> like you has?been taking it ?about 6 years of 6-8 mg daily, YUK, he 
> wants to get off but he is working full-time and has big payments.? 
> HONESTLY,? i think someone else can probably answer this question 
> better.? I am thinking he is going to have to go to?short acting 
> opiate for aT LEAST ONE MONTH.? I am not familiar with zamorph, or 
> gapacetine.? So?you are on 1 mg of sub??? is that right, how long??? 
> Did you have trouble cutting down,??my son's both tried cutting down 
> and just could not do it??? Anyway someone else may have
> more information for you!!? Good Luck!!
> >>?
> >>peace,? Star
> >>?
> >>
> >>
> >>________________________________
> >>Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 09:45:53 +0000
> >>From: donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >>
> >>To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >>
> >>Hi Star, I've been on sub for 6 years and counting, would that make 
> a difference? I think it will but would 2 weeks being off sub prior to 
> Ibogaine make any major difference?? I have valium and zamorph, also 
> codeine too. I also have Gapacentine dont know if that works similar 
> to Lyrica.. Am already on 0.5/1mg of sub..
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>How long was your son on sub?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>________________________________
> >> From: star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>
> >>To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>Sent: Monday, 2 January 2012,
> 4:02
> >>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >>
> >>try to get down to 2 to 3 mg sub daily....for at least a month 
> before you go on short acting opiates like vicoprophen and valium 
> helps loads not a lot of valium though maybe 10 mg when?in worst 
> withdrawal from sub? which would maybe be on day 3 to 6.? Get off the 
> valium at least 3 days before treatment.? Also Lyrica helps with nerve 
> pain? for a day or two only during worse withdrawals from sub.? My 
> understanding is that you?should be off sub for AT LEAST two weeks 
> before doing the flood but of course more time?would be 
> better....?this worked for?my son. ALSO Benadryl blocks all nausea, it 
> is amazing as I?did a couple floods to reduce hcv viral load and 
> nothing worked for nausea but BENADRYL, I could not believe it, it was 
> a miracle, only 25 mg for 125 lbs, so may need two if heavier... it 
> blocks some receptors in stomach that prevents nausea.....
> anyway, you gotta be off the sub at a minimum of two weeks but how 
> long have you been on sub????
> >>?
> >>Good luck,? Star
> >>
> >>
> >>________________________________
> >>Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 14:58:22 -0700
> >>From: junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>
> >>To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >>sub is nasty... id switch to something, anything else, for as long 
> as possible. a month plus!!!
> >>
> >>
> >>On Fri, Dec 30, 2011 at 7:35 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> >>
> >>Hello!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I wish to
> ask
> couple of questios on Mindvox regarding Ibogaine and 
> Subutex/Suboxone/Buprenorphine. Am pretty new to the Ibogaine/Ibogs 
> scene and do not know how to go about posting on Mindvox..
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I wish to ask all memebers what is the standard protocol of 
> Iboga/Ibogaine in order to detox from Subutex.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I have been taking Subutex for 6 years and am on 0.5 currently. I 
> wish to use Ibogaine but do not know how to go about it. I have 
> morphine time release (Zomorph or MScontin) and was wondering if I can 
> use that to step off from Subutex prior to Ibogaine/Iboga.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Are there any people here who have detoxed from sub using Ibogaine? 
> if so how did it go for you..Did you still get withdrawals or these 
> PAWS afterwards? what is the best way on going about detoxing from sub 
> using Iboga..I've been told it's difficult with
> even
> with Ibogaine so I iwish to read peoples experiences and opinions 
> about this.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Thank you.
> >>>
> >>>D.
> >>>
> >>>?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 21
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 01:41:32 +0000 (GMT)
> From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326246092.61410.YahooMailNeo at web132501.mail.ird.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326246092.61410.YahooMailNeo at web132501.mail.ird.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Not even another
> opiate
> like morphine?
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Sent: Wednesday, 11 January 2012, 1:07
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
>
>
> you can get both the EKG and all blood test.? The sub should not 
> affect any of it.
>
>
>
> From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:50 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full
> Blood-Count while your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it 
> make any difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga 
> treatment, so am wondering whats the best way to go about this...I 
> don't want to do a EKG or whatever test knowing it could have 
> influenced the tests for the better if I wasnt on opiates, so if 
> anybody can advise I would appreaciate it.
> >
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
> >From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk 
> <mailto:gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Friday, 6 January 2012, 16:15
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >It took away 100% of my acute wd's .. for maybe 24-36 hours.. I was 
> in full wd before i took it and an hour i was fine.. (just tripping
> :)
> after that they slowly crept back in but by taking the TA and RB I had 
> left It was controllable to probabyl 80-90% of how bad it would have 
> been without.. just sneezing and lethargic.. nothing compared with 
> coming off 60mg methadone cold..
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On 6 January 2012 16:10, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >i found that with sub there was a point that i couldnt go any 
> lower... my point was 2mg.. i COULNT go lower... panic would set in 
> and i would do anything to get my drugs.. anway, if you want ibogaine 
> to do 95% of the work or not do it at all, it doesnt sound like you 
> dont want to get clean to begin with.. hell i would of been happy with 
> any relief... let alone 95%.. its more like 80% of symptoms.. it takes 
> a raging flu and changes it to a bad cold...
> >>it sounds like you may need more time using before
> your ready
> to quit.. hopefully by then you havent ruined your life... best of wishes
> >>junkboy
> >>
> >>
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> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 22
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:17:01 +1100
> From: "Andrew" <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>>
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Medication
> Message-ID: <BAY167-DS24959702F02361C78364DAFE9E0 at phx.gbl 
> <mailto:BAY167-DS24959702F02361C78364DAFE9E0 at phx.gbl>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Agreed, wean is the word especially with meds that have anticonvulsant 
> properties.
> This is why cold turkey for Benzo's and the like are NOT 
> recommended,one could end up in a wooden box pronto.
> You need to let your brain chemistry slowly fight back for normal 
> function even if this means going through bouts of pins and 
> needles,cold extremeties,flu like symptoms,spasms....it's your 
> body/brain repairing.
> Something I have been dealing with for a long
> time,it's
> rough but must be done.
> So take it slow for the better outcome.The end result is more 
> important junkboy64,wishing you well.
>
> Andrew...
>
>
> From: sister
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 9:12 PM
> To: The Ibogaine List
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Medication
>
>
> A slower wean should help ... I would not have it in the system.
>
> Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
>
> On Jan 9, 2012, at 10:19 PM, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>
> ? taper any anti depressants so you dont get those effects.
>
>
> ? On Mon, Jan 9, 2012 at 7:39 PM, Chris Mallin <cmallin20 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cmallin20 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> ? ? Hello All,
>
> ? ? Good evening!
>
> ? ? Quick question.
>
> ? ? If someone is
> talking Lamictal (lamotrigine),
> but not for seizures or bipolar but rather for an attention/cognitive 
> issue, does he have to stop talking the Lamictal before the Ibogaine 
> treatment?
>
> ? ? In this case, whenever he stops, he gets these side effects from 
> stopping, such as pins and needles, etc., which make it very 
> uncomfortable. So would he need to stop it weeks before the Ibogaine 
> (I mean, will the Lamictal hurt the Ibogaine treatment and make it 
> less effective), or can he stay on the Lamictal until the Ibogaine 
> treatment (or maybe stop it just days or only one week before)?
>
> ? ? As always, thank you to all who are considerate enough to respond!
>
> ? ? Chris
>
>
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>
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>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 23
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 12:28:21 +1100
> From: David Ray <trees.and.rain at gmail.com 
> <mailto:trees.and.rain at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAD_M9k2fYAYzPMqdKVd304AXVFX0d54XTwRaZUBGcebqRfR56w at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CAD_M9k2fYAYzPMqdKVd304AXVFX0d54XTwRaZUBGcebqRfR56w at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Opiates will not effect these tests in a major way.? In any case, you
> want to test the state of your current
> health, as you are when taking
> the ibo, not the way you might be after you do the ibo. If you're an
> athlete and you want to know your chance of winning a race, you test
> your fitness just before the race, not how you might be in 6 months of
> more training. Test as close to the time as possible, but a few weeks
> or even months shouldn't make much difference as long as nothing
> drastic happens in between. Again, a good provider who can deal with
> any problems, small or large, can make all the difference.? In the
> experimental past roughly one person in 300 has died on ibogaine. That
> was before the testing regime was developed.? If your heart tests okay
> that massively reduces the risk as most who died had heart problems.
> Of the other deaths most had taken other drugs at the same
> time as the
> ibogaine (I don't mean the day before, which is the accepted safety
> point.? If you're just beginning to feel withdrawals, that's
> when you
> take the ibo so that it takes over from the opiate, doesn't combine
> with it in a major way.)? A good provider can make the risk tiny and
> the likelihood of success very good.
>
> On 11/01/2012, Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> > Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count 
> while
> > your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any 
> difference? I
> > am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am wondering 
> whats the
> > best way to go about this...I don't want to do a EKG or whatever test
> > knowing it could have influenced the tests for the better if I wasnt on
> > opiates, so if anybody can advise I
> would appreaciate it.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >? From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk 
> <mailto:gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>>
> > To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> > Sent: Friday, 6 January 2012, 16:15
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> > It took away 100% of my acute wd's .. for maybe 24-36 hours.. I was 
> in full
> > wd before i took it and an hour i was fine.. (just tripping :) after 
> that
> > they slowly crept back in but by taking the TA and RB I had left It was
> > controllable to probabyl 80-90% of how bad it would have been 
> without.. just
> > sneezing and lethargic.. nothing compared with coming off 60mg methadone
> >
> cold..
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 6 January 2012 16:10, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > i found that with sub there was a point that i couldnt go any 
> lower... my
> > point was 2mg.. i COULNT go lower... panic would set in and i would do
> > anything to get my drugs.. anway, if you want ibogaine to do 95% of 
> the work
> > or not do it at all, it doesnt sound like you dont want to get clean to
> > begin with.. hell i would of been happy with any relief... let alone 
> 95%..
> > its more like 80% of symptoms.. it takes a raging flu and changes it 
> to a
> > bad cold...
> >>it sounds like you may need more time using before your ready to quit..
> >> hopefully by then you havent ruined your life... best of wishes
> >>junkboy
> >>
> >>
> >>?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List
> Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>(][%] ?:: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine :: ?[%][)
> >>?-=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 24
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 05:40:02 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re:
> [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326289202.35277.YahooMailNeo at web84006.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326289202.35277.YahooMailNeo at web84006.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Not even morphine....?
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 8:41 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >Not even another opiate like morphine?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >________________________________
> >From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Wednesday, 11 January 2012, 1:07
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >
> >
> >you can get both the EKG and all blood test.? The sub should not 
> affect any of it.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>________________________________
> >>From: Donny Drake <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>
> >>To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >>Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 6:50 PM
> >>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >>
> >>
> >>Can you take a EKG test, with
> a liver function and full
> Blood-Count while your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it 
> make any difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga 
> treatment, so am wondering whats the best way to go about this...I 
> don't want to do a EKG or whatever test knowing it could have 
> influenced the tests for the better if I wasnt on opiates, so if 
> anybody can advise I would appreaciate it.
> >>
> >>
> >>Thanks.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>________________________________
> >>From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk 
> <mailto:gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>>
> >>To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >>Sent: Friday, 6 January 2012, 16:15
> >>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] MS Contin
> >>
> >>
> >>It took
> away 100% of my acute
> wd's .. for maybe 24-36 hours.. I was in full wd before i took it and 
> an hour i was fine.. (just tripping :) after that they slowly crept 
> back in but by taking the TA and RB I had left It was controllable to 
> probabyl 80-90% of how bad it would have been without.. just sneezing 
> and lethargic.. nothing compared with coming off 60mg methadone cold..
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>On 6 January 2012 16:10, junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>
> >>i found that with sub there was a point that i couldnt go any 
> lower... my point was 2mg.. i COULNT go lower... panic would set in 
> and i would do anything to get my drugs.. anway, if you want ibogaine 
> to do 95% of the work or not do it at all, it doesnt sound like you 
> dont want to get clean to begin with.. hell i would of been happy with 
> any relief... let alone 95%..
> its more like 80%
> of symptoms.. it takes a raging flu and changes it to a bad cold...
> >>>it sounds like you may need more time using before your ready to 
> quit.. hopefully by then you havent ruined your life... best of wishes
> >>>junkboy
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>?-=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>>(][%] ?:: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine :: ?[%][)
> >>>?-=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>(][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>(][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 25
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 05:47:44 -0800
> From: Megan Simm <megansimm90 at gmail.com <mailto:megansimm90 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAP_87nT7k4oXzhT6G6N7axWC0BhecrNCTPMmYWhrCePxhcLnKg at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CAP_87nT7k4oXzhT6G6N7axWC0BhecrNCTPMmYWhrCePxhcLnKg at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I sent a reply to donny yesterday and im not sure if it went through.
> Opiates subs and methadone wont affect your ekg and other lab results so
> dont worry about it ;)
> On Jan 11, 2012 4:17 AM, "Donny Drake" <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
>
> > Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count 
> while
> > your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any 
> difference? I
> > am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am wondering whats
> > the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a EKG or whatever 
> test
> > knowing it could have influenced the tests for the better if I
> wasnt
> on
> > opiates, so if anybody can advise I would appreaciate it.
> >
> >? Thanks.
> >
> >?? ------------------------------
> > *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 15:02
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> > i came off of 2mg sub with no problems... 23mg/k flood and a booster 
> at 3
> > months... worked fine...
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 11:53 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >
> > @junkboy how long were you on sub for? did you be far away from sub 
> prior
> > to
> Ibogaine/Iboga? if folks are getting withdrawals even from a short
> > acting opiate such as MScontin/Zamorph even by being clean for 24 hours
> > post-Iboga-Ibogaine then how is one going to cope from sub (which is 
> a long
> > acting opiate) duting Iboga trip and after?
> >
> >?? ------------------------------
> > *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 2:44
> >
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> > i got down to 2mg a day of sub and one flood with a booster at 3 months
> > did it for me.
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 6:56 PM, star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>wrote:
> >
> >? well, he was on 8 mg for two years, then he got off two weeks and did
> > ibogaine hcl flood... he was good for 5 months but relapsed when his
> > older left his sub out when he was living here, After he relapsed he was
> > taking about 4 mg a day for a couple months, maybe 3 and did another 
> flood,
> > he has been clean for about 6 months.? He works out a lot and completely
> > changed his diet. His older brother who is still on sub like you has 
> been
> > taking it? about 6 years of 6-8 mg daily, YUK, he wants to get off 
> but he
> > is working full-time and has big payments.? HONESTLY,? i think 
> someone else
> > can probably answer this question better.? I am thinking he is going to
> > have to go to short acting opiate for aT LEAST ONE MONTH.? I am not
> > familiar with zamorph, or
> gapacetine.? So you are on 1 mg of
> sub??? is that
> > right, how long??? Did you have trouble cutting down,? my son's both 
> tried
> > cutting down and just could not do it??? Anyway someone else may 
> have more
> > information for you!!? Good Luck!!
> >
> > peace,? Star
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 09:45:53 +0000
> > From: donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >
> > To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> > Hi Star, I've been on sub for 6 years and counting, would that make a
> > difference? I think it will but would 2 weeks being off sub prior to
> > Ibogaine make any major difference?? I have valium and zamorph,
> also
> > codeine too. I also have Gapacentine dont know if that works
> similar to
> > Lyrica.. Am already on 0.5/1mg of sub..
> >
> > How long was your son on sub?
> >
> >?? ------------------------------
> > *From:* star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>
> > *To:* ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> > *Sent:* Monday, 2 January 2012, 4:02
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> >? try to get down to 2 to 3 mg sub daily....for at least a month 
> before you
> > go on short acting opiates like vicoprophen and valium helps loads not a
> > lot of valium though maybe 10 mg when in worst withdrawal from sub? 
> which
> > would maybe be on day 3 to 6.? Get off the valium at least 3 days before
> >
> treatment.? Also Lyrica helps with nerve pain? for a day or two only 
> during
> > worse
> withdrawals from sub.? My understanding is that you should be off sub
> > for AT LEAST two weeks before doing the flood but of course more 
> time would
> > be better.... this worked for my son. ALSO Benadryl blocks all 
> nausea, it
> > is amazing as I did a couple floods to reduce hcv viral load and nothing
> > worked for nausea but BENADRYL, I could not believe it, it was a 
> miracle,
> > only 25 mg for 125 lbs, so may need two if heavier... it blocks some
> > receptors in stomach that prevents nausea..... anyway, you gotta be 
> off the
> > sub at a minimum of two weeks but how long have you been on sub????
> >
> > Good luck,? Star
> > ------------------------------
> > Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 14:58:22 -0700
> > From: junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>
> > To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >
> > sub is nasty... id switch to something, anything else, for as long as
> > possible. a month plus!!!
> >
> > On Fri, Dec 30, 2011 at 7:35 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >
> >? Hello!
> >
> > I wish to ask couple of questios on Mindvox regarding Ibogaine and
> > Subutex/Suboxone/Buprenorphine. Am pretty new to the Ibogaine/Ibogs 
> scene
> > and do not know how to go about posting on Mindvox..
> >
> > I wish to ask all memebers what is the standard protocol of 
> Iboga/Ibogaine
> > in order to detox from Subutex.
> >
> > I have been taking
> Subutex for 6 years and am on 0.5 currently. I wish to
> > use Ibogaine but do not know how to go about it. I have
> morphine time
> > release (Zomorph or MScontin) and was wondering if I can use that to 
> step
> > off from Subutex prior to Ibogaine/Iboga.
> >
> > Are there any people here who have detoxed from sub using Ibogaine? 
> if so
> > how did it go for you..Did you still get withdrawals or these PAWS
> > afterwards? what is the best way on going about detoxing from sub using
> > Iboga..I've been told it's difficult with even with Ibogaine so I 
> iwish to
> > read peoples experiences and opinions about this.
> >
> > Thank you.
> >
> > D.
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
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> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 26
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 05:50:39
> -0800
> From: Megan Simm <megansimm90 at gmail.com <mailto:megansimm90 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAP_87nSrx94DLiDu3Y+rKAX9u32Seq9TKb6LwpS5xdftpded-w at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:rKAX9u32Seq9TKb6LwpS5xdftpded-w at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Also good luck with things.
> You are in my thoughts. Im very excited for you
> :)
> On Jan 11, 2012 5:47 AM, "Megan Simm" <megansimm90 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:megansimm90 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > I sent a reply to donny yesterday and im not sure if it went through.
> > Opiates subs and
> methadone wont affect your ekg and other lab results so
> > dont worry about it ;)
> > On Jan 11, 2012 4:17 AM, "Donny Drake" <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> >
> >> Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count 
> while
> >> your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any 
> difference? I
> >> am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am wondering 
> whats
> >> the best way to go about this...I don't want to do a EKG or 
> whatever test
> >> knowing it could
> have influenced the tests for the better if I wasnt on
> >> opiates, so if anybody can advise I would appreaciate it.
> >>
> >>? Thanks.
> >>
> >>?? ------------------------------
> >> *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 15:02
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >> i came off of 2mg sub with no problems... 23mg/k flood and a 
> booster at 3
> >> months... worked fine...
> >>
> >>
> >> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 11:53 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >>
> >> @junkboy how long were you on sub for? did you be far away from sub 
> prior
> >> to Ibogaine/Iboga? if folks are getting withdrawals even from a short
> >> acting opiate such as MScontin/Zamorph even by being clean for 24 hours
> >> post-Iboga-Ibogaine
> then how is one going to cope from sub (which is a long
> >> acting opiate) duting Iboga trip and after?
> >>
> >>?? ------------------------------
> >> *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 2:44
> >>
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex &
> Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >> i got down to 2mg a day of sub and one flood with a booster at 3 months
> >> did it for me.
> >>
> >> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 6:56 PM, star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>wrote:
> >>
> >>? well, he was on 8 mg for two years,
> then he got off two weeks and did
> >> ibogaine hcl flood... he was good for 5 months but relapsed when his
> >> older left his sub out when he was living here, After he relapsed 
> he was
> >> taking about 4 mg a day for a couple months, maybe 3 and did 
> another flood,
> >> he has been clean for about 6 months.? He works out a lot and 
> completely
> >> changed his diet. His older brother who is still on sub like you 
> has been
> >> taking it? about 6 years of 6-8 mg daily, YUK, he wants to get off 
> but he
> >>
> is working full-time and has big payments.? HONESTLY,? i think someone 
> else
> >> can probably answer this question better.? I am thinking he is going to
> >> have to go to short acting opiate for aT LEAST ONE MONTH.? I am not
> >> familiar with zamorph, or gapacetine.? So you are on 1 mg of sub??? 
> is that
> >> right, how long??? Did you have trouble cutting down,? my son's
> both tried
> >> cutting down and just could not do it??? Anyway someone else may 
> have more
> >> information for you!!? Good Luck!!
> >>
> >> peace,? Star
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >> Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 09:45:53 +0000
> >> From: donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >>
> >> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >> Hi Star, I've been on sub for 6 years and counting, would that make a
> >> difference? I think it will but would 2 weeks being off sub prior to
> >> Ibogaine make any major difference?? I have valium and zamorph, also
> >> codeine too. I also have Gapacentine dont know if that works similar to
> >>
> Lyrica.. Am already on 0.5/1mg of sub..
> >>
> >> How long was your son on sub?
> >>
> >>?? ------------------------------
> >> *From:* star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>
> >> *To:* ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >> *Sent:* Monday, 2 January 2012,
> 4:02
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >>? try to get down to 2 to 3 mg sub daily....for at least a month before
> >> you go on short acting opiates like vicoprophen and valium helps 
> loads not
> >> a lot of valium though maybe 10 mg when in worst withdrawal from 
> sub? which
> >> would maybe be on day 3 to 6.? Get off the valium at least 3 days 
> before
> >> treatment.? Also Lyrica helps with nerve pain? for a
> day or two only during
> >> worse withdrawals from sub.? My understanding is that you should be 
> off sub
> >> for AT LEAST two weeks before doing the flood but of course more 
> time would
> >> be better.... this worked for my son. ALSO Benadryl blocks all 
> nausea, it
> >> is amazing as I did a couple floods to reduce hcv viral load and 
> nothing
> >> worked for nausea but BENADRYL, I could not believe it, it was
> a miracle,
> >> only 25 mg for 125 lbs, so may need two if heavier... it blocks some
> >> receptors in stomach that prevents nausea..... anyway, you gotta be 
> off the
> >> sub at a minimum of two weeks but how long have you been on sub????
> >>
> >> Good luck,? Star
> >> ------------------------------
> >> Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 14:58:22 -0700
> >> From: junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>
> >> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>
> >> sub is nasty... id switch to something, anything else, for as long as
> >> possible. a month plus!!!
> >>
> >> On Fri, Dec 30, 2011 at 7:35 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >>
> >>? Hello!
> >>
> >> I wish to ask couple of questios on Mindvox regarding Ibogaine and
> >> Subutex/Suboxone/Buprenorphine. Am pretty new to the Ibogaine/Ibogs 
> scene
> >> and do not know how to go about posting on Mindvox..
> >>
> >> I wish to ask all memebers what is the standard protocol of
> >> Iboga/Ibogaine in order to
> detox from Subutex.
> >>
> >> I have been taking Subutex for 6 years and am on 0.5 currently. I 
> wish to
> >> use Ibogaine but do not know how to go about it. I have morphine time
> >> release (Zomorph or MScontin) and was wondering if I can use that 
> to step
> >> off from Subutex prior to Ibogaine/Iboga.
> >>
> >> Are there any people here who have detoxed from sub using Ibogaine? 
> if so
> >> how did it go for you..Did you still
> get withdrawals or these PAWS
> >> afterwards? what is the best way on going about detoxing from sub using
> >> Iboga..I've been told it's difficult with even with Ibogaine so I 
> iwish to
> >> read peoples experiences and opinions about this.
> >>
> >> Thank you.
> >>
> >> D.
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 27
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 16:37:20 -0700
> From: jeff goldstein <turftut at gmail.com <mailto:turftut at gmail.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] benzodiazepines
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAA_Z+cWZKf=D9vyxUox3RqXX5m65RkyeJFmrkEuHs8Om_Fjxow at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:D9vyxUox3RqXX5m65RkyeJFmrkEuHs8Om_Fjxow at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> hello ibocommuninity.Any recent information re ibogaine's efficacy in
> treating benzodiazepine dependence?
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 28
> Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 19:04:36 -0500
> From: Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] benzodiazepines
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAAxLk=S5TAAsRCBvKace=Qzk3pYEwuwzpxdPdSU89UPouKtxyQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:Qzk3pYEwuwzpxdPdSU89UPouKtxyQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I got off
> benzos after doing ibogaine. It was gradual but the Ibogaine
> calmed my nervous system down. I also used the recommendations in the book
> _The Mood Cure_.
>
> On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 6:37 PM, jeff goldstein <turftut at gmail.com 
> <mailto:turftut at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > hello ibocommuninity.Any recent information re ibogaine's efficacy in
> > treating benzodiazepine dependence?
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 29
> Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 08:02:27 -0500
> From: Jim Hadey3 <jimhadey3 at gmail.com <mailto:jimhadey3 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> Message-ID:
> ???
> <CAEoZqz0TE04up9a1FEP8TRBcUkCT+Ju2eWJJxsT3q1bPd7X-HQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:Ju2eWJJxsT3q1bPd7X-HQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> Just so ya know vicoprophen is a Very
> expensive way to get hydrocodone, it
> is much cheaper than to buy Lortab.? I had to take it once for I was over
> the limit on my Tylenol which should not exceed 4 grams per day.
>
> Best,
>
> ? - JIM
>
> On Wed, Jan 11, 2012 at 8:50 AM, Megan Simm <megansimm90 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:megansimm90 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > Also good luck with things. You are in my thoughts. Im very excited for
> > you :)
> > On Jan 11, 2012 5:47 AM, "Megan Simm" <megansimm90 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:megansimm90 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >>
> I sent a reply to donny yesterday and im not sure if it went through.
> >> Opiates subs and methadone wont affect your ekg and other lab 
> results so
> >> dont worry about it ;)
> >> On Jan 11, 2012 4:17 AM, "Donny Drake" <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk 
> <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Can you take a EKG test, with a liver function and full Blood-Count
> >>> while your on Subutex? or any other opiates? or doesn't it make any
> >>> difference? I am told I need these tests before Iboga treatment, so am
> >>> wondering whats the best way to go about this...I don't want to do 
> a EKG or
> >>> whatever test knowing it could have influenced the tests for the 
> better if
> >>> I wasnt on opiates, so if anybody can advise I would appreaciate it.
> >>>
> >>>?
> Thanks.
> >>>
> >>>?? ------------------------------
> >>> *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 15:02
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>>
> >>> i came off of 2mg sub with no problems... 23mg/k flood and a 
> booster at
> >>> 3 months... worked fine...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 11:53 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >>>
> >>> @junkboy how long were you on sub for? did you be far away from
> sub
> >>> prior to Ibogaine/Iboga? if folks are getting withdrawals even 
> from a short
> >>> acting opiate such as MScontin/Zamorph even by being clean for 24 
> hours
> >>> post-Iboga-Ibogaine then how is one going to cope from sub (which 
> is a long
> >>> acting opiate)
> duting Iboga trip and after?
> >>>
> >>>?? ------------------------------
> >>> *From:* junkboy <junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>>
> >>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 4 January 2012, 2:44
> >>>
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>>
> >>> i got down to 2mg a day of sub and one flood with a booster at 3 
> months
> >>> did it
> for me.
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 6:56 PM, star ray 
> <earthshealing at hotmail.com <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>wrote:
> >>>
> >>>? well, he was on 8 mg for two years, then he got off two weeks
> and did
> >>> ibogaine hcl flood... he was good for 5 months but relapsed when his
> >>> older left his sub out when he was living here, After he relapsed 
> he was
> >>> taking about 4 mg a day for a couple months, maybe 3 and did 
> another flood,
> >>> he has been clean for about 6 months.? He works out a lot and 
> completely
> >>> changed his diet. His older brother who is still on sub like you 
> has been
> >>> taking it? about 6 years of 6-8 mg daily, YUK, he wants to get off 
> but he
> >>> is working full-time and has big payments.? HONESTLY,? i think 
> someone else
> >>> can
> probably answer this question better.? I am thinking he is going to
> >>> have to go to short acting opiate for aT LEAST ONE MONTH.? I am not
> >>> familiar with zamorph, or gapacetine.? So you are on 1 mg of 
> sub??? is that
> >>> right, how
> long??? Did you have trouble cutting down,? my son's both tried
> >>> cutting down and just could not do it??? Anyway someone else may 
> have more
> >>> information for you!!? Good Luck!!
> >>>
> >>> peace,? Star
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>> Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2012 09:45:53 +0000
> >>> From: donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >>>
> >>> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex &
> Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>>
> >>> Hi Star, I've been on sub for 6 years and counting, would that make a
> >>> difference? I think it will but would 2 weeks being off sub prior to
> >>> Ibogaine make any major
> difference?? I have valium and zamorph, also
> >>> codeine too. I also have Gapacentine dont know if that works 
> similar to
> >>> Lyrica.. Am already on 0.5/1mg of sub..
> >>>
> >>> How long was your son on sub?
> >>>
> >>>?? ------------------------------
> >>> *From:* star ray <earthshealing at hotmail.com 
> <mailto:earthshealing at hotmail.com>>
> >>> *To:* ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>> *Sent:* Monday, 2 January 2012, 4:02
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex &
> Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>>
> >>>? try to get down to 2 to 3 mg sub daily....for at least a month before
> >>> you go on short acting opiates like vicoprophen and valium helps 
> loads not
> >>> a lot of valium though
> maybe 10 mg when in worst withdrawal from sub? which
> >>> would maybe be on day 3 to 6.? Get off the valium at least 3 days 
> before
> >>> treatment.? Also Lyrica helps with nerve pain? for a day or two 
> only during
> >>> worse withdrawals from sub.? My understanding is that you should 
> be off sub
> >>> for AT LEAST two weeks before doing the flood but of course more 
> time would
> >>> be better.... this worked for my son. ALSO Benadryl blocks all 
> nausea, it
> >>> is amazing as I did a couple floods to reduce hcv viral load and 
> nothing
> >>> worked for nausea but BENADRYL, I could not believe it, it was a 
> miracle,
> >>> only 25 mg
> for 125 lbs, so may need two if heavier... it blocks some
> >>> receptors in stomach that prevents nausea..... anyway, you gotta 
> be off the
> >>> sub at a minimum of two weeks but how long have you been on
> sub????
> >>>
> >>> Good luck,? Star
> >>> ------------------------------
> >>> Date: Sat, 31 Dec 2011 14:58:22 -0700
> >>> From: junkboy64 at gmail.com <mailto:junkboy64 at gmail.com>
> >>> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Subutex & Iboga/Ibogaine
> >>>
> >>> sub is nasty... id switch to something, anything else, for as long as
> >>> possible. a month plus!!!
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Dec 30, 2011 at 7:35 PM, Donny Drake 
> <donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk <mailto:donnydrake18 at yahoo.co.uk>>wrote:
> >>>
> >>>? Hello!
> >>>
> >>> I wish to ask couple of questios on Mindvox regarding Ibogaine
> and
> >>> Subutex/Suboxone/Buprenorphine. Am pretty new to the 
> Ibogaine/Ibogs scene
> >>> and do not know how to go about posting on Mindvox..
> >>>
> >>> I wish to ask all memebers what is the standard protocol of
> >>> Iboga/Ibogaine in order to detox from Subutex.
> >>>
> >>> I have been taking Subutex for 6 years and am on 0.5 currently. I wish
> >>> to use Ibogaine but do not know how to go about it. I have 
> morphine time
> >>> release (Zomorph or MScontin) and was wondering if I can use that 
> to step
> >>> off from Subutex prior to Ibogaine/Iboga.
> >>>
> >>> Are there any people here who have detoxed from sub using
> Ibogaine? if
> >>> so how did it go for you..Did you still get withdrawals or these PAWS
> >>> afterwards? what is the best way on going about detoxing from sub 
> using
> >>> Iboga..I've been
> told it's difficult with even with Ibogaine so I iwish to
> >>> read peoples experiences and opinions about this.
> >>>
> >>> Thank you.
> >>>
> >>> D.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=- (][%] ::
> >>> http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine :: [%][) -=[) :::: Change
> >>> Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=- (][%] ::
> >>> http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine :: [%][) -=[) :::: Change
> >>> Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>?
> -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 30
> Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 13:38:31 +1100
> From: "Andrew" <sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com <mailto:sanpedro.69 at hotmail.com>>
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] benzodiazepines
> Message-ID:
> <BAY167-DS132B17B357EF6A6687A7C9FE9F0 at phx.gbl 
> <mailto:BAY167-DS132B17B357EF6A6687A7C9FE9F0 at phx.gbl>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hello all, the only thing I really know with this issue is that Clare 
> Wilkins at Pangea Biomedics treats Benzo Dependencies as some might 
> know I am tapering still.Alas I'm in Aus but have been in 
> communication via Skype with Clare for around 3 years.She has helped 
> me tremendously and definitely treats people with Benzo issues.
> She herself was an addict to Xanny bars amongst other drugs.This is no 
> secret as you can find on her site and YouTube.
>
>
>
>
> From: jeff goldstein
> Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2012 10:37 AM
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] benzodiazepines
>
>
> hello ibocommuninity.Any recent
> information re ibogaine's efficacy in treating benzodiazepine dependence?
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message:
> 31
> Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 18:19:49 -0800
> From: Diboga SanFilippo <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAK7_Ajnwf9gHN+yLifqz-bW7ojbh5jssNbm5PgckwxUR09KKgA at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:yLifqz-bW7ojbh5jssNbm5PgckwxUR09KKgA at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment
> *...*<http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 32
> Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 21:28:17 -0500
> From: Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAAxLk=RqWHRUSvWN2gC02AJRS1nQ=ffZH-mC-GKVU=2rrgkWNw at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:2rrgkWNw at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a horrible
> experience on Mexico.
>
> On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga
> SanFilippo <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>wrote:
>
> > *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment 
> *...*<http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> > http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >
> >
> >? -=[)
> ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 33
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 08:32:48 +0100
> From: "Sara Glatt" <sara119 at xs4all.nl <mailto:sara119 at xs4all.nl>>
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? <501b96ef87da1a1bb6017e545976b555.squirrel at webmail.xs4all.nl 
> <mailto:501b96ef87da1a1bb6017e545976b555.squirrel at webmail.xs4all.nl>>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
> > *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment
> > 
> *...*<http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> > http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >
> >?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
>
>
> This is bullshit!? what is underground, when everybody knows? what is 
> unethical?
> most of the people who have died during the treatment died in a medical
> facility.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 34
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 09:46:22 +0200
> From: "Kevin Walker" <kevin at ibogainesa.co.za 
> <mailto:kevin at ibogainesa.co.za>>
> To: "'The Ibogaine List'" <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical "Underground" Ibogaine
> ??? Detox??? Treatment Centers
> Message-ID: <009601ccd1c7$71f069e0$55d13da0$@co.za>
> Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset="us-ascii"
>
> Sara,
>
> I don't think it is entire bullshit as you have claimed! I think on this
> very platform we have discussed this before, you claim that most 
> deaths have
> been those that have been done in clinic's. Yes death has occurred in
> clinic's and we all aware of them, as they are recorded deaths, what about
> all those
> that are unrecorded the underground, those done in the bush etc
> etc. I personally have heard of a treatment done in a motel and when 
> things
> got out of hand the so called provider just left the patient /client and
> disassociated themselves to the events
> around that.
> I think that there are many more deaths than those that have been 
> recorded,
> these have been over looked and or discounted due to a so called secondary
> event.
>
> Come on lets deal with the real world !
>
> Regards.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com> 
> [mailto:ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com>] On
> Behalf Of Sara Glatt
> Sent: 13 January 2012 09:33
> To: The Ibogaine List
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical "Underground" Ibogaine
> Detox
> Treatment Centers
>
> > *Transitions* | *Unethical* "Underground" Ibogaine Detox Treatment
> >
> *...*<http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%
> E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm
> _campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ib
> ogaine-detox-treatment-centers>
> > http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-"undergroun...
> >
> >?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >
>
>
> This is bullshit!? what is underground, when everybody knows? what is
> unethical?
> most of the people who have died during the treatment died in a
> medical
> facility.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 35
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 08:15:41 -0500
> From: sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment
> Centers
> Message-ID: <D247D77C-29D7-4FF0-B636-C11B86F2FF7D at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:D247D77C-29D7-4FF0-B636-C11B86F2FF7D at yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I 
> know the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been 
> helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the Medical 
> field?? So what happen that was terribly wrong??? Did he have a heart 
> attack, resp. problems?? what?? did he just feel lethargy or never 
> been thru wd before and has no idea what he did get?
>
> All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the 
> medical field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share what it 
> was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why post such a 
> negative article without anything of substance other then this guy is 
> not working with Solo?? For
> all I know Dr Solo wrote this himself
> and just angry that another client got by him without paying 7500 to 
> the doctor.
>
> I am not saying the Doctor does not have the right to charge whatever 
> he wants.? After all one does not go to medical school all those yrs 
> to make minimal wage.? But really... what went wrong, what happen,? 
> WHy did this guy need to go to the hospital?? IT says nothing but 
> slander in my eyes.
>
> I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be present 
> during the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that 
> someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better the 
> chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to Iboga 
> straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider about 
> pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to tell since so 
> little was told of WHAT happen.? So I think the article is crap.
>
> We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to
> your head to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to 
> this persons head saying " NO, you cant pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to a 
> Non medical, non MD."? If its important that a MD be present then pay 
> for it.? Your choice.
> Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard some 
> terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I have 
> heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and claiming that 
> Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have heard that there 
> are providers doing dope or addicted themselves as they provide after 
> care to clients or worse providing tx themselves.? BUt have I seen 
> this... NOPE.? I have even heard that there are providers out there 
> that sell body parts to the black market when addicts die.? THat one 
> really made me giggle.? I have been told by pass clients that there 
> are folks out there in the UG that are willing to treat three at
> once.... really, how can you watch three at
> once??
>
> I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the first 
> week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but because 
> they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction say it 
> didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began 30yrs prior.? 
> Some actually think they are gonna feel like they are in their 20s 
> when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope going from the couch 
> to chair for 30ys??? So again... what information did this article 
> give anyone other then Beau is not in the Medical field?? Most 
> providers I know are not in the Medical field.? I don't think Sarah is 
> a RN or LPN but I do believe she offers a safe and complete 
> treatment.? Not that I went there but so many have.? I have had 
> clients lie to me about their hx... not mentioning that they are on 
> Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time condition of seizures..fear it
> would knock them out of the treatment but then complain ......really
> folks, we are working with a group of folks that hon
> esty is something that has been lost.? I for one did not mention to 
> Rocky that I had MS in fear it would knock me out of the running.?
>
> It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask what 
> they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they may or 
> may not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose them but you 
> choose them because you feel safe, they know what they are doing, talk 
> to others they? have treated.? IF someone claims to be a RN, Lpn, 
> practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever google them, be sure they 
> actually have a Medical license, where they attended Collage.? So easy 
> to do.? Every one that has ever had or have a license it so easy to 
> find on the net.? IF its not there then I bet they don't have it and 
> never has had it.? I know
> that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my RN license 
> number out for them to look up on the net.? I went
> two yrs pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
>
> I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the medical 
> field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs 
> throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment 
> skills.? I have heard folks that went to one semester and claim to be 
> in the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those that are 
> providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even what a 
> resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there are "clinics" 
> that don't have a medical person with\in two miles of the clinic when 
> the actual treatment is taken place but claim to have MDs working for 
> the place.? The word CLinic does not mean what we are use to in the 
> good ole USA.? That word is use very
> loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.? For me.. 
> when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.? I 
> could of cared less that my
> providers had no medical background.? What I did expect was that my 
> provider not be addicted to dope themsel
> ves.? Provide me with the safest they were able.? I could of care less 
> if I died during the treatment, It would of been more humane then the 
> slow death I was experiencing at my own hand.? I paid for my after 
> care.? Sasha and Jessica were my aftercare providers and I was very 
> well taken care of.? Sasha really stepped up to the plate when it came 
> to food, Jessica was very in tune to my depression and gave me the 
> time I needed to voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more 
> then I felt it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... 
> I felt very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do 
> enough research.
>
> So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.? Ask 
> for numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to more then
> one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated me... 
> even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying "you get 
> what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the price for a 
> real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that I did walk away 
> knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I choose too.? I still 
> had a lot of work to do to help myself feel better.? I had severe 
> lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I had to do the work myself 
> to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not make me grow up overnight 
> either.? Another thing I had to work thru.
>
>
> So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for
> the cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix everything as 
> many of us addicts do.? As addicts, we blame others for our choices, 
> we want to take every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT want to 
> suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this because I am a 
> Addict and every
> addict I ever met has the same qualities.
> To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for the 
> cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.? For all I 
> know this person expected to feel how he did before his addiction 
> began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru CT or even a 
> slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope sick feels like.? 
> I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't know, never met nor 
> have I done any research on him.? Could be a person that had no 
> intention of getting clean but only wanted to lower his tolerance so 
> they could continue to dope on for
> less money.? I see the article as pure slander.
>
> Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
>
> On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last.
> I had a horrible experience on Mexico.
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo 
> <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment ...
> > http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-?undergroun...
> >
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 36
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 09:35:42 -0800
> From: cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CABg8pxD1M1tFCzCqVoFKOW_k-6nywmEfQwc56K6OJ_70MKzd_Q at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:CABg8pxD1M1tFCzCqVoFKOW_k-6nywmEfQwc56K6OJ_70MKzd_Q at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> If you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't authored
> by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from the patient's
> wife asking for advice. Why would you expect this clinic to know what went
> wrong at Transitions? And what in the post led you to believe the
> "patient"
> was looking for an inexpensive treatment? I believe Transitions charges
> $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem cheap. Why would you consider the
> post slanderous?
>
> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> > I had
> to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I know
> > the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been helpful.
> >? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the Medical field?? 
> So what
> > happen that was terribly wrong??? Did he have a heart attack, resp.
> > problems?? what?? did he just feel lethargy or never been thru wd before
> > and has no idea what he did get?
> >
> > All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the medical
> > field.? Something went wrong? but
> not willing to share what it was?? So
> > much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why post such a negative 
> article
> > without anything of substance other then this guy is not working 
> with Solo?
> >? For all I know Dr Solo wrote this himself and just angry that another
> > client got by him without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> >
> > I am not saying the Doctor does not have
> the right to charge whatever he
> > wants.? After all one does not go to medical school all those yrs to 
> make
> > minimal wage.? But really... what went wrong, what happen,? WHy did this
> > guy need to go to the hospital?? IT says nothing but slander in my eyes.
> >
> > I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be present during
> > the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that someone 
> is not
> > compensating well, the sooner one acts the better the chances for
> the
> > client.? For all I know this person came to Iboga straight from 
> Methadone
> > or suboxone, or lied to the provider about pass hx, lied about what 
> meds he
> > was on.? Just no way to tell since so little was told of WHAT 
> happen.? So I
> > think the article is crap.
> >
> > We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head to
> > participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> persons head
> > saying " NO, you cant pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to a Non medical, 
> non MD."
> >? If its important that a MD be present then pay for it.? Your choice.
> > Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard some
> > terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I have heard
> > that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and claiming that 
> Iboga will
> > take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have heard that
> there are providers
> > doing dope or addicted themselves as they provide after care to 
> clients or
> > worse providing tx themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I 
> have even
> > heard that there are providers out there that sell body parts to the 
> black
> > market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I have 
> been told
> > by pass clients that there are folks out there in the UG that are 
> willing
> > to treat three at once.... really, how can
> you watch three at once?
> >
> > I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the first 
> week
> > after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but because they 
> didn't
> > walk away feeling like they did pre addiction say it didn't work.? 
> Forget
> > the fact that the addiction began 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they
> > are gonna feel like they are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 
> 50yrs
> >
> of age doing dope going from the couch to chair for 30ys??? So again...
> > what information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not 
> in the
> > Medical field?? Most providers I know are not in the Medical field.? I
> > don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she offers a safe and
> > complete treatment.? Not that I went there but so many have.? I have had
> > clients lie to me about their hx... not mentioning that they are on
> > Tegrotal or dilantin for a
> life time condition of seizures..fear it would
> > knock them out of the treatment but then complain ......really folks, we
> > are working with a group of folks that honesty is something that has 
> been
> > lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it would
> > knock me out of the running.
> >
> > It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask what
> >
> they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they may or may
> > not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose them but you choose
> > them because you feel safe, they know what they are doing, talk to 
> others
> > they? have treated.? IF someone claims to be a RN, Lpn, 
> practitioner, MD,
> > mid wife or what ever google them, be sure they actually have a Medical
> > license, where they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one 
> that has
> > ever had or have a license it so easy to find on the
> net.? IF its not there
> > then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know that 
> anyone can
> > look up my credentials.? I have given my RN license number out for 
> them to
> > look up on the net.? I went two yrs pre medical... that did not make 
> me a
> > MD or even close to one.
> >
> > I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the
> medical field.? I
> > have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs throat, 
> Nurses that
> > miss the boat when it comes to any assessment skills.? I have heard 
> folks
> > that went to one semester and claim to be in the medical field.? ? I 
> have
> > read on this forum those that are providing and not know how to 
> treat a low
> > bld pressure or even what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also 
> know
> > that there are "clinics" that don't have a medical person with\in 
> two miles
> > of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but
> claim to have
> > MDs working for the place.? The word CLinic does not mean what we 
> are use
> > to in the good ole USA.? That word is use very loosely.? That word 
> does not
> > mean a medical environment.? For me.. when I went for my treatment I 
> could
> > of cared less if I saw a MD.? I could of cared less that my providers
> had
> > no medical background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> > addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me with the safest they were 
> able.? I
> > could of care less if I died during the treatment, It would of been more
> > humane then the slow death I was experiencing at my own hand.? I 
> paid for
> > my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were my aftercare providers and I was
> > very well taken care of.? Sasha really stepped up to the plate when 
> it came
> > to food, Jessica was very in tune to my depression and gave me the 
> time I
> > needed to voice it.? Rocky, Mary and
> Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> > it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt 
> very safe
> > during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't free.? It was 
> my own
> > fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do enough research.
> >
> > So to
> those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.? Ask for
> > numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to more then one.? I can
> > write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated me... even if I am
> > Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying "you get what you 
> pay for"
> > I find so true.? I feel I did pay the price for a real clinic, a MD 
> present
> > but even without all of that I did walk away knowing that I had a 
> chance to
> > remain clean, if I choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help
> > myself feel better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and 
> depression.
> >? I had to do the
> work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not make me
> > grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work thru.
> >
> >
> > So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for the
> >
> cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix everything as many 
> of us
> > addicts do.? As addicts, we blame others for our choices, we want to 
> take
> > every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT want to suffer emotional or
> > physical discomforts.? I know this because I am a Addict and every 
> addict I
> > ever met has the same qualities.
> > To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for the
> > cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.? For all 
> I know
> > this person expected to feel how he did before his addiction began that
> > could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru CT or even a slow wean 
> of his
> > dope.? Has no idea what being dope sick
> feels like.? I am not taken up for
> > thie Beau either.? I don't know, never met nor have I done any 
> research on
> > him.? Could be a person that had no intention of getting
> clean but only
> > wanted to lower his tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> > money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> >
> > Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >
> > On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a horrible
> > experience on Mexico.
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo < 
> <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>
> > diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >> *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment 
> *...*<http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> >>? 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/>http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*
> >>
> unethical*-?undergroun...
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: <http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine>
> >> http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 37
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 10:39:34 -0700
> From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ???
> Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID: <4F106C56.1060509 at mtciep.com 
> <mailto:4F106C56.1060509 at mtciep.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> amazing $7500...didn't know that Chris
>
> thanks
>
> ___________________
> Edward
> edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/13/2012 10:35 AM, cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com> 
> wrote:
> > If you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't
> > authored by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from
> > the patient's wife asking for advice. Why would you expect this clinic
> > to know what went wrong at Transitions? And what in the post led you
> > to believe the "patient" was looking for an inexpensive treatment? I
> > believe Transitions charges $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem
> > cheap.
> Why would you consider the post slanderous?
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>
> > <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >? ?? I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I
> >? ?? know the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been
> >? ?? helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the
> >? ?? Medical field?? So what happen that was terribly wrong??? Did he
> >? ?? have a heart attack, resp. problems?? what?? did he just feel
> >? ?? lethargy or never been thru wd before and has no idea what he 
> did get?
> >
> >?
> ?? All I got from this
> article is that This Beau guy is not in the
> >? ?? medical field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share
> >? ?? what it was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why
> >? ?? post such a negative article without anything of substance other
> >? ?? then this guy is not working with Solo?? For all I know Dr Solo
> >? ?? wrote this himself and just angry that another client got by him
> >? ?? without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> >
> >? ?? I am not saying the Doctor does not have the right to charge
> >? ?? whatever he wants.? After all one does not go to medical school
> >? ?? all those yrs to make minimal wage.? But really... what went
> >? ?? wrong, what happen,? WHy did this guy need to go to the hospital?
> >? ? ? IT says nothing but
> slander in my eyes.
> >
> >? ?? I do think that someone
> in the medical field needs to be present
> >? ?? during the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that
> >? ?? someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better
> >? ?? the chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to
> >? ?? Iboga straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider
> >? ?? about pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to
> >? ?? tell since so little was told of WHAT happen.? So I think the
> >? ?? article is crap.
> >
> >? ?? We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head
> >? ?? to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> >? ?? persons head saying " NO, you cant pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to
> a
> >? ?? Non medical, non MD."? If its important that a MD be present then
> >? ?? pay for it.? Your choice.
> >? ?? Also
> when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard
> >? ?? some terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I
> >? ?? have heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and
> >? ?? claiming that Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have
> >? ?? heard that there are providers doing dope or addicted themselves
> >? ?? as they provide after care to clients or worse providing tx
> >? ?? themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I have even heard that
> >? ?? there are providers out there that sell body parts to the black
> >? ?? market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I
> have
> >? ?? been told by pass clients that there are folks out there in the UG
> >? ?? that are willing to treat three at once.... really, how can you
> >? ?? watch three at once?
> >
> >? ?? I have seen clients
> come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the
> >? ?? first week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but
> >? ?? because they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction
> >? ?? say it didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began
> >? ?? 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they are gonna feel like they
> >? ?? are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope
> >? ?? going from the couch to chair for 30ys??? So again... what
> >? ?? information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not in
> >? ?? the
> Medical field?? Most providers I know are not in the Medical
> >? ?? field.? I don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she
> >? ?? offers a safe and complete treatment.? Not that I went there but
> >? ?? so many have.? I have had clients lie to me about their hx... not
> >? ??
> mentioning that they are on Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time
> >? ?? condition of seizures..fear it would knock them out of the
> >? ?? treatment but then complain ......really folks, we are working
> >? ?? with a group of folks that honesty is something that has been
> >? ?? lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it
> >? ?? would knock me out of the running.
> >
> >? ?? It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask
> >? ?? what they
> did\do for a living prior and what medical training they
> >? ?? may or may not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose
> >? ?? them but you choose them because you feel safe, they know what
> >? ?? they are doing, talk to others they? have treated.? IF someone
> >? ?? claims to be a RN, Lpn, practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever
> >? ?? google them,
> be sure they actually have a Medical license, where
> >? ?? they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one that has ever
> >? ?? had or have a license it so easy to find on the net.? IF its not
> >? ?? there then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know
> >? ?? that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my RN
> >? ?? license number out for them to look up on the net.? I went two
> yrs
> >? ?? pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
> >
> >? ?? I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the medical
> >? ?? field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs
> >? ?? throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment
> >? ?? skills.? I have heard folks that went to one semester and claim to
> >? ?? be in the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those
> that
> >? ?? are providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even
> >? ?? what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there
> >? ?? are "clinics" that don't have a medical person with\in two miles
> >? ?? of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but claim
> >? ?? to have MDs working for the place.?
> The word CLinic does not mean
> >? ?? what we are use to in the good ole USA.? That word is use very
> >? ?? loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.? For me..
> >? ?? when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.
> >? ? ? I could of cared less that my providers had no medical
> >? ?? background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> >? ?? addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me with the safest they were
> >? ?? able.? I could of care less if I died during the
> treatment, It
> >? ?? would of been more humane then the slow death I was experiencing
> >? ?? at my own hand.? I paid for my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were
> >? ?? my aftercare providers and I was very well taken care of.? Sasha
> >? ?? really
> stepped up to the plate when it came to food, Jessica was
> >? ?? very in tune to my depression and gave me the time I needed to
> >? ?? voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> >? ?? it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt
> >? ?? very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> >? ?? free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do
> >? ?? enough research.
> >
> >? ?? So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.
> >? ? ? Ask for numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to more
> >?
> ?? then one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated
> >? ?? me... even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying
> >? ?? "you get
> what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the
> >? ?? price for a real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that
> >? ?? I did walk away knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I
> >? ?? choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help myself feel
> >? ?? better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I
> >? ?? had to do the work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not
> >? ?? make me grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work thru.
> >
> >
> >? ?? So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for
> >? ?? the cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix everything
> >? ?? as many of us addicts
> do.? As addicts, we blame others for our
> >? ?? choices, we want to take every shortcut
> there is avail.? We do NOT
> >? ?? want to suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this
> >? ?? because I am a Addict and every addict I ever met has the same
> >? ?? qualities.
> >? ?? To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for
> >? ?? the cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.
> >? ? ? For all I know this person expected to feel how he did before his
> >? ?? addiction began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru
> >? ?? CT or even a slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope
> >? ?? sick feels like.? I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't
> >? ?? know, never met nor have I done any research on him.? Could be a
> >? ?? person that had no intention of getting clean but only
> wanted to
> >? ?? lower his tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> >? ?? money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> >
> >? ?? Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >
> >? ?? On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>
> >? ?? <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >>? ?? not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a
> >>? ?? horrible experience on Mexico.
> >>
> >>? ?? On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo
> >>? ?? <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com> 
> <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>? ? ? ?? *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> >>? ? ? ?? Treatment *...*
> >>? ? ? ?? 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> >>? ? ? ? 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >>
> >>
> >>? ? ? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >>? ? ? ?? (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? 
> [%][)
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> >>
> >>
> >>
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> [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 38
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 10:04:30 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground?
> Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326477870.15898.YahooMailNeo at web84008.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326477870.15898.YahooMailNeo at web84008.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> 7500 and no MD present??? Really??? And how did the client not know 
> this before hand?? Still... what went so wrong?? Nothing said on that 
> mark?? So... if authorized by the client, why not share the whole story?
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Friday, January 13, 2012 12:39 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical
> ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox Treatment Centers
> >
> >amazing $7500...didn't know that Chris
> >
> >thanks
> >
> >___________________
> >Edward
> >edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On 1/13/2012 10:35 AM, cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com> 
> wrote:
> >> If you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't
> >> authored by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from
> >> the patient's wife asking for advice. Why
> would you expect this clinic
> >> to know what went wrong at Transitions? And what in the post led you
> >> to believe the "patient" was looking for an inexpensive treatment? I
> >> believe Transitions charges $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem
> >> cheap. Why
> would you consider the post slanderous?
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>
> >> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>? ? I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I
> >>? ? know the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been
> >>? ? helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the
> >>? ? Medical field?? So what happen that was terribly
> wrong?? Did he
> >>? ? have a heart attack, resp. problems?? what?? did he just feel
> >>? ? lethargy or never been thru wd before and has no idea what he 
> did get?
> >>
> >>? ? All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the
> >>? ? medical
> field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share
> >>? ? what it was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why
> >>? ? post such a negative article without anything of substance other
> >>? ? then this guy is not working with Solo?? For all I know Dr Solo
> >>? ? wrote this himself and just angry that another client got by him
> >>? ? without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> >>
> >>? ? I am not saying the Doctor does not have the right to charge
> >>? ? whatever he wants.? After all one does not go to medical school
> >>? ? all those yrs to make minimal wage.? But really... what
> went
> >>? ? wrong, what happen,? WHy did this guy need to go to the hospital?
> >>? ? ? IT says nothing but slander in my eyes.
> >>
> >>? ? I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be present
> >>? ? during the experience.? After all, the sooner one
> recognizes that
> >>? ? someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better
> >>? ? the chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to
> >>? ? Iboga straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider
> >>? ? about pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to
> >>? ? tell since so little was told of WHAT happen.? So I think the
> >>? ? article is crap.
> >>
> >>? ? We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head
> >>? ? to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> >>? ? persons head saying " NO, you cant pay
> 7000 in stead of 3000 to a
> >>? ? Non medical, non MD."? If its important that a MD be present then
> >>? ? pay for it.? Your choice.
> >>? ? Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard
> >>? ? some terrible stories but no proof that it ever
> really happen.? I
> >>? ? have heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and
> >>? ? claiming that Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have
> >>? ? heard that there are providers doing dope or addicted themselves
> >>? ? as they provide after care to clients or worse providing tx
> >>? ? themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I have even heard that
> >>? ? there are providers out there that sell body parts to the black
> >>? ? market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I have
> >>? ? been told by pass clients that there are folks out there in the UG
> >>? ? that
> are willing to treat three at once.... really, how can you
> >>? ? watch three at once?
> >>
> >>? ? I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the
> >>? ? first week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but
> >>? ? because
> they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction
> >>? ? say it didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began
> >>? ? 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they are gonna feel like they
> >>? ? are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope
> >>? ? going from the couch to chair for 30ys?? So again... what
> >>? ? information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not in
> >>? ? the Medical field?? Most providers I know are not in the Medical
> >>? ? field.? I don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she
> >>? ? offers a safe and complete treatment.? Not that I went
> there but
> >>? ? so many have.? I have had clients lie to me about their hx... not
> >>? ? mentioning that they are on Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time
> >>? ? condition of seizures..fear it would knock them out of the
> >>? ? treatment but then
> complain ......really folks, we are working
> >>? ? with a group of folks that honesty is something that has been
> >>? ? lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it
> >>? ? would knock me out of the running.
> >>
> >>? ? It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask
> >>? ? what they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they
> >>? ? may or may not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose
> >>? ? them but you choose them because you feel safe, they know what
> >>? ? they are doing, talk to others they? have treated.? IF someone
> >>? ? claims to
> be a RN, Lpn, practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever
> >>? ? google them, be sure they actually have a Medical license, where
> >>? ? they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one that has ever
> >>? ? had or have a license it so easy to find on the
> net.? IF its not
> >>? ? there then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know
> >>? ? that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my RN
> >>? ? license number out for them to look up on the net.? I went two yrs
> >>? ? pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
> >>
> >>? ? I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the medical
> >>? ? field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs
> >>? ? throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment
> >>? ? skills.? I have heard folks that went to one semester and claim to
> >>? ? be in
> the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those that
> >>? ? are providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even
> >>? ? what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there
> >>? ? are "clinics" that don't have a medical
> person with\in two miles
> >>? ? of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but claim
> >>? ? to have MDs working for the place.? The word CLinic does not mean
> >>? ? what we are use to in the good ole USA.? That word is use very
> >>? ? loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.? For me..
> >>? ? when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.
> >>? ? ? I could of cared less that my providers had no medical
> >>? ? background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> >>? ? addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me with the safest they were
> >>? ? able.? I could of care
> less if I died during the treatment, It
> >>? ? would of been more humane then the slow death I was experiencing
> >>? ? at my own hand.? I paid for my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were
> >>? ? my aftercare providers and I was very well taken care
> of.? Sasha
> >>? ? really stepped up to the plate when it came to food, Jessica was
> >>? ? very in tune to my depression and gave me the time I needed to
> >>? ? voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> >>? ? it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt
> >>? ? very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> >>? ? free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do
> >>? ? enough research.
> >>
> >>? ? So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.
> >>? ? ? Ask for numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to
> more
> >>? ? then one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated
> >>? ? me... even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying
> >>? ? "you get what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the
> >>? ? price
> for a real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that
> >>? ? I did walk away knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I
> >>? ? choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help myself feel
> >>? ? better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I
> >>? ? had to do the work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not
> >>? ? make me grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work thru.
> >>
> >>
> >>? ? So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for
> >>? ? the cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix everything
> >>? ? as many of us addicts do.? As
> addicts, we blame others for our
> >>? ? choices, we want to take every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT
> >>? ? want to suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this
> >>? ? because I am a Addict and every addict I ever met has the
> same
> >>? ? qualities.
> >>? ? To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for
> >>? ? the cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.
> >>? ? ? For all I know this person expected to feel how he did before his
> >>? ? addiction began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru
> >>? ? CT or even a slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope
> >>? ? sick feels like.? I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't
> >>? ? know, never met nor have I done any research on him.? Could be a
> >>? ? person that had no intention of getting clean but only wanted to
> >>? ? lower his
> tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> >>? ? money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> >>
> >>? ? Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >>
> >>? ? On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs
> <emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>
> >>? ? <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>>? ? not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a
> >>>? ? horrible experience on Mexico.
> >>>
> >>>? ? On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo
> >>>? ? <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com> 
> <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>? ? ? ? *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> >>>? ? ? ? Treatment *...*
> >>>? ? ? ? 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> >>>? ? ? ? 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>? ? ? ? ?
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 39
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan
> 2012 10:15:53 -0800 (PST)
> From: Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? <1326478553.42920.YahooMailNeo at web84004.mail.mud.yahoo.com 
> <mailto:1326478553.42920.YahooMailNeo at web84004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> CB.... I guess I see it as slander when no information
> is given.? what went wrong?? Did anything really go wrong.? Is all 
> this only hearsay?
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> >From: Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> >To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >Sent: Friday, January 13, 2012 12:39 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? 
> Ibogaine Detox Treatment Centers
> >
> >amazing $7500...didn't know that Chris
> >
> >thanks
> >
> >___________________
> >Edward
> >edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >On 1/13/2012 10:35 AM, cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com> 
> wrote:
> >> If
> you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't
> >> authored by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from
> >> the patient's wife asking for advice. Why
> would you expect this clinic
> >> to know what went wrong at Transitions? And what in the post led you
> >> to believe the "patient" was looking for an inexpensive treatment? I
> >> believe Transitions charges $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem
> >> cheap. Why would you consider the post slanderous?
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>
> >> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>? ? I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I
> >>? ? know
> the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been
> >>? ? helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the
> >>? ? Medical field?? So what happen that was
> terribly wrong?? Did he
> >>? ? have a heart attack, resp. problems?? what?? did he just feel
> >>? ? lethargy or never been thru wd before and has no idea what he 
> did get?
> >>
> >>? ? All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the
> >>? ? medical field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share
> >>? ? what it was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why
> >>? ? post such a negative article without anything of substance other
> >>? ? then this guy is not working with Solo?? For all I know Dr Solo
> >>? ? wrote this himself and just angry that another client got by him
> >>? ? without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> >>
> >>? ? I am not saying the
> Doctor does not have the right to charge
> >>? ? whatever he wants.? After all one does not go to medical school
> >>? ? all those yrs to make minimal wage.? But really... what
> went
> >>? ? wrong, what happen,? WHy did this guy need to go to the hospital?
> >>? ? ? IT says nothing but slander in my eyes.
> >>
> >>? ? I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be present
> >>? ? during the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that
> >>? ? someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better
> >>? ? the chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to
> >>? ? Iboga straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider
> >>? ? about pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to
> >>? ? tell since so little was told of WHAT happen.? So I think the
> >>? ? article is crap.
> >>
> >>? ? We
> all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head
> >>? ? to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> >>? ? persons head saying " NO, you cant
> pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to a
> >>? ? Non medical, non MD."? If its important that a MD be present then
> >>? ? pay for it.? Your choice.
> >>? ? Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard
> >>? ? some terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I
> >>? ? have heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and
> >>? ? claiming that Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have
> >>? ? heard that there are providers doing dope or addicted themselves
> >>? ? as they provide after care to clients or worse providing tx
> >>? ? themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I have even heard that
> >>? ? there are providers out there that sell body parts to
> the black
> >>? ? market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I have
> >>? ? been told by pass clients that there are folks out there in the
> UG
> >>? ? that are willing to treat three at once.... really, how can you
> >>? ? watch three at once?
> >>
> >>? ? I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the
> >>? ? first week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but
> >>? ? because they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction
> >>? ? say it didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began
> >>? ? 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they are gonna feel like they
> >>? ? are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope
> >>? ? going from the couch to chair for 30ys?? So again... what
> >>? ? information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not in
> >>? ? the Medical field??
> Most providers I know are not in the Medical
> >>? ? field.? I don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she
> >>? ? offers a safe and complete
> treatment.? Not that I went there but
> >>? ? so many have.? I have had clients lie to me about their hx... not
> >>? ? mentioning that they are on Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time
> >>? ? condition of seizures..fear it would knock them out of the
> >>? ? treatment but then complain ......really folks, we are working
> >>? ? with a group of folks that honesty is something that has been
> >>? ? lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it
> >>? ? would knock me out of the running.
> >>
> >>? ? It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask
> >>? ? what they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they
> >>? ? may or may not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why
> you choose
> >>? ? them but you choose them because you feel safe, they know what
> >>? ? they are doing, talk to others they? have treated.? IF
> someone
> >>? ? claims to be a RN, Lpn, practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever
> >>? ? google them, be sure they actually have a Medical license, where
> >>? ? they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one that has ever
> >>? ? had or have a license it so easy to find on the net.? IF its not
> >>? ? there then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know
> >>? ? that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my RN
> >>? ? license number out for them to look up on the net.? I went two yrs
> >>? ? pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
> >>
> >>? ? I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the medical
> >>? ? field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my
> dogs
> >>? ? throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment
> >>? ? skills.? I have heard folks that went to one semester
> and claim to
> >>? ? be in the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those that
> >>? ? are providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even
> >>? ? what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there
> >>? ? are "clinics" that don't have a medical person with\in two miles
> >>? ? of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but claim
> >>? ? to have MDs working for the place.? The word CLinic does not mean
> >>? ? what we are use to in the good ole USA.? That word is use very
> >>? ? loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.? For me..
> >>? ? when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.
> >>? ? ? I could of cared less that my providers had no
> medical
> >>? ? background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> >>? ? addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me with the safest they
> were
> >>? ? able.? I could of care less if I died during the treatment, It
> >>? ? would of been more humane then the slow death I was experiencing
> >>? ? at my own hand.? I paid for my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were
> >>? ? my aftercare providers and I was very well taken care of.? Sasha
> >>? ? really stepped up to the plate when it came to food, Jessica was
> >>? ? very in tune to my depression and gave me the time I needed to
> >>? ? voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> >>? ? it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt
> >>? ? very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> >>? ? free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't
> do
> >>? ? enough research.
> >>
> >>? ? So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.
> >>? ? ? Ask for numbers
> of those that they have treated.? Talk to more
> >>? ? then one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated
> >>? ? me... even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying
> >>? ? "you get what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the
> >>? ? price for a real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that
> >>? ? I did walk away knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I
> >>? ? choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help myself feel
> >>? ? better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I
> >>? ? had to do the work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not
> >>? ? make me grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work
> thru.
> >>
> >>
> >>? ? So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for
> >>? ? the cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix
> everything
> >>? ? as many of us addicts do.? As addicts, we blame others for our
> >>? ? choices, we want to take every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT
> >>? ? want to suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this
> >>? ? because I am a Addict and every addict I ever met has the same
> >>? ? qualities.
> >>? ? To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for
> >>? ? the cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.
> >>? ? ? For all I know this person expected to feel how he did before his
> >>? ? addiction began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru
> >>? ? CT or even a slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope
> >>? ? sick feels
> like.? I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't
> >>? ? know, never met nor have I done any research on him.? Could be a
> >>? ? person that had no intention of
> getting clean but only wanted to
> >>? ? lower his tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> >>? ? money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> >>
> >>? ? Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >>
> >>? ? On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>
> >>? ? <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>
> >>>? ? not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a
> >>>? ? horrible experience on Mexico.
> >>>
> >>>? ? On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga
> SanFilippo
> >>>? ? <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com> 
> <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>? ? ? ? *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> >>>? ? ? ? Treatment *...*
> >>>? ? ? ? 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>>
> >>>? ? ? ? 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>
> >>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 40
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 11:01:11 -0800
> From: cbava108 at gmail.com <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]
> Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CABg8pxBDFPFgtq4xNCSwdqF_sBnDzCM+Zxh4NRV74tGRUqXwDQ at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:Zxh4NRV74tGRUqXwDQ at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> Purportedly
> Transitions *is *a medical facility, my point is, how would the
> folks who received the frantic call from the wife know what went wrong?
> Apparently, the people who were called are in Cancun and the client was
> dropped at the San Ysidro point of entry, how would they know what went
> wrong?? Beau Mason isn't a provider he's the financing behind Transitions
> and otherwise a salesman making remote referrals from the US.
>
> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 10:15 AM, Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> > CB.... I guess I see it as slander when no information is given.? what
> > went wrong?? Did anything really go wrong.? Is all this only hearsay?
> >
> >?? *From:* Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> > *Sent:* Friday, January 13, 2012 12:39 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> > Detox Treatment Centers
> >
> > amazing $7500...didn't know that Chris
> >
> > thanks
> >
> > ___________________
> > Edward
> > edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 1/13/2012 10:35 AM, cbava108 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > If you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't
> > > authored by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from
> > > the patient's wife asking for advice. Why would you expect this clinic
> > > to know what went wrong at
> Transitions? And what in the post led you
> > > to believe the "patient" was looking for an inexpensive treatment? I
> > > believe Transitions charges $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem
> > > cheap. Why would you consider the post slanderous?
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>
> >
> > <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> > >
> > >? ? I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I
> > >? ? know the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been
> > >? ? helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the
> > >? ? Medical field?? So what happen that was terribly wrong?? Did he
> > >? ? have a heart attack, resp.
> problems?? what?? did he just feel
> > >? ? lethargy or never been thru wd before and has no idea what he 
> did get?
> > >
> > >? ? All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the
> > >? ? medical field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share
> > >? ? what it
> was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why
> > >? ? post such a negative article without anything of substance other
> > >? ? then this guy is not working with Solo?? For all I know Dr Solo
> > >? ? wrote this himself and just angry that another client got by him
> > >? ? without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> > >
> > >? ? I am not saying the Doctor does not have the right to charge
> > >? ? whatever he wants.? After all one does not go to medical school
> > >? ? all those yrs to make minimal wage.? But really... what went
> > >? ? wrong, what happen,? WHy did this
> guy need to go to the hospital?
> > >? ? ? IT says nothing but slander in my eyes.
> > >
> > >? ? I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be
> present
> > >? ? during the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that
> > >? ? someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better
> > >? ? the chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to
> > >? ? Iboga straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider
> > >? ? about pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to
> > >? ? tell since so little was told of WHAT happen.? So I think the
> > >? ? article is crap.
> > >
> > >? ? We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head
> > >? ? to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> > >? ? persons head saying " NO, you cant pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to a
> >
> >? ? Non medical, non MD."? If
> its important that a MD be present then
> > >? ? pay for it.? Your choice.
> > >? ? Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard
> > >? ? some terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I
> > >? ? have heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and
> > >? ? claiming that Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have
> > >? ? heard that there are providers doing dope or addicted themselves
> > >? ? as they provide after care to clients or worse providing tx
> > >? ? themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I have even heard that
> > >? ? there are providers out there that sell body parts to the black
> > >? ? market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I have
> > >?
> ? been told by pass clients that there are folks out there in the UG
> > >? ? that are willing
> to treat three at once.... really, how can you
> > >? ? watch three at once?
> > >
> > >? ? I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the
> > >? ? first week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but
> > >? ? because they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction
> > >? ? say it didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began
> > >? ? 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they are gonna feel like they
> > >? ? are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope
> > >? ? going from the couch to chair for 30ys?? So again... what
> > >? ? information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not in
> >
> >? ? the Medical field?? Most providers I know are not in the Medical
> > >? ? field.? I don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she
> > >? ? offers a safe and complete treatment.? Not that I
> went there but
> > >? ? so many have.? I have had clients lie to me about their hx... not
> > >? ? mentioning that they are on Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time
> > >? ? condition of seizures..fear it would knock them out of the
> > >? ? treatment but then complain ......really folks, we are working
> > >? ? with a group of folks that honesty is something that has been
> > >? ? lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it
> > >? ? would knock me out of the running.
> > >
> > >? ? It is so important to talk\research the
> provider you choose.? Ask
> > >? ? what they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they
> > >? ? may or may not have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose
> > >? ? them but you choose them because you feel safe, they know what
> > >? ? they are doing, talk to others they? have treated.? IF
> someone
> > >? ? claims to be a RN, Lpn, practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever
> > >? ? google them, be sure they actually have a Medical license, where
> > >? ? they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one that has ever
> > >? ? had or have a license it so easy to find on the net.? IF its not
> > >? ? there then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know
> > >? ? that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my
> RN
> > >? ? license number out for them to look up on the net.? I went two yrs
> > >? ? pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
> > >
> > >? ? I am not saying the only quantified providers are in the medical
> > >? ? field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs
> > >? ? throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment
> > >? ? skills.? I have heard folks that went to
> one semester and claim to
> > >? ? be in the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those that
> > >? ? are providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even
> > >? ? what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there
> > >? ? are "clinics" that don't have a medical person with\in two miles
> >
> >? ? of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but claim
> > >? ? to have MDs working for the place.? The word CLinic does not mean
> > >? ? what we are use to in the good ole USA.? That word is use very
> > >? ? loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.? For me..
> > >? ? when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.
> > >? ? ? I could of cared less that my providers had no medical
> > >? ? background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> > >? ? addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me
> with the safest they were
> > >? ? able.? I could of care less if I died during the treatment, It
> > >? ? would of been more humane then the slow death I was experiencing
> > >? ? at my own
> hand.? I paid for my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were
> > >? ? my aftercare providers and I was very well taken care of.? Sasha
> > >? ? really stepped up to the plate when it came to food, Jessica was
> > >? ? very in tune to my depression and gave me the time I needed to
> > >? ? voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> > >? ? it was needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt
> > >? ? very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> > >? ? free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do
> > >? ? enough research.
> > >
> > >? ? So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your
> research.
> > >? ? ? Ask for numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to
> more
> > >? ? then one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated
> > >? ? me... even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the picture?? That old saying
> > >? ? "you get what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the
> > >? ? price for a real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that
> > >? ? I did walk away knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I
> > >? ? choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help myself feel
> > >? ? better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I
> > >? ? had to do the work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not
> > >? ? make me grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work 
> thru.
> > >
> > >
> > >? ? So... that article told me
> shit.? Told me that the person went for
> > >? ? the
> cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix everything
> > >? ? as many of us addicts do.? As addicts, we blame others for our
> > >? ? choices, we want to take every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT
> > >? ? want to suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this
> > >? ? because I am a Addict and every addict I ever met has the same
> > >? ? qualities.
> > >? ? To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for
> > >? ? the cheapest tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.
> > >? ? ? For all I know this person expected to feel how he did before his
> > >? ? addiction began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru
> > >? ? CT or even a
> slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope
> > >? ? sick feels like.? I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't
> > >? ? know, never met nor have I done any research on
> him.? Could be a
> > >? ? person that had no intention of getting clean but only wanted to
> > >? ? lower his tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> > >? ? money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> > >
> > >? ? Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> > >
> > >? ? On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>
> > >? ? <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> > >
> >
> >>? ? not the first bogus provider and it won't be the last. I had a
> > >>? ? horrible experience on Mexico.
> > >>
> > >>? ? On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo
> > >>? ? <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com> 
> <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>? ? ? ? *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> > >>? ? ? ? Treatment *...*
> > >>? ? ? ? <
> > 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>
> > >
> > >>? ? ? ? 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun
> > ...
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>? ? ? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > >>? ? ? ?
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> > >>
> > >>
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> > >
> > >
> > >? ? ?
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> > >
> > >
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 41
> Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 14:09:52 -0500
> From: Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> Subject: Re:
> [Ibogaine] Transitions | Unethical ?Underground? Ibogaine
> ??? Detox Treatment Centers
> Message-ID:
> ??? 
> <CAAxLk=RoL29Nm8xAevkmOA38SZhxkHG+MGqH4bTgwU9qQ98q-g at mail.gmail.com 
> <mailto:MGqH4bTgwU9qQ98q-g at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> There is no shame in trying to find inexpensive treatment either. Not
> everyone has a lot of money.
>
> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 2:01 PM, <cbava108 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> > Purportedly Transitions *is *a medical facility, my point is, how would
> > the folks who received the frantic call from the wife know what went 
> wrong?
> > Apparently, the people who were called are in Cancun and the client was
> > dropped at the San
> Ysidro point of entry, how would they know what
> went
> > wrong?? Beau Mason isn't a provider he's the financing behind 
> Transitions
> > and otherwise a salesman making remote referrals from the US.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 10:15 AM, Sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>> wrote:
> >
> >> CB.... I guess I see it as slander when no information is given.? what
> >> went wrong?? Did anything really go wrong.? Is all this only hearsay?
> >>
> >>? ? *From:* Edward W <edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>>
> >> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >> *Sent:* Friday, January 13, 2012 12:39 PM
> >> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Transitions |
> Unethical ?Underground?
> Ibogaine
> >> Detox Treatment Centers
> >>
> >> amazing $7500...didn't know that Chris
> >>
> >> thanks
> >>
> >> ___________________
> >> Edward
> >> edwardw at mtciep.com <mailto:edwardw at mtciep.com>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 1/13/2012 10:35 AM, cbava108 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:cbava108 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > If you read it twice it should've been clear that the post wasn't
> >> > authored by a "client" but by another clinic who received a call from
> >> > the patient's wife asking for advice. Why would you expect this 
> clinic
> >> > to know what went wrong at Transitions? And what in the post led you
> >> > to believe the "patient" was looking for an inexpensive treatment?
> I
> >> > believe
> Transitions charges $7500 per treatment, that doesn't seem
> >> > cheap. Why would you consider the post slanderous?
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 5:15 AM, sister <sistereboga at yahoo.com 
> <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>
> >> > <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com <mailto:sistereboga at yahoo.com>>> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >? ? I had to read this article twice and still got nothing.? For all I
> >> >? ? know the guy didn't like the food?? More information would of been
> >> >? ? helpful.? Nothing is said other then this guy is not in the
> >> >? ? Medical field?? So what happen that was terribly wrong?? Did he
> >> >? ? have a heart attack, resp. problems?? what?? did he
> just feel
> >> >? ? lethargy or never
> been thru wd before and has no idea what he did
> >> get?
> >> >
> >> >? ? All I got from this article is that This Beau guy is not in the
> >> >? ? medical field.? Something went wrong? but not willing to share
> >> >? ? what it was?? So much NOT said.? What I don't understand is why
> >> >? ? post such a negative article without anything of substance other
> >> >? ? then this guy is not working with Solo?? For all I know Dr Solo
> >> >? ? wrote this himself and just angry that another client got by him
> >> >? ? without paying 7500 to the doctor.
> >> >
> >> >? ? I am not saying the Doctor does not have the right to charge
> >> >? ? whatever he wants.? After all
> one does not go to medical school
> >> >? ? all those yrs to make minimal wage.? But really... what went
> >> >? ? wrong, what happen,? WHy did this guy
> need to go to the hospital?
> >> >? ? ? IT says nothing but slander in my eyes.
> >> >
> >> >? ? I do think that someone in the medical field needs to be present
> >> >? ? during the experience.? After all, the sooner one recognizes that
> >> >? ? someone is not compensating well, the sooner one acts the better
> >> >? ? the chances for the client.? For all I know this person came to
> >> >? ? Iboga straight from Methadone or suboxone, or lied to the provider
> >> >? ? about pass hx, lied about what meds he was on.? Just no way to
> >> >? ? tell since so little was
> told of WHAT happen.? So I think the
> >> >? ? article is crap.
> >> >
> >> >? ? We all have our choices to make.? NO one puts a gun to your head
> >> >? ? to participate in this experience.? NO one held a gun to this
> >> >? ? persons head saying "
> NO, you cant pay 7000 in stead of 3000 to a
> >> >? ? Non medical, non MD."? If its important that a MD be present then
> >> >? ? pay for it.? Your choice.
> >> >? ? Also when one treats in MX, it is not underground.? I have heard
> >> >? ? some terrible stories but no proof that it ever really happen.? I
> >> >? ? have heard that providers are cutting benzo doses in half and
> >> >? ? claiming that Iboga will take one thru Benzo detox safely.? I have
> >>
> >? ? heard that there are providers doing dope or addicted themselves
> >> >? ? as they provide after care to clients or worse providing tx
> >> >? ? themselves.? BUt have I seen this... NOPE.? I have even heard that
> >> >? ? there are providers out there that sell body parts to the black
> >> >? ? market when addicts die.? THat one really made me giggle.? I have
> >> >? ? been
> told by pass clients that there are folks out there in the UG
> >> >? ? that are willing to treat three at once.... really, how can you
> >> >? ? watch three at once?
> >> >
> >> >? ? I have seen clients come to Iboga and walk away gaining wt the
> >> >? ? first week after they receive this treatment, no WD symptoms but
> >> >? ? because
> they didn't walk away feeling like they did pre addiction
> >> >? ? say it didn't work.? Forget the fact that the addiction began
> >> >? ? 30yrs prior.? Some actually think they are gonna feel like they
> >> >? ? are in their 20s when the spend from 20 to 50yrs of age doing dope
> >> >? ? going from the couch to chair for 30ys?? So again... what
> >> >? ? information did this article give anyone other then Beau is not in
> >> >? ? the Medical field?? Most providers I know are not in the
> Medical
> >> >? ? field.? I don't think Sarah is a RN or LPN but I do believe she
> >> >? ? offers a safe and complete treatment.? Not that I went there but
> >> >? ? so many have.? I have had clients lie to me about their hx... not
> >> >?
> ? mentioning that they are on Tegrotal or dilantin for a life time
> >> >? ? condition of seizures..fear it would knock them out of the
> >> >? ? treatment but then complain ......really folks, we are working
> >> >? ? with a group of folks that honesty is something that has been
> >> >? ? lost.? I for one did not mention to Rocky that I had MS in fear it
> >> >? ? would knock me out of the running.
> >> >
> >> >? ? It is so important to talk\research the provider you choose.? Ask
> >> >? ? what they did\do for a living prior and what medical training they
> >> >? ? may or may not
> have.? Be sure that MONEY is not why you choose
> >> >? ? them but you choose them because you feel safe, they know what
> >> >? ? they are doing,
> talk to others they? have treated.? IF someone
> >> >? ? claims to be a RN, Lpn, practitioner, MD, mid wife or what ever
> >> >? ? google them, be sure they actually have a Medical license, where
> >> >? ? they attended Collage.? So easy to do.? Every one that has ever
> >> >? ? had or have a license it so easy to find on the net.? IF its not
> >> >? ? there then I bet they don't have it and never has had it.? I know
> >> >? ? that anyone can look up my credentials.? I have given my RN
> >> >? ? license number out for them to look up on the net.? I went two yrs
> >> >? ? pre medical... that did not make me a MD or even close to one.
> >> >
> >> >? ? I am not saying the only quantified
> providers are in the medical
> >>
> >? ? field.? I have worked with MDs that I would not let swab my dogs
> >> >? ? throat, Nurses that miss the boat when it comes to any assessment
> >> >? ? skills.? I have heard folks that went to one semester and claim to
> >> >? ? be in the medical field.? ? I have read on this forum those that
> >> >? ? are providing and not know how to treat a low bld pressure or even
> >> >? ? what a resting BP\heart rate looks like. I also know that there
> >> >? ? are "clinics" that don't have a medical person with\in two miles
> >> >? ? of the clinic when the actual treatment is taken place but claim
> >> >? ? to have MDs working for the place.? The word CLinic does not mean
> >> >? ? what we are use to in the good ole USA.? That word is use
> very
> >> >? ? loosely.? That word does not mean a medical environment.?
> For me..
> >> >? ? when I went for my treatment I could of cared less if I saw a MD.
> >> >? ? ? I could of cared less that my providers had no medical
> >> >? ? background.? What I did expect was that my provider not be
> >> >? ? addicted to dope themselves.? Provide me with the safest they were
> >> >? ? able.? I could of care less if I died during the treatment, It
> >> >? ? would of been more humane then the slow death I was experiencing
> >> >? ? at my own hand.? I paid for my after care.? Sasha and Jessica were
> >> >? ? my aftercare providers and I was very well taken care of.? Sasha
> >> >? ? really stepped up to the plate when it
> came to food, Jessica was
> >> >? ? very in tune to my depression and gave me the time I needed to
> >> >? ? voice it.? Rocky, Mary and Christ checked my BP more then I felt
> >> >? ? it was
> needed but they knew more then I did at the time... I felt
> >> >? ? very safe during my process for sure.? I paid for it, it wasn't
> >> >? ? free.? It was my own fault that I didn't get boosters, I didn't do
> >> >? ? enough research.
> >> >
> >> >? ? So to those looking for a qualified provider... do your research.
> >> >? ? ? Ask for numbers of those that they have treated.? Talk to more
> >> >? ? then one.? I can write a beautiful testimony on how Sister treated
> >> >? ? me... even if I am Sister.? LOL? get the
> picture?? That old saying
> >> >? ? "you get what you pay for" I find so true.? I feel I did pay the
> >> >? ? price for a real clinic, a MD present but even without all of that
> >> >? ? I did walk away knowing that I had a chance to remain clean, if I
> >> >? ? choose too.? I still had a lot of work to do to help
> myself feel
> >> >? ? better.? I had severe lethargy, chills/sweats and depression.? I
> >> >? ? had to do the work myself to get thru this stage.? Iboga did not
> >> >? ? make me grow up overnight either.? Another thing I had to work 
> thru.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >? ? So... that article told me shit.? Told me that the person went for
> >> >? ? the cheapest he/she could find and wanted Iboga to fix
> everything
> >> >? ? as many of us addicts do.? As addicts, we blame others for our
> >> >? ? choices, we want to take every shortcut there is avail.? We do NOT
> >> >? ? want to suffer emotional or physical discomforts.? I know this
> >> >? ? because I am a Addict and every addict I ever met has the same
> >> >? ? qualities.
> >> >? ? To me... that article sounds like a disgruntle client.? Went for
> >> >? ? the cheapest
> tx he could find then not happy with the outcome.
> >> >? ? ? For all I know this person expected to feel how he did 
> before his
> >> >? ? addiction began that could of been 30yrs prior.? Never been thru
> >> >? ? CT or even a slow wean of his dope.? Has no idea what being dope
> >> >?
> ? sick feels like.? I am not taken up for thie Beau either.? I don't
> >> >? ? know, never met nor have I done any research on him.? Could be a
> >> >? ? person that had no intention of getting clean but only wanted to
> >> >? ? lower his tolerance so they could continue to dope on for less
> >> >? ? money.? I see the article as pure slander.
> >> >
> >> >? ? Sent by someone who missed way too many English classes.
> >> >
> >> >? ? On Jan 12, 2012, at 9:28 PM, Emma Sachs <emma04406 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>
> >> >? ? <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com <mailto:emma04406 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>? ? not the first bogus
> provider and it won't be the last. I had a
> >> >>? ? horrible experience on Mexico.
> >> >>
> >> >>? ? On Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Diboga SanFilippo
> >> >>? ? <diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com> 
> <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com <mailto:diboga4 at gmail.com>>> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>? ? ? ? *Transitions* | *Unethical* ?Underground? Ibogaine Detox
> >> >>? ? ? ? Treatment *...*
> >> >>? ? ? ? <
> >> 
> http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers 
> <http://myibogaine.com/2012/transitions-unethical-%E2%80%9Cunderground%E2%80%9D-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=transitions-unethical-%25e2%2580%259cunderground%25e2%2580%259d-ibogaine-detox-treatment-centers>
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> http://myibogaine.com/2012/*transitions*-*unethical*-?undergroun...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>? ? ? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: 
> (]=-
> >> >>? ? ? ?
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::
> >> [%][)
> >> >>? ? ? ? ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: 
> (]=-
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> >>? ? (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >> >>? ? ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >? ? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> >? ? (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >> >? ? ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings ::
> [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >? ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >> >? ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>?? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>?? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::
> (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >>? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> > (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> >? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> >
> >
> -------------- next part --------------
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> ------------------------------
>
> ? -=[) :::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::: (]=-
>
>
> End of Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 4
> ***************************************
>
>
>
>
> ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> -------------- next part --------------
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> ------------------------------
>
> ? -=[) :::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine
> | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::: (]=-
>
>
> End of Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 9
> ***************************************
>
>
>
>
> ? -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> ? -=[) :::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]? :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::? [%][)
> ? -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::: (]=-
>
>
> End of Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 12
> ****************************************
> -------------- next part --------------
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> ------------------------------
>
>   -=[) :::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
>   -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe ::::: (]=-
>
>
> End of Ibogaine Digest, Vol 49, Issue 13
> ****************************************
>
>
>
>
>    -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine | List Commands ::::::: (]=-
> (][%]  :: http://mindvox.com/mailman/listinfo/ibogaine ::  [%][)
>    -=[) :::: Change Account Settings :: [Un]Subscribe :::: (]=-


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