[Ibogaine] Ibogaine and naltrelone

Gary Bryan gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk
Sat May 7 12:43:40 EDT 2011


I  know, im a little worried too, although this has come from the doctor
that runs the (infamous) Stapleford Clinic, it's been in business for a long
time treating mainly 'functioning', employed addicts.

See if your poor here NHS treatment is literally either Met or Subs, BUT if
you can afford to pay for a private doctor and prescription you can get
better/nicer drugs.

The Stapleford is the high profile place where a group of doctors were
struck off for prescribing diamorphine, and more recently some of the
doctors were dragged in front of the general medical council after a DIY
home detox went wrong and the guy died.

Apparently they facilitate a lot of home detoxes, they were questioned about
how ethical and safe it is to send an addict home with a bundle of
diazepam/MS Contin/Sevredol and there were a few others I believe, heavier
benzo's I think were prescribed (Midazolam possibly)....

Anyways, they have a lot of experience with MST and Naltrexlone, in fact
they are one of only two clinics in the UK that will prescribe the implant.
I was dubious when my doc said only five clear days, but I guess MST doesnt
compare to Met or Sub when it comes to half life...

I have the option of swapping to subs at the end of my MST taper if I want,
im not sure how I feel about that, I'll see how it goes with the MST, if I
hit the 'brick wall' I may need to consider it... Swapping from Subs to Nal
is going to be easier because of its partial agonist/antagonist action..

I dont know!

I seem to be pretty stable on 180mg MST twice daily, I need to start
reducing as soon as im stable really, I only have around three months to get
off it. (Obvs thats not set in stone, she wont kick me off in exactly 11
weeks) but I dont want to be taking anything for too long...

On 7 May 2011 13:24, Jim Hadey <jimhadey3 at yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> Howdy Gary,
>
> So the Dr says 5 days I am just dying to know it
> that is long enough, I doubt it.  However you Dr
> is so right in saying he will give you a 1/20th of
> a pill - a Great idea.
>
> Best,
>
>   - JIM
>
> --- On *Sat, 5/7/11, Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>* wrote:
>
>
> From: Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk>
>
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine and naltrelone
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Date: Saturday, May 7, 2011, 1:08 AM
>
>
> Quick update on this....
>
> My doctors been titrating me on MS Contin now the last week, im currently
> taking 180mg twice daily.
> I've found it difficult to work out equivilances due to the huge difference
> in half lifes of methadone vs MST
>
> The general consensus is to take the MST dose and divide by between 6-8
>
> This means its equivelant to between 45-60mg methadone.. A pretty average
> dose over here, enough to keep the monkey off my back but not much else.
>
> My psych has spoken to an expert in the transition to nal from MST and he
> recommends leaving  five clear days between the two. Day 6 is when he
> usually gives a small 'challenge dose' like a 20th of a tablet.
> (This is assuming by the way that the MST was down to no more than 35mg
> daily)
>
> Ill be blogging about it all anyway as don't want to bore you all!
>
> Cheers
>
> *Gary Bryan*
>
> http://www.heroinjunkie.blogspot.com
>
> [image:
> images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRnpuJxaHpsbTHP2azGUX-qiyFEq_4h3NNwNZyhLq1MeWiHue8D]*Tabernanthe
> iboga*
>
>
>
> On 28 April 2011 05:55, Gary Bryan <gary_bryan at blueyonder.co.uk<http://mc/compose?to=gary_bryan@blueyonder.co.uk>
> > wrote:
>
> Thanks guys,
>
> Jim, that sounds like very good advice, im going to talk it over with my
> psych today...
>
> I did the transition from 8mg met to 8mg subs on a detox a few years back
> and it wasnt easy, I did it though, then I taperes the sub to 0.02mg over 3
> months and when I stopped it was just like any other drop! I thoguth I was
> going to go into full blown wd's but i was FINE.. I was amazed..
>
> Yes, the plan is to stabilise me on MST Continus, (basically becasue I HAVE
> to stop injecting, iv'e been injecting in my penis the last month and I dont
> need to go into detail about how fucked up that is)
>
> Once stabilised ill start reducing and get down to something like 5 or 10mg
> daily before stopping, thats when I was considering RB, for a few days, Im
> thinking it will kick off any remaining opiates ready for the nal to do its
> work...
>
> I did Ibo four times in all, two full floods, and twice with the bare
> minnimum, im talking 400mg (TA) initially and repeated over three days to a
> total of 2000mg (I did have a couple of HCL doses too (200mg) and RB...
> I find it fantastic for the actual acute withdrawal/detox but a week later
> i'd still be shivering, goosebumps, aching and CRAVING like crazy!
> I know detox is never gonna be easy, and I know that I need to change
> things, I understand I cant expect to carry on as before sans heroin and
> evrything will be fine, this time im trying to sort out counselling and I
> will force myself to go to NA meetings..
>
> Over in the UK, as a heroin addict you basically have a choice of met or
> subs, due to our dire financial situation the gov are also cutting funding
> left right and centre and that includes addiction...
>
> People on long term met maintenance that have jobs and contribute to
> society are going to be forced to detox, funding for rehab is being cut,
> hell my psychiatrist (who runs the local drugs unit at my hospital) has been
> made redundant...
>
> Basically what im saying is, im very lucky to be offered MST, and I need to
> make the most of it as I wont be offered it again if I fuck it up!
>
> Last time I cleaned up I tapered off 120mg met over a year and a half... it
> worked, I didn'r really suffer PAWS, just chronic depression, for around a
> year, I was literally suicidal.. how I didnt relapse I dont know!
>
> Also Naloxone over here is very rarely dispensed on the NHS, theres only
> one clinic (private) that does the depot implants and they cost I believe
> around £6000 for the 6 month one, (around $8,500?)
> So im also very lucky to be offered oral Nal...
>
> Like I said before, Ive heard that some of the side effects of Nal can
> mimic PAWS, not sure where I read that, ill try and find a source...some
> here <http://www.well.com/user/woa/revia/reviafaq.htm>
>
> Im going to start on the MST today anyway... lets see how it goes..
> G
>
>
>
>
> On 28 April 2011 04:18, Curtis Madison <crownofthorns1313 at yahoo.com<http://mc/compose?to=crownofthorns1313@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> Sounds like a good plan to me, so far as I know nal is supposed to help
> with
> PAWS, not cause it, I also know of no reason not to take ibo after a very
> clean
> short acting opiate like morphine and right before nal. I'd think that
> sounds
> like a winning combo and a good plan. The only part I'd pay close attention
> to
> is what is the length of time that the 'slow release' morphine is released
> at,
> if you're doing a high dose of ibo and you still have slow release morphine
> hanging around at the same time, that could be a really bad combo. I'd make
> sure
> that you do the ibo a few hours after the last of the slow release should
> have
> released ;-)
> If you're tapering down to nothing using the mst, so you're on very low
> doses of
> it by the end and then doing another low dose of root bark instead of a
> high
> dose of hcl, then I'd say you have nothing to worry about.
>
> peace out
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Gary <sidskidpiercing at gmail.com<http://mc/compose?to=sidskidpiercing@gmail.com>
> >
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com<http://mc/compose?to=ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> >
> Sent: Tue, April 26, 2011 8:54:37 PM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine and naltrelone
>
> Hi all.
>
> I have a question regarding my latest attempt at detox...
>
> My psych has agreed to a taper me with mst (slow release morphine sulphate)
> - a
> rare opportunity over here. You can normally only get prescribed morphine
> via a
> private doctor/prescription
>
> So the plan is to stabilise me on the morphine and reduce it over around
> three
> months. At the end I'm going to get oral naltrexone.
>
>
> Unfortunately ibo didn't work for me when it came to cravings and paws.
>
> I do still have some rb leftover and was wondering if I could use it at the
> end
> of my taper to kick the last of the opiates off the receptors before I
> start the
> naltrexone... ?
>
> Mst continus has quite a long half life and as you all know when swapping
> to
> suboxone/nal you need to go into wd's to avoid precipitated acute wd's.
>
>
> I don't really fancy waiting three days in-between the two.
>
> Anyone have any thoughts on using some rb maybe the day after my last mst
> dose
> and then start the nal the next day?
>
> I've also heard nal can cause paws on it's own? Anyone have any experience
> of
> this?
>
>
> Obviously I'm anxious about the transfer part. And then if I'm struggling
> with
> wd's once on nal I can't do anything about it!.... Or can rb be used in
> combination maybe for residual paws?
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
> Gary
>
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> --
> *Gary Bryan*
>
> http://www.heroinjunkie.blogspot.com
>
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-- 
*Gary Bryan*

http://www.heroinjunkie.blogspot.com

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