[Ibogaine] ibogaine detox in USA?

Jim Hadey jimhadey3 at yahoo.com
Mon Sep 28 19:57:35 EDT 2009



Hi James,

It seems that there are a lot of people who like it.  And from 
what I hear they must like for it doesn't taste all that good.
Then you got the double purge thing.  But I never took it, if
it is DMT, I would be interested but I also hear you should 
not do it alone.  I've never done it which is why I may want to
think twice but chances are I would give it a try.  I always 
wanted to try DMT and X but I really don't know anyone
who deals in it.  It is kind of funny dealing with my buddy's
son and one grandson.  These tiny kids that were running
around are now six feet and 200 lbs with kids running 
around.  Tell me it does purge you  both ways, is this 
right.  Can you always make it to the commode?   I have 
read about it several times there is something like
Minnosa, Syrun Rue, and a couple of other things they
have it listed on Erowid.  I really don't use drugs other
than weed and few meds, and then according to directions.
I am not one to fool myself into thinking that because a 
doc writes it it is safe.  But a good psychedelic is very
good for getting out clutter.  I used to refer to it as aligning
the chukkas (wow did my dictionary spell chukkas ),  But
it seems them days are so long gone.  Yea, the sixties
was another time and place - another world.  There were
the real people the phonies, the curious but it was the
people that finally ended the war.  At first the demonstrations
was just those communist rabble rousers then the main 
stream and it snowballed.  And this doesn't have anything
to do with ayahuasca, don;t know how it got in there.  But
I might try a medium dose if there we one or two people around.

Talk to ya later,

  - JIM

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, James Forristal <psychonaut101 at gmail.com> wrote:

From: James Forristal <psychonaut101 at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine detox in USA?
To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 6:03 PM

Ayahuasca is dose dependent in it's effect like any other psychoactive substance.  The nicer side of ayahuasca is that you can have a very intense experience and still come down in 4 to 5 hours, this is not the case with LSD.  I've had high dose LSD experiences that took half way into the next day before I could even try to sleep, then a few hours after that before sleep actually occured.  


Intense cleaning without the long duration in effect seems like a plus in my book!

On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Jim Hadey <jimhadey3 at yahoo.com> wrote:



HI Matt,

Yea, I know a lot of DIYs out there.  It was close to two years
that I did my home thing and I still feel it is affecting me somewhat.
I really do not think it hurts to relive the experience every two, three,

ten years, whenever your mind says  hey, I need a recharge.  I am
glad it worked for depression.  I am bothered by it sometimes but 
can not take the SSRI types.  The doc should tell you when he hands
you the Rx that SSRIs are habit forming.  Several people on this forum

had a problem getting off them.

You say >>

The problem is that every so often
a powerful experience from ayahuasca or iboga seems necessary to really
clear out the emotional cellar so to speak but at the same time I am
not as fond of those really powerful experiences as I used to be. <<<<<

I never took ayahuasca and might be afraid to try it.  But I think a good
psychedelic trip either LSD, Mushrooms or whatever is good for ya 

every now and then and you could say the same thing for Ibo.  Yea, cleans
out the clutter that is a good way to put it.  I think as time goes on we all
improve or grow and as you grow and advance you need less and less

of the, I hate to say drug but they are drugs, so as you  grow you take
need the drugs less and less, you no longer need the powerful ones.  Of
course we all have our opinions and beliefs. 

Take Care,


  - JIM



--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Matt S <ibogamail at gmail.com> wrote:


From: Matt S
 <ibogamail at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine detox in USA?
To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>

Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 3:20 PM




  
Hi Jim



I have never been to an ibo treatment facility.  I self treated at
home.  I have heard both good and bad things about most of the
treatment providers out there at this point.  If someone asked me I
would say just to contact various places and talk at length with the
people there and then go with your instinct.  



As for the depression, yes it worked.  The message for me was that I
stuff my feelings, especially feelings of sadness.  I have had this
same message impressed on me several times since both by iboga and
ayahuasca but I am still sort of stuck as to how to fix it.  I like to
think I am making progress though.  The problem is that every so often
a powerful experience from ayahuasca or iboga seems necessary to really
clear out the emotional cellar so to speak but at the same time I am
not as fond of those really powerful experiences as I used to be.  Or
to put it another way, it seems like they become necessary more often
than I actually want to do them.  



Matt





Jim Hadey wrote:

  
    
      
        

Hi Matt,

        

You can do a methadone detox without first going on a

shorter acting opiate, yes it can be done but like you

say it complicates things.  I think Gwen wants to detox

with as little Ibo as possible and with as little visions

as possible or as mild experience as possible.  In other

words she wants off of drugs and is not interested in the 

Bwiti culture or rituals and not really interested in having 

visions or talking to her dead relatives. 

        

I hated the met clinic so bad.  I 

was honest once and told them I was using and needed

some kind of help. I thought that was what they were there 

for.  Well they took away my take homes - yea last time I tell

them anything.  I was mad, I mean I have a problem, was

honest about it and this is what I get.  Since then I gave

them water with a little coffee for color and a drop of

methadone in the bottle for urine tests.  It worked like a charm.

Never told the truth again.  From what I understand they have

different tests and may even watch you pee now.  It was

20 years ago or so.

        

With met 74 mg is not that much in a way, but it another way

it is a hell of a lot like when you try to detox.  I remember the

first time I tried to detox from met 20 mg cold turkey, couldn't 

believe the suffering.  I couldn't do it.  You said you did not 

really have any cravings after your detox - that is great.  One

dose and your good for life - can't beat that.  As you know many

people need a booster after 6 to 9 months or so.  I know that

I needed a booster between the 6 to 9 month period.  It is nice

if you do not need a booster for that can be you done for good.

Tapering is always a good idea but it can be very time consuming.

That is why I mentioned we could help her more if we had more facts

like how much is used and how long and when she is comfortable

I believe she will let us know  You got to remember this is her first
time

writing and she really does not know all these things.  It is also good

to talk to several people and get different opinions and options.  

Your 2 cents is welcome, a little added info gives a better all round 

picture and can help a person get an idea of what to expect.

        

That's one reason I tell people it is not a hallucinogenic like LSD,

I can see a person who is on opiates not wanting anything like

LSD.  Of course we know it but the new people may have no idea.

        

So, if you have been to a detox center please drop Gwen an e-mail

and let her know if it was a good place, not so good or fair or whatever

your opinion may be.  Also, I have been on this list and I seem to have

trouble when asked which place is the best, which place is good if you

do not have much money, which places treat you as a patient and show

kindness and respect, so if you have been to a detox place could you
please

send me a couple of sentences saying if it was good, bad or ugly.  It

would be appreciated.

        

Thank you all,

        

  - JIM

        

P.S.  Matt, did the Ibo work for the depression.  If so good, fair, or
not at all.

        

         Thanks  again

        

        

        

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Matt S <ibogamail at gmail.com>
wrote:

        

From: Matt S <ibogamail at gmail.com>

Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine detox in USA?

To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>

Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 12:28 PM

          

           Hi Jim

          

I just want to put in my 2 cents on what you said about methadone.  It
is not always necessary to switch from methadone to shorter acting
opiates.  I successfully detoxed from 74mg and I have heard of people
coming off of doses as high as 300.  Although it does complicate
matters and makes it more likely that some withdrawal symptoms will
"bleed through" the ibo protective screen if you know what I mean. 
Tapering to as low as you can get is a good idea but usually that means
a long period of time, a fast taper just means you'll be sick which
aint no good.  Also I did not require a booster.  I didn't take
ibogaine again after my detox for 2 and half years and then I was
seeking relief from depression and not any kind of substance use.  But
even without a booster I didn't have any cravings to speak of, well
pretty much ever.  I mean the thought definitely occurs to me sometimes
that it might be nice to get loaded but I haven't had that sort of
deep, yearning, need for dope that I used to have ever since.  As long
as I don't entertain the thoughts there is no compulsive aspect to it
anymore.

          

Matt

          

Jim Hadey wrote:
          
            
              
                
                  


                  

HI Gwen,

                  

May I ask how much methadone are you doing??  Methadone 

and Subutex are the hardest to detox from.  The right thing to 

do is switch from methadone to a shorter acting narcotic.  

The problem is you may not be able to do this.  Many people

switch to morphine sulfate or Oxycontin and get as low as

possible.  

                  

You will need a booster in about 6 months.  See, Ibo really 

does work.  It gives you a 80-90% discount on pain and

suffering and takes away the cravings for 6 to 9 months.

It is not magic but it is the best out there.  You still have

to do your part.  Have you been to any NA meetings?

I personally am not a lover of NA but you really should

find out what they are about.  If you want to stay clean you

must quit hanging around people who use.

                  

If you have money then this place is the Cadillac of detox

                  

Deborah Mash   
www.ibogaine.net - Deborah Mash's 'Healing Transitions Institute'
for Addiction Ibogaine Provider site. (US$3-12k approx.) 

                  

                  

In Canada there is 
www.ibogatherapyhouse.net - The Iboga Therapy House, Vancouver 

I am not sure they take Americans, you will have to call and see.

                  

There are no Ibo detox centers in the U.S.  You basically can choose

from Mexico, Canada, Africa or the Netherlands.  Do not buy any off

the internet for it will be a rip off.  I don't care if the person has
a web site

or whatever if you buy off the net you will get ripped off.

                  

I understand that your an American and you want American medicine

rather than some guy with a painted face jumping up and down.  You

want to detox and quit and hopefully live happily ever after.  However,

you worded it poorly.  American medicine works very poorly against

opiate addiction.  If you say something like some native with his face

painted the people will feel that your a raciest or something like detox in

                  Mexico or someplace
yuck. 
It does not matter if you are or are not they

will perceive you to be one.  In fact the smallest thing can touch off
a storm.

I know your new and meant no disrespect but try not to say things like
that 

for you may of meant it one way and they take it another way.

                  

How much do you know about Ibo??  It is not the kind of thing you take

on Friday after work and return Monday and all is fine.  It is at least

a week before you are together.  After the treatment you will not eat

or sleep very well for a week.  This is normal.  If you were to cold
turkey

methadone you would also not eat or sleep for a week. 

                  

What Ibo does basically is it turns a raging Flu in to a regular cold. 
You

get an 80-90% discount on the pain and suffering, the hot and cold
running

chills, diarrhea, etc.  You end up with the sneezies and maybe a little
cold

chills now and then - much like a regular cold.  But in 6 to 9 months
you

may start to get the cravings again.  What you have to do is take about

1/4 to 1/2 gram and hope to go on staying clean.  Ask about that when

you inquire at the treatment center.  For the poor people they had a
person

come to their house or go to a hotel or motel and do the detox,
sometimes

in America but it is illegal as hell.  Some of these people are OK
others are

not.  

                  

Should someone contact you ask them if they went to a detox center, 

which one and would they recommend it to others.  Ask about the

booster and get all the info you can.  Ibogaine is not like any other 

drug.  It is kind of funny people will write in saying they smoked pot,

used LSD, mushrooms, etc.  It is kind of funny in a way.  Ibo is not

a hallucinogenic, it is labeled as such but it is not.  It is like going

to a large theater with 3 screens and you watch a movie.  You will

forget most of it but remember bits and pieces and as time goes

on you may start to remember certain things.

                  

There is more to Ibo than just kicking dope.  You can use it to change

your life.  Are you happy with your life right now??  Forget your on

methadone just ask yourself are you happy with your life right now.

Ibo will give you a chance to change it.  You decide how you want to

be then act that way and you will become that which you wanted to 

become.  You may want to go further and maybe quit cigarettes and

other bad habits maybe gambling or whatever.  You may decide to  

change you life by helping others, maybe do volunteer work, spending

more time with the family and things like that.  Some people change

their lives around.  Regardless of what you do it should get you off the

methadone.  The last person I talked to several years ago was on 11 mg

of methadone and could not get off.  She took the Ibo treatment and got

rid of the invisible chains.  Again, I could tell you more if I knew
how long

and how much you are taking.  If you up around 100- 150 do not try it -

that's just my opinion.  The best way is to change to a shorter acting
drug

like Oxycontin or MS Contin.  The problem with things like Lortab and 

Percodan is you would need a handful and few doc will write you a

perscription for 300 Lortabs.  It may be possible that you will have to
wait

a while and lower your dose.  Also, how long were you on the methadone

for that can make a difference too??   See, when a person in on opiates

for years and years their brain grows receptors, mu receptors for the 

opiates to go to.  What I think that means you will have cravings most
of

your life.  You have heard that people who are on opiates will go to
prison

for 10 years and the first thing they do when they get out is go and
use.

                  

                  Whatever you do, do
not use
after treatment for you tolerance is zero.

                  Also if you do use a
few days
after detox the Ibo acts as an opiate

                  enhancer and that is
how
people die from it.

                  

Only the poor do the do it yourself.  I see so many people come on and
see

if there is a clinic that accepts payments or any other way.  Sometimes
they

do it themselves at home.  I doubt if this would be a good route for
you to take.

And if you have the money for a proper detox why not do it properly, it
would

be a shame to die trying to kick.  You will get sick and lose your
lunch, the 

danger is should you be on your back and half out of it you could
swallow the

vomit.  Even now with today's technology one out of three who get vomit
into

their lungs die.  

                  

Like I said should someone contact you ask if they know anyone who has

been detoxed and where and what was it like.  That is the best way. 
Most

of the people on the forum are from the low economic class and can not

afford 5 to 10K for a proper detox.  Many do fine doing it at home
themselves.

Sometimes you get so tired of living the life that you feel It will
kill me or cure

me, I am tired of living this kind of life.  I have never been to the
clinics but

the ones in Mexico are decent or you can go to Canada.  If no one
contacts

you I will ask a couple of people to answer a question or two or I will
tell you

who to contact.  Certain people can make suggestions or guide you to
what

you want.  And if I could mention one more thing once you are off drugs
- 

don't take that first hit, pill shot, snort or whatever.  Run away fast
before your 

mind changes, of course you will not be associating with user which is
a great help.

                  

Feel free to drop me a line if there is anything I can do.

                  

Hoped I helped,

                  

  - JIM

 

                  

                  

--- On Mon, 9/28/09, Gwen Sorensen <gwencsorensen at yahoo.com>
wrote:

                  

From: Gwen Sorensen <gwencsorensen at yahoo.com>

Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine detox in USA?

To: ibogaine at mindvox.com

Date: Monday, September 28, 2009, 2:00 AM

                    

                    
                    
                    
                    Hi I ended up here after viewing the ibogaine
film Rite
of Passage. I was hoping to get some info about ibogaine treatment for
methadone. I saw the movie and some of the news stories which were very
impressive, what I'd like to know is if there's anywhere in the USA
where you can get treatment at a hospital or something? The african
everything is interesting but I don't really want to have some guy in
paint dancing around me or go detox in Mexico or someplace yuck. Are
there any nice treatment centers which have doctors and no strange
pseudo cult atmosphere? I don't want to be mean to anyone if that's the
case or disrespect anyone, but I so much do not want a lot of
weirdness, only a safe detox please. I did contact ibogaine.net but was
told that their island detox had shut down years ago and moved to
Cancun but nobody from Cancun ever calls me back and the other clinic
is in Mexico where I so much don't want to go. If there are no nice
clinics in the USA, is there anything in a hospital in the European
Union please, preferably in London or Paris? 

                    

Thank you.

                    

                    
                    
                    

                    
                    

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