[Ibogaine] Ibogain vs Iboga and safety, FDA trials

DC from AZ dcollier9 at cox.net
Mon Jan 19 14:29:37 EST 2009

having said all that, isnt bwiti iboga use much safer than ibogaine 
reference the cardiac data, and so therefore would be eligible for FDA 
trials ?
the article mentions bwiti initiation usage, but does not differentiate that 
one is root bark, the other is a high potency powder.
maybe iboga contains more alcoloids that provide a better effect and less 
ibogaine safety issues may box one into a corner, and should be very careful 
of course. BUT
the usefullness of iboga in general has not been refuted. iboga being the 
root bark or extract from same
we need more safety data from the bwiti per dosages etc
"Love converts hearts, and gives peace."

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Vector Vector" <vector620022002 at yahoo.com>
To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 6:59 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine in the Netherlands

> Yeah that's Sara's house?
> Much more in depth version of the same thing
> http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/360/3/308
> New England Journal of Medicine
> Volume 360:308-309        January 15, 2009        Number 3
> Next
> Long-QT Syndrome Induced by the Antiaddiction Drug Ibogaine
>    PubMed Citation
> To the Editor: Anecdotal evidence suggests that ibogaine alleviates drug 
> craving and relapse of drug use in humans, as has been confirmed for 
> animals.1 Ibogaine is currently used as an antiaddiction drug in 
> alternative medicine. In 1993, the Food and Drug Administration approved a 
> clinical trial in humans to study those effects. The National Institute on 
> Drug Abuse decided not to fund this study because of safety issues.2,3
> Ibogaine is a naturally occurring alkaloid with hallucinogenic and 
> psychedelic effects, derived from the bark of the root of the West African 
> Tabernanthe iboga plant and is used in Gabonian initiation ceremonies. At 
> least 11 sudden deaths were described after ibogaine use, in which the 
> cause of death remained unclear even after autopsy.4 It was hypothesized 
> that ibogaine might dysregulate the autonomic nervous system, causing 
> sudden death.5
> A 31-year-old American woman was admitted to our emergency department 
> because of a seizure-like attack after she had taken a single dose of 3.5 
> g of ibogaine 15% (usual dose, 2 to 6 g). She had not taken any other 
> drugs or alcohol concurrently with the ibogaine. Her medical history was 
> unremarkable, and there was no family history of cardiac-rhythm 
> abnormalities. Besides nausea, she had no specific symptoms to report. She 
> had come to the Netherlands to receive ibogaine as an alternative medicine 
> for treatment-resistant alcohol addiction.
> Electrocardiography showed a severe prolonged QT interval of 548 msec (QT 
> interval corrected for the heart rate, 616 msec) and ventricular 
> tachyarrhythmias during prolonged monitoring (Figure 1). Laboratory 
> findings revealed mild hypomagnesemia (magnesium level, 0.49 mmol per 
> liter [1.2 mg per deciliter]; reference range, 0.70 to 1.00 [1.7 to 2.4]), 
> hypokalemia (potassium level, 3.2 mmol per liter [12.5 mg per deciliter]; 
> reference range, 3.8 to 5.0 [14.9 to 19.5]), and a normal serum osmolal 
> gap (3.1 mOsm per kilogram; reference value, <10). Despite rapid 
> correction of the electrolyte levels, the QT interval remained prolonged. 
> During admission to the intensive care unit, with no further doses of 
> ibogaine given, the QT interval normalized at 42 hours after presentation. 
> The patient was subsequently discharged, in good condition.
> In this case, ibogaine use was associated with severe lengthening of the 
> QT interval and ventricular tachyarrhythmias, which normalized after 42 
> hours. These findings are suggestive of a causal relation. The electrolyte 
> imbalance may also have played a role. The previously described sudden 
> deaths may thus have been caused by cardiac-rhythm abnormalities induced 
> by QT-interval lengthening, ventricular tachyarrhythmias, or both.
> At the doses currently used, ibogaine can lead to serious cardiac-rhythm 
> abnormalities. The use and possible future trials of the drug should be 
> permitted only under strict medical observation and continuous 
> electrocardiographic monitoring.
> Dianne W.M. Hoelen, M.D.
> Wilko Spiering, M.D., Ph.D.
> Gerlof D. Valk, M.D., Ph.D.
> University Medical Center Utrecht
> 3584 CX Utrecht, the Netherlands
> g.d.valk at umcutrecht.nl
> References
> He D-Y, McGough NNH, Ravindranathan A, et al. Glial cell line-derived 
> neurotrophic factor mediates the desirable actions of the anti-addiction 
> drug ibogaine against alcohol consumption. J Neurosci 2005;25:619-628. 
> [Free Full Text]
> Vastag B. Addiction treatment strives for legitimacy. JAMA 2002;288:3096, 
> 3099-101.
> Vastag B. Addiction research -- ibogaine therapy: a `vast, uncontrolled 
> experiment.' Science 2005;308:345-346. [Erratum, Science 2005;308:1260.] 
> [Free Full Text]
> Lotsof HS, Wachtel B. Manual for ibogaine therapy: screening, safety, 
> monitoring & aftercare. Second revision. The Ibogaine Dossier, 2003. 
> (Accessed December 22, 2008, at http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.html.)
> Maas U, Strubelt S. Fatalities after taking ibogaine in addiction 
> treatment could be related to sudden cardiac death caused by autonomic 
> dysfunction. Med Hypotheses 2006;67:960-964. [Medline]
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Mindvox <mindvox at lunartproductions.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Monday, January 19, 2009 5:22:25 AM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine in the Netherlands
> Near-fatal treatment in the Netherlands...
> Links:
> http://www.artsennet.nl/content/resources//AMGATE_6059_1_TICH_R2438011050651223//
>    'Afkickmedicijn’ ibogaïne veroorzaakt hartritmestoornis
> Bron(nen): UMC Utrecht
> Smart drug en ‘afkickmedicijn’ ibogaïne kan dodelijke hartritme 
> stoornissen veroorzaken. Dit schrijven artsen van het UMC Utrecht in een 
> case report in het tijdschrift New England Journal of Medicine van 15 
> januari. Ze verklaren daarmee als eerste de schadelijkheid van het 
> omstreden middel.
> In het case report beschrijven internisten een 31-jarige Amerikaanse vrouw 
> die op de spoedeisende hulp van het UMC Utrecht kwam nadat zij onwel was 
> geworden na het gebruik van ibogaïne. Dit had zij gebruikt om van haar 
> alcoholverslaving af te komen. Tijdens haar behandeling op de spoedeisende 
> hulp kreeg zij een ernstige hartritmestoornis. Het duurde bijna twee dagen 
> voordat de hartritmestoornis was verdwenen. Het verband tussen het gebruik 
> van ibogaïne en het optreden van de hartritmestoornis ligt volgens de 
> artsen van het UMC Utrecht voor de hand.
> Ibogaï vrij verkrijgbaar
> Ibogaïne is in een beperkt aantal landen, waaronder Nederland, vrij 
> verkrijgbaar. Het wordt gebruikt als smart drug. Daarnaast claimen 
> alternatieve genezers en sommige artsen dat een eenmalige dosis van het 
> middel mensen van hun drugs- of alcoholverslaving af kan helpen. Voor dit 
> effect bestaan weliswaar wetenschappelijke aanwijzingen bij proefdieren, 
> grootschalige onderzoeken bij mensen ontbreken echter. Onderzoek naar 
> ibogaïne is lastig omdat het middel levensgevaarlijk kan zijn. Het is 
> bekend dat gebruikers van ibogaïne soms overlijden. Waardoor dat komt was 
> tot nu toe onduidelijk.
> Hulpmiddel afkicken
> “Ibogaine wordt momenteel in Nederland gebruikt als hulpmiddel bij het 
> afkicken in situaties zonder medisch toezicht waardoor het juist 
> levensbedreigend kan zijn”, concludeert internist-endocrinoloog dr. Gerlof 
> Valk van het UMC Utrecht, één van de internisten betrokken bij de opvang 
> van de patiënt. “De risico’s voor de gezondheid gelden zowel voor de 
> toepassing als smart drug, maar ook voor het gebruik als afkickmiddel. Wij 
> vinden dat ibogaïne alleen onder medisch toezicht gebruikt mag worden voor 
> therapeutische doeleinden.”
> De artsen hebben de ibogaïne-vergiftiging gemeld bij de Inspectie voor de 
> Gezondheidszorg.
> Translation:
>    Detox-medicine ibogaïne cause heart rhythm impairment
> Source (nen): UMC Utrecht
> Smart drug and `detox-medicine' ibogaïne can cause deadly heart rhythm 
> impairments. This letter doctors of the UMC Utrecht in a case report in 
> the illustrated magazine New England Journal or Medicine of 15 January. 
> They explain with that as first the harmfulness of the controversial 
> means.
> In case report internists describe a 31 year old American woman who came 
> on the emergency service of the UMC Utrecht after she had become 
> indisposed after the use of ibogaïne. This had they uses to descend of its 
> alcohol addiction. During its treatment on the emergency service she got a 
> serious heart rhythm impairment. It lasted almost two days before the 
> heart rhythm impairment had disappeared. The link between the use of 
> ibogaïne and acting the heart rhythm impairment lies according to the 
> doctors of the UMC Utrecht for the hand.
> Ibogaï rather available
> Ibogaïne are a number of countries limited in, among which the 
> Netherlands, rather available. It is used as smart drug. Moreover 
> alternative healers claim and some doctors that a one-off amount of the 
> means people of their drugs or alcohol addiction finished can help. For 
> this impact indeed scientific indications exist at test animals, 
> large-scale researches at people are lacking however. Study into ibogaïne 
> is cumbersome because the means can be perilous. It has been confessed 
> that users of ibogaïne die sometimes. How that comes were so far unclear.
> Appliances kick the habit
> Ibogaine are at present used in the Netherlands as appliances at kick the 
> habit in situations without medical supervision as a result of which it 
> can be correctly life-threatening, internist endocrinoloog conclude dr. 
> Gerlof falcon of the UMC Utrecht, one of the internists involved at the 
> relief of the patient. The risk for health applies both for the 
> application and smart drug, but also for the use as afkickmiddel. We find 
> that ibogaïne can be only used under medical supervision for therapeutic 
> aims.
> The doctors have communicated ibogaïne poisoning at the inspection for the 
> health care.
> AND:
> http://www.trouw.nl/nieuws/Wetenschap/article1959054.ece/Afkickdrug_kan_dodelijk_uitpakken_.html
> Afkickdrug kan dodelijk uitpakken
> De iboga-wortel, een populair alternatief middel tegen verslaving, kan 
> dodelijke hartritmestoornissen geven. In Utrecht is een vrouw er bijna aan 
> overleden.
> Een 31-jarige Amerikaanse vrouw heeft ternauwernood een vergiftiging met 
> een extract van de Afrikaanse iboga-wortel overleefd. Ze was speciaal naar 
> Nederland gekomen om zich met dit sterk hallucinogene middel, ibogaïne, te 
> laten behandelen tegen haar alcoholverslaving.
> De drug, in de meeste landen verboden, is in Nederland toegestaan. Hij 
> wordt in het alternatieve circuit gebruikt, naar verluidt met groot 
> succes. Met één dosis ibogaïne raak je een paar dagen compleet van de 
> wereld. Als je wakker wordt, ben je clean, zo wil het verhaal.
> Maar bij de Amerikaanse liep het anders. Ze belandde op de intensive care 
> van het Universitair Medisch Centrum Utrecht, met ernstige 
> hartritmestoornissen die haar fataal dreigden te worden. Pas na twee dagen 
> herstelde het hart zich, melden haar artsen vandaag in het vakblad The New 
> England Journal of Medicine. Ze hebben de Inspectie voor de 
> Gezondheidszorg gewaarschuwd.
> „Op zich kunnen we niet met zekerheid vaststellen dat ibogaïne de oorzaak 
> van de klachten was”, relativeert de behandelend internist Gerlof Valk. 
> „Maar de aanwijzingen zijn sterk. De klachten begonnen kort na de inname 
> en verdwenen een paar dagen later. De patiënte had verder geen middelen 
> gebruikt. Lichamelijk konden we ook geen andere verklaring vinden.”
> De artsen noemen de vondst belangrijk omdat deze nieuw licht werpt op de 
> raadselachtige dood van elf eerdere ibogaïne-gebruikers. Zelfs een 
> autopsie heeft in die gevallen geen duidelijkheid gebracht over de 
> doodsoorzaak. Het bleef daardoor onzeker of de drug de boosdoener was, of 
> misschien de alcohol of iets anders wat de slachtoffers tegelijkertijd 
> hadden ingenomen.
> De nieuwe waarneming, waarbij de drug als het ware ’op heterdaad’ is 
> betrapt, maakt het volgens de Utrechtse artsen een stuk aannemelijker dat 
> het middel zelf riskant is. Ze pleiten er daarom voor om de stof voortaan 
> alleen nog onder medische begeleiding en onder permanente hartbewaking toe 
> te dienen. Dat zou het gebruik door alternatieve therapeuten sterk 
> bemoeilijken.
> Overigens is het de vraag of ibogaïne echt zo fabelachtig tegen verslaving 
> werkt als alternatieve therapeuten beweren. „Op internet zijn allerlei 
> filmpjes te zien van mensen die dankzij ibogaïne van hun verslaving zijn 
> afgekomen”, zegt Valk. „Maar hard wetenschappelijk bewijs ontbreekt.” Goed 
> onderzoek met patiënten is nooit gedaan, onder meer vanwege twijfel over 
> de veiligheid. Wel is gekeken naar verslaafde ratjes; die toonden zich 
> dankzij ibogaïne inderdaad minder afhankelijk van morfine, cocaïne of 
> alcohol.
> Hoeveel mensen zich tot nu toe met de drug hebben laten behandelen, is 
> onduidelijk. Het tv-programma ’Nova’ repte in 2006 van duizenden mensen 
> wereldwijd, en van ruim 220 patiënten die door de Nederlandse therapeute 
> Sara Glatt waren geholpen. In de uitzending stelde een deskundige dat de 
> reguliere verslavingszorg met ibogaïne een grote kans liet liggen.
> Behalve als afkickmedicijn gebruiken sommigen de iboga-wortel als smart 
> drug, omdat hij zo’n intense en langdurige roes veroorzaakt. Die diepe 
> trance is ook de reden waarom Afrikaanse stammen de plant inzetten tijdens 
> riten.
> Translation:
> Detox-drug can unpack deadly
> Iboga-root, the popular alternative means against addiction, can give 
> deadly heart rhythm impairments. In Utrecht a woman is there almost to 
> deceased.
> A 31 year old American woman a poisoning with an extract of African 
> iboga-root has just survived. She especially to the Netherlands had come 
> with this strongly hallucinogenic means, ibogaïne, let treat itself 
> against its alcohol addiction.
> The drug, prohibited in the most countries, in the Netherlands it has been 
> permitted. He is used in the alternative circuit, according to reports 
> with large success. With one amount of ibogaïne touch you a couple days 
> completely of the world. If you become awake, be you clean, this way it 
> wants tale.
> But at American it ran differently. She ended up on the intensive care of 
> the university medical centre Utrecht, with serious heart rhythm 
> impairments which threatened become its fatally. Just after two days 
> repaired the heart, its doctors communicate themselves The New England 
> Journal or Medicine today in the profession booklet. They have warned the 
> inspection for the health care.
> „In itself cannot determine we with certainty that ibogaïne were the cause 
> of the complaints, relativise the treating internist Gerlof falcon. „But 
> the indications are strong. Days started the complaints later shortly 
> after ingestion and disappeared a couple. The patient had further used no 
> resources. Physically we could find other declaration also no.
> The doctors call the find important because these throw slightly new on 
> enigmatic dead of eleven earlier ibogaïne users. Even an autopsy has which 
> fallen no clarity brought concerning the cause of death. It remained 
> uncertainly as a result, or the drug the cause was, or perhaps the alcohol 
> or something else what the victims had taken at the same time.
> New perception, where the drug as it were has been caught, makes it 
> according to the Utrechtse doctors a piece more plausible that the means 
> himself is risky. They plead for this reason to administer the substance 
> as of now only still under medical accompaniment and under permanent heart 
> guarding. That it strongly would hamper use by alternative therapists.
> Moreover it is the question if ibogaïne work really this way fabulous 
> against addiction such as alternative therapists claim. „On Internet are 
> all kinds of see small films of people who have descended thanks to 
> ibogaïne of their addiction, say falcon. „But rapidly scientific proof are 
> lacking. Well research with patients has been never done, including 
> because of doubt concerning the security. However, it has been looked at 
> to addictive little rats; those showed themselves thanks to ibogaïne 
> indeed less dependent on morphine, cocaine or alcohol.
> How many people itself so far with the drug have let treat, is unclear. 
> The tv-programma Nova' mentioned in 2006, of thousands of people 
> worldwide, and of wide 220 patients who had been helped by the Dutch 
> therapist Sara Glatt. In the retransmission put to an expert to that to 
> the regular care and treatment of drug addicts with ibogaïne to a large 
> chance let lie.
> Except as detox-drug uses some iboga-root as smart drug, because he causes 
> such a intense and long-term fuddle. That deep trance is also the reason 
> why descends African the plant uses during rites.
> Translation is done through an online web translator, so as you just read, 
> it is not very accurate...
> Best Wishes,
> Ben De Loenen
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