[Ibogaine] (is mental illness a disease

Peter Ferreira shayamoya at polka.co.za
Wed Jun 4 05:12:34 EDT 2008


Juliano,

I think you're crazy

Regards

Peter

On 04 Jun 2008, at 10:43 AM, Juliano wrote:

> Hey chi,
>
> LOL, oh puleeeze! you'll have to do better than that!
>
> regarde
>
> Juliano
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: chi malan
> To: The Ibogaine List
> Sent: Wednesday, June 04, 2008 5:29 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (is mental illness a disease
>
>
>
> "The bottom line Mason is this: Where is your proof that mental  
> illness is a disease?
>
> regarde
>
> Juliano"
>
> if you search dictionary.com for the word disease, yes mental  
> illness is considered a disease
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Mason Shipley
> To: The Ibogaine List
> Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 10:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (no subject)
>
>
> Juliano, I haven't really really read the religious debate or what  
> you're saying about Satanism, but out of all the people I've ever  
> known in positions of power who abused it, they were doing so in  
> the name of capitalism, no religion or devil involved. If you want  
> to label people who do that as bad, that's your call, but it's all  
> about money, not inverted pentacles or whatever.
>
> What you have to say about mental illness I've taken the time to  
> read and I gotta tell you, having an Aunt who is schizophrenic and  
> growing up around her, her problem was really not being labelled by  
> the capitalist fascist state, her problem was that her brain was  
> not functioning "normally" and without her medication which caused  
> all kids of other side effects, she was a raving paranoid person  
> who could not in any way at all function enough to even remember to  
> feed herself or put on her clothes when she walked outside.
>
> I very much get the feeling that most of your theories are pie in  
> the sky mental masturbation and don't connect with reality too  
> much. Have you any personal experience whatsoever with either  
> addiction or mental illness? I'm going to guess that psychiatrists  
> may not have helped you much and you didn't appreciate them if  
> you've ever encountered them, but you seem not to be mentally ill,  
> just another person who likes to trip and has assembled an ad hoc  
> hodgepodge of new age theories.
>
> If that helps you get through the day, more power to you.
>
> On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>  
> wrote:
> Hey Sara,
>
> I know it is not simple, I really do. But ALSo you have to  
> understand that
> powers that be can make things seem very complex! And they will do  
> this by
> 'blinding us' with science, and using lingo that cannot be  
> understood by
> ordinary people. Are you familiar with 'gobblydegook', and  
> 'legalize'??
> These are all forms of communication designed to keep us--the common
> people--the hell out, and to manipulate us.
>
> Regarding shamans etc. of course there will be people who have the  
> skill of
> healing. But also understand that so do you. Dont give all your  
> power to
> anotyher. Cultivate your own power. And authentic healer will tell  
> you it is
> you that heals yourself. They act as a conduit.
>
> regarding 'mentally ill' people 'who cant take care of themselves'.  
> Again,
> we have to ask WHY? For if mental illness is a myth, then we ned a  
> different
> kind of approach. FIRST you have to understand it is a myth. if you  
> try and
> wonder what to do beliving it is biolgical disease, I see that as  
> looking
> blind at the problem.
>
> regarde
>
> Juliano
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Sara Glatt" <sara119 at xs4all.nl>
> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (no subject)
>
>
> > Hi Juliano,
> >
> > there is no need to go anywhere to do something about yourself,  
> the truth
> > is that some people who are named Shaman or Medicine man or woman  
> do have
> > healing energies, just like some plants and animals do.
> >
> > for example, in Israel lives a lady who can't get children, she was
> > a victim of war crimes in the 2ed world war, now
> > many years after she gives blessing to women who can not get  
> pregnant,
> > (medically could not get any help) and most of her blessing are  
> working.
> >
> > there is another lady who experienced peyote in the Indian  
> reservation she
> > can heal people tuning into that vibe she experienced while on  
> Peyote
> > and she is using it for channeling healing energies.
> >
> > Cabalistic healing, healing mantra's are also things we can learn,
> > but we are not all capable to do so,then we look for help.
> >
> > when people are mentally ill they don't think about themselves.
> > I have treated a man who thought he was The Messiah, and a lady  
> who heard
> > voices, who were controlling her life,
> > also a person who didn't know where he was and what he should be  
> eating
> > or drinking, just tripping from too much interferon medication.
> > those people couldn't take care of the most simple things kids  
> know how
> > to do. they all got medication after their family couldn't take  
> care of
> > them.
> >
> > this is just to give you the idea that it is not that simple as  
> you think,
> > people are complex being, the good, the bad and the ugly.
> >
> > Hi Simon,
> >>
> >> You said: " I want to say some thing about the fact that you  
> said "these
> >> secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"
> >>
> >> Actually I said that the secret is already out. That in  
> principle people
> >> could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get
> >> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> >> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
> >> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
> >>
> >> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
> >> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole  
> ediface is
> >> built
> >> on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really  
> function as
> >> social control. And usually it has always been the poor that  
> have been
> >> the
> >> main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive  
> system that
> >> is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically.  
> But that
> >> ,especially, the latter%2
> >
> >
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