From doranman2 at gmail.com  Sun Jun  1 05:46:24 2008
From: doranman2 at gmail.com (Scott Doran)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 05:46:24 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] harm reduction
In-Reply-To: <48415F9E.4000100@gmail.com>
References: <987987.91323.qm@web28613.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<BLU141-W338E82F60ED74222B6A24DAFBE0@phx.gbl>
	<48415F9E.4000100@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <394bc6bd0806010246n2c9e393ev767cf5d9e72a51ef@mail.gmail.com>

I noticed the vote on this bill broke down heavily upon party  lines. This
is the email I sent to Rep Cliff Stearn, a Republican in my area. I hope we
can vote in at least a Democrat next time around.


Local communities should decide how best to fight the spread of HIV. Syringe
exchanges are proven to help reduce HIV & Hepatitis C infection and also
provide important links to drug treatment. As an RN who has worked in drug
treatment, and contracted Hep C through a needle stick, I would like to see
more citizens protected from blood borne disease  It's time to lift the
federal ban on syringe exchange funding.  Will you sir, please sign the
Cummings/Castle letter? For what it costs to care for one person with HIV,
30 cases could be prevented by this program. This is a health issue, not a
moral one. Most voters in my area, once they are educated on this issue,
support needle exchange programs. Thank you your time in the consideration
of this important issue.
Sincerely,
Scott Doran RN

On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 10:24 AM, Matt Shriver <ibogamail at gmail.com> wrote:

>  Hi Matt
>
> Thanks for the constructive criticism.  I still haven't sent it, I feel it
> needs a little more polishing.  I considered cutting the part about
> mentioning my own use but I thought it sort of brought a little legitimacy
> to it, but then again I agree with you that some people will actually see it
> as removing the legitimacy.
>
> Matt
>
> Matthew Zielinski wrote:
>
> Good job Matt!.  Its articulate, succint and introduces ibogaine!
>
> I personally wouldn't mention the using part.   I think it might alter the
> credibility of the article.
>
> But very well done my friend!
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
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From juliano8 at ntlworld.com  Sun Jun  1 07:51:57 2008
From: juliano8 at ntlworld.com (Juliano)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 12:51:57 +0100
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>

Hi Simon,

You said: " I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;" 

Actually I said that the secret is already out. That in principle people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man. 

Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as social control. And usually it has always been the poor that have been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even be acknowledged by the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds brutality is being said to be the reality

A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away): IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
 Because the paradigm, 'communism' was believed to be the 'reality', and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he may feel they are 'not-normal', right?

So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist' system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental illness', and all that that means in the community. How others think and behave with you, and how you think about yourself. 

Really the question is not who is going to fund this myth, it is how to EXPOSE this myth. Show the roots of this evil myth. Because not only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!

regarde

Juliano
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: simon loxton 
  To: The Ibogaine List 
  Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


  I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the people who should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or stuck with their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc. Where I am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a semi-working condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving the care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a change in the approach to the type of care or medication these people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to these people? The only people that would possibly have access are the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.


  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
  To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
  Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


  This is the most powerful of statements,  
    One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.
   And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.  Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so many concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very whole for me.  
  There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that people some times display.  I say people because on this list at least most have had at least one type of break that is indescribable for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of treatment for Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats the truth.  I see the truth.  
  http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
  So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage. 

  Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to look at the whole picture.

  Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook format.
  http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm

   I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.  
  Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
  Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look at Spirit and how that fits into the works.  
  The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon, Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people.  NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things, I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical community has failed to treat people.  

  Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.  

  Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the better good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for currently.  And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a very 1:1 level.  
  My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.  Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
  Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad your helping fight it.
  Mel


  On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote: 
    Hi Simon,

    I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological disease. There are no tests.
    Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't make them diseases.
    rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill', and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up, and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the bigger picture--the community, society, culture, world, is conveniently not being looked at.

    So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military industrial complex!....the whole schbangle. Otherwise, you can only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No matter how arduous it may be to look!

    We have to look. Not only because people are suffering under this oppression, but the very planet and its species are suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.

    In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie., in that short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.

    Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but usually we dont hear it about drinkers.

    So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical disease but a process!

    Of?

    To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing energy that takes over. And the person may experience mythical visions etc etc.
    What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these visions. Drug them away. And the person is given nervous-system damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this challenges their worldviews.

    One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.

    THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set & Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal' as psychotic.

    it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently shared his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..

    See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.

    This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.

    regarde

    Juliano


      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: simon loxton 
      To: The Ibogaine List 
      Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
      Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
      I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails; they seem to me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the point I apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled circumstances or approached medically. I would just like to get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are to be used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly in people that have borderline personality disorders or mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any other description other than mental imbalance and personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to describe the type of persons where this type of medication would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only going with my limited understanding of mental illness but have witnessed these types of problems in people and especially instances where these conditions were aggravated or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental illness and think there is enough evidence to support its existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look forward to your comment. 
      I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting. This was at the stage where they were trying to figure out what LSD was useful for.
      ----- Original Message ---- 
      From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
      To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
      Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
      Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
      Hi Randy,

      Sorry to hear about your son.

      Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit. we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
      And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)

      regarde

      Juliano
        ----- Original Message ----- 
        From: Randy Faulconer 
        To: The Ibogaine List 
        Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
        Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
                 Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it up".............He He
               Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many to talk about really.

                 My son got himself in some pretty deep shit, all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of everything but the probation violation so he has to do 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried like a baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root of all of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell with him and it killed be to think of him in jail like that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can adapt to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she smoked with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough to make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of saint or anything but I think I might have made a little difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the ink. That was my fault.

              I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the right way here on the list, a couple of people that I really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.

             I'm still working on getting treatment reports and accounts together so yall that haven't sent one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a few of you that have been here a while now that haven't sent an account, and I think that you all are important to the movement, we need to hear from you. You know who you are. Some of the old timers too.

              I'll try and write a little more to the list. It makes me feel better and that is what this list is for, not just dry information. We need all the information we can get but dealing with feelings is just as important. My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but I'll take the risk. 

                 Peace Love and Kindness
                    Randy
                 BiscuitBoy Blues 
        On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com> wrote: 
          Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure 
          On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> wrote: 
            I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy for a while... I miss your witty repartae randy...... email back so that I chan feel the love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep you are doing good.... let me know if can help if you are having problems....... mujch love...... 
            junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by thry ihg
            specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.

            if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
              ----- Original Message ----- 
              From: Brad Hays 
              To: The Ibogaine List 
              Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
              Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article barcelona conference
              Would love to see all of this Howard, and thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd like to see that article in opposition to ibogaine too if it's around. 
              On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com> wrote: 
                I had forwarded the entire newsletter of May 11/12 from the Barcelona conference that had the promotional article for the ibogaine session to this list but, it does not appear to have landed.;  I have thus hoping that the article alone that is much smaller will work. A later edition of the Daily Update newsletter contained an article in opposition to ibogaine but, there is no doubt that ibogaine prevailed during the special session in which ibogaine presentations took place and in the minds and hearts of drug users and drug policy activists. 
                I will see if I can get all of the slide shows and articles into a composite report within the next few weeks.
                Howard
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From wleetheriot at ca.rr.com  Sun Jun  1 08:54:08 2008
From: wleetheriot at ca.rr.com (Warren Theriot)
Date: Sun, 01 Jun 2008 05:54:08 -0700
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
Message-ID: <48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>

Word.
What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city 
where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key 
words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine 
  to get free from the anger I felt and the damned 
prescription pain medications and returned home to this 
environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not 
let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing 
the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door 
day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put 
up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral 
meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my 
ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a 
year and three months in this environment.
Peace someday...
Warren


Juliano wrote:
> Hi Simon,
>  
> You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you said 
> "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>  
> Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle 
> people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get 
> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery 
> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>  
> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health 
> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is 
> built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function 
> as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that have 
> been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive 
> system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also 
> psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even 
> be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds 
> brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>  
> A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away): 
> IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be 
> dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and 
> forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the 'reality', 
> and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if 
> the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he 
> may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>  
> So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist' 
> system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about 
> this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this 
> system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include 
> being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as 
> an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental 
> illness', and all that that means in the community. How others think and 
> behave with you, and how you think about yourself. 
>  
> Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it is how 
> to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth. Because not 
> only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now 
> under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
>  
> regarde
>  
> Juliano
> 
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
> 
>     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I
>     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets
>     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the
>     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the people who
>     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or stuck with
>     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc. Where I
>     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a semi-working
>     condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving the
>     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen
>     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats
>     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a
>     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
>     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really
>     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to
>     these people? The only people that would possibly have access are
>     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
>     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of
>     decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is
>     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats
>     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
> 
>     ----- Original Message ----
>     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
>     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
> 
>     This is the most powerful of statements,  
> 
>         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would
>         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>         support, yes.
> 
>      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong. 
>     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking
>     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so many
>     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very
>     whole for me. 
>     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now
>     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch
>     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
>     people some times display.  I say people because on this list at
>     least most have had at least one type of break that is indescribable
>     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of treatment for
>     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the
>     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol
>     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats
>     the truth.  I see the truth. 
>     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know
>     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
>     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>      
>     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
>     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
>     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to
>     look at the whole picture.
>      
>     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook format.
>     http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>      
>      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just
>     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have
>     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down
>     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant. 
>     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and
>     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely
>     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look
>     at Spirit and how that fits into the works. 
>     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon,
>     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
>     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to
>     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people. 
>     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things,
>     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat
>     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
>     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the
>     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>     community has failed to treat people. 
>      
>     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've
>     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much
>     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality
>     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine. 
>      
>     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a
>     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
>     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the better
>     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to
>     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his
>     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for currently. 
>     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a
>     very 1:1 level. 
>     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being
>     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional. 
>     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all
>     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
>     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad
>     your helping fight it.
>     Mel
>      
>      
>     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
> 
>         Hi Simon,
>          
>         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start
>         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological
>         disease. There are no tests.
>         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
>         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't
>         make them diseases.
>         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill',
>         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up,
>         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
>         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, is
>         conveniently not being looked at.
>          
>         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which
>         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the
>         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military
>         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/, you can
>         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No
>         matter how arduous it may be to look!
>          
>         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering under
>         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
>         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we
>         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western
>         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
>          
>         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
>         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>         experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie.,
>         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature
>         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
>         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>          
>         Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via
>         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing
>         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very
>         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
>         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am
>         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>          
>         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not
>         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical
>         disease but a process!
>          
>         Of?
>          
>         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
>         pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized
>         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing
>         energy that takes over. And the person may experience mythical
>         visions etc etc.
>         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
>         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given nervous-system
>         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as
>         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this
>         challenges their worldviews.
>          
>         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be
>         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.
>          
>         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set &
>         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a
>         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal'
>         as psychotic.
>          
>         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
>         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently shared
>         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For
>         simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed
>         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues
>         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>          
>         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's
>         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own
>         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
>         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent
>         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>          
>         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for
>         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>          
>         regarde
>          
>         Juliano
>          
>          
> 
>             ----- Original Message -----
>             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>             lately (randy)
>             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails;
>             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are
>             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the point I
>             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
>             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have
>             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
>             circumstances or approached medically. I would just like to
>             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are to be
>             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly
>             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
>             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any
>             other description other than mental imbalance and
>             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to
>             describe the type of persons where this type of medication
>             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only
>             going with my limited understanding of mental illness but
>             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>             especially instances where these conditions were aggravated
>             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I
>             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where
>             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical
>             environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of
>             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>             illness and think there is enough evidence to support its
>             existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding
>             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
>             forward to your comment.
>             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD
>             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting.
>             This was at the stage where they were trying to figure out
>             what LSD was useful for.
>             ----- Original Message ----
>             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>             (randy)
>             Hi Randy,
>              
>             Sorry to hear about your son.
>              
>             Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS
>             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please
>             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit.
>             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
>             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>              
>             regarde
>              
>             Juliano
> 
>                 ----- Original Message -----
>                 *From:* Randy Faulconer <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>                 lately (randy)
>                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my
>                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I
>                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>                 up".............He He
>                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
>                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a
>                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many
>                 to talk about really.
>                  
>                          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit,
>                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it
>                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been
>                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in
>                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of
>                 everything but the probation violation so he has to do
>                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried like a
>                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad
>                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping
>                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I
>                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root of all
>                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but
>                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell
>                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail like
>                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can adapt
>                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is
>                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot
>                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she smoked
>                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
>                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I
>                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough
>                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of
>                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a little
>                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got
>                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the ink.
>                 That was my fault.
>                  
>                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but
>                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a
>                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the
>                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
>                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm
>                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I
>                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
>                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I
>                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
>                  
>                      I'm still working on getting treatment reports and
>                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a
>                 few of you that have been here a while now that haven't
>                 sent an account, and I think that you all are important
>                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You know who
>                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
>                  
>                       I'll try and write a little more to the list. It
>                 makes me feel better and that is what this list is for,
>                 not just dry information. We need all the information we
>                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as important.
>                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I
>                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but
>                 I'll take the risk. 
>                  
>                          Peace Love and Kindness
>                             Randy
>                          BiscuitBoy Blues
>                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
>                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
>                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
> 
>                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy
>                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>                         randy...... email back so that I chan feel the
>                         love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep
>                         you are doing good.... let me know if can help
>                         if you are having problems....... mujch love......
>                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a
>                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by
>                         thry ihg
>                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three
>                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from
>                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or email,
>                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
>                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
>                          
>                         if someone you love is addicted to something
>                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
> 
>                             ----- Original Message -----
>                             *From:* Brad Hays
>                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
>                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article
>                             barcelona conference
>                             Would love to see all of this Howard, and
>                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd
>                             like to see that article in opposition to
>                             ibogaine too if it's around.
>                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard
>                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
> 
>                                 I had forwarded the entire newsletter of
>                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona conference
>                                 that had the promotional article for the
>                                 ibogaine session to this list but, it
>                                 does not appear to have landed.;  I have
>                                 thus hoping that the article alone that
>                                 is much smaller will work. A later
>                                 edition of the Daily Update newsletter
>                                 contained an article in opposition to
>                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt that
>                                 ibogaine prevailed during the special
>                                 session in which ibogaine presentations
>                                 took place and in the minds and hearts
>                                 of drug users and drug policy activists.
>                                 I will see if I can get all of the slide
>                                 shows and articles into a composite
>                                 report within the next few weeks.
>                                 Howard
> 
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From JUNKBOY64 at MSN.COM  Sun Jun  1 09:33:41 2008
From: JUNKBOY64 at MSN.COM (LEE)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 07:33:41 -0600
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>

Warren,
I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all citys have a nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of each offence, even if the cops don't catch the dog, then after you have enough evidince to give to the animal cruality people, they will take the dog away, rehabilate it and find it a good home.........(ive had neighbors who wouldn't take care of their dog)
just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
junky


specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.

if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Warren Theriot<mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com> 
  To: The Ibogaine List<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com> 
  Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


  Word.
  What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city 
  where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
  What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key 
  words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine 
    to get free from the anger I felt and the damned 
  prescription pain medications and returned home to this 
  environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not 
  let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing 
  the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door 
  day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put 
  up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral 
  meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my 
  ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a 
  year and three months in this environment.
  Peace someday...
  Warren


  Juliano wrote:
  > Hi Simon,
  >  
  > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you said 
  > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
  >  
  > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle 
  > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get 
  > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
  > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery 
  > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
  >  
  > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health 
  > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is 
  > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function 
  > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that have 
  > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive 
  > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also 
  > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even 
  > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds 
  > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
  >  
  > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away): 
  > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be 
  > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and 
  > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
  >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the 'reality', 
  > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if 
  > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he 
  > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
  >  
  > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist' 
  > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about 
  > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this 
  > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include 
  > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as 
  > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental 
  > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others think and 
  > behave with you, and how you think about yourself. 
  >  
  > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it is how 
  > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth. Because not 
  > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now 
  > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
  >  
  > regarde
  >  
  > Juliano
  > 
  >     ----- Original Message -----
  >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>>
  >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
  >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
  > 
  >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I
  >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets
  >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the
  >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the people who
  >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or stuck with
  >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc. Where I
  >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a semi-working
  >     condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving the
  >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen
  >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats
  >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a
  >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
  >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really
  >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to
  >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access are
  >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
  >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
  >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of
  >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is
  >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats
  >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
  > 
  >     ----- Original Message ----
  >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com<mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
  >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
  >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
  > 
  >     This is the most powerful of statements,  
  > 
  >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
  >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would
  >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
  >         support, yes.
  > 
  >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong. 
  >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking
  >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so many
  >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very
  >     whole for me. 
  >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now
  >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
  >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch
  >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
  >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list at
  >     least most have had at least one type of break that is indescribable
  >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of treatment for
  >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the
  >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol
  >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats
  >     the truth.  I see the truth. 
  >     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm<http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm>
  >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know
  >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
  >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
  >      
  >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
  >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
  >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to
  >     look at the whole picture.
  >      
  >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook format.
  >     http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
  >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>>
  >      
  >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
  >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just
  >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have
  >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down
  >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant. 
  >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and
  >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely
  >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
  >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look
  >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works. 
  >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon,
  >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
  >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to
  >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people. 
  >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things,
  >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat
  >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
  >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the
  >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
  >     community has failed to treat people. 
  >      
  >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
  >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've
  >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much
  >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality
  >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine. 
  >      
  >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a
  >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
  >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the better
  >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to
  >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his
  >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for currently. 
  >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a
  >     very 1:1 level. 
  >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
  >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being
  >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional. 
  >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all
  >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
  >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad
  >     your helping fight it.
  >     Mel
  >      
  >      
  >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
  >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>> wrote:
  > 
  >         Hi Simon,
  >          
  >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start
  >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological
  >         disease. There are no tests.
  >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
  >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't
  >         make them diseases.
  >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
  >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill',
  >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up,
  >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
  >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, is
  >         conveniently not being looked at.
  >          
  >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which
  >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the
  >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military
  >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/, you can
  >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No
  >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
  >          
  >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering under
  >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
  >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
  >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we
  >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western
  >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
  >          
  >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
  >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
  >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie.,
  >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature
  >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
  >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
  >          
  >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via
  >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing
  >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very
  >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
  >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am
  >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
  >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
  >          
  >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not
  >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical
  >         disease but a process!
  >          
  >         Of?
  >          
  >         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
  >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized
  >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing
  >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience mythical
  >         visions etc etc.
  >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
  >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given nervous-system
  >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as
  >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this
  >         challenges their worldviews.
  >          
  >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
  >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be
  >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.
  >          
  >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set &
  >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a
  >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal'
  >         as psychotic.
  >          
  >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
  >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently shared
  >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For
  >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed
  >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues
  >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
  >          
  >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's
  >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own
  >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
  >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent
  >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
  >          
  >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for
  >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
  >          
  >         regarde
  >          
  >         Juliano
  >          
  >          
  > 
  >             ----- Original Message -----
  >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>>
  >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
  >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
  >             lately (randy)
  >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails;
  >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are
  >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the point I
  >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
  >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have
  >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
  >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just like to
  >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are to be
  >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
  >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly
  >             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
  >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any
  >             other description other than mental imbalance and
  >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to
  >             describe the type of persons where this type of medication
  >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only
  >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness but
  >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
  >             especially instances where these conditions were aggravated
  >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I
  >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where
  >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical
  >             environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of
  >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
  >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support its
  >             existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding
  >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
  >             forward to your comment.
  >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD
  >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting.
  >             This was at the stage where they were trying to figure out
  >             what LSD was useful for.
  >             ----- Original Message ----
  >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
  >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>>
  >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
  >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>>
  >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
  >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
  >             (randy)
  >             Hi Randy,
  >              
  >             Sorry to hear about your son.
  >              
  >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS
  >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please
  >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit.
  >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
  >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
  >              
  >             regarde
  >              
  >             Juliano
  > 
  >                 ----- Original Message -----
  >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com<mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>>
  >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
  >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
  >                 lately (randy)
  >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my
  >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I
  >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
  >                 up".............He He
  >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
  >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a
  >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many
  >                 to talk about really.
  >                  
  >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit,
  >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it
  >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been
  >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in
  >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of
  >                 everything but the probation violation so he has to do
  >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried like a
  >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad
  >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping
  >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I
  >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root of all
  >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but
  >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell
  >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail like
  >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can adapt
  >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is
  >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot
  >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she smoked
  >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
  >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I
  >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough
  >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of
  >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a little
  >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got
  >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the ink.
  >                 That was my fault.
  >                  
  >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but
  >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a
  >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the
  >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
  >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm
  >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I
  >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
  >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I
  >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
  >                  
  >                      I'm still working on getting treatment reports and
  >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
  >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a
  >                 few of you that have been here a while now that haven't
  >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are important
  >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You know who
  >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
  >                  
  >                       I'll try and write a little more to the list. It
  >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list is for,
  >                 not just dry information. We need all the information we
  >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as important.
  >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I
  >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but
  >                 I'll take the risk. 
  >                  
  >                          Peace Love and Kindness
  >                             Randy
  >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
  >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
  >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
  >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>> wrote:
  > 
  >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
  >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
  >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>>> wrote:
  > 
  >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy
  >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
  >                         randy...... email back so that I chan feel the
  >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep
  >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can help
  >                         if you are having problems....... mujch love......
  >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a
  >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by
  >                         thry ihg
  >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three
  >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from
  >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or email,
  >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
  >                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
  >                          
  >                         if someone you love is addicted to something
  >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
  >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
  > 
  >                             ----- Original Message -----
  >                             *From:* Brad Hays
  >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>
  >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
  >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
  >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article
  >                             barcelona conference
  >                             Would love to see all of this Howard, and
  >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd
  >                             like to see that article in opposition to
  >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
  >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard
  >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com<mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
  >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com<mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>>> wrote:
  > 
  >                                 I had forwarded the entire newsletter of
  >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona conference
  >                                 that had the promotional article for the
  >                                 ibogaine session to this list but, it
  >                                 does not appear to have landed.;  I have
  >                                 thus hoping that the article alone that
  >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
  >                                 edition of the Daily Update newsletter
  >                                 contained an article in opposition to
  >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt that
  >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the special
  >                                 session in which ibogaine presentations
  >                                 took place and in the minds and hearts
  >                                 of drug users and drug policy activists.
  >                                 I will see if I can get all of the slide
  >                                 shows and articles into a composite
  >                                 report within the next few weeks.
  >                                 Howard
  > 
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  >                         ~~_/) ~~
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From bradleyheathhays at gmail.com  Sun Jun  1 10:03:18 2008
From: bradleyheathhays at gmail.com (Brad Hays)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 10:03:18 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
Message-ID: <1f5488f0806010703r36234518n45afbed5c8c9878f@mail.gmail.com>

Man alive! I'm gonna save this one for later, but I did get through your
first post J.  Yes very well presented and yes disillusion is just that
deeply a part of our culture.  I believe this kids got on to something
yall.

This is gonna sound stupid, but if you'll indulge me got a couple questions:

anybody in your family ever been diagnosed with temporal lobe epilepsy?
and what do you see when you close your eyes to go to sleep at night?

And if your buddy doesn't mind I'd like to see what he's had to say about
things.  I've known a number of mentally disabled people that had artistic
ability out the roof.  Whats on the outside is def not always whats on the
inside.



On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 7:51 AM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote:

>  Hi Simon,
>
> You said: *"** I want to say some thing about the fact that you said
> "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"*
>
> Actually I said that the secret is* already* out. That in principle people
> could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get
> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>
> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is built
> on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as *social
> control*. And usually it has always been the poor that have been the main
> victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive system that is not
> just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But that
> ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even be *acknowledged *by the
> victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds brutality is being said to
> be the* reality*
>
> A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away): IF
> an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be dragged
> before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and forcibly
> incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>  Because the paradigm, '*communism*' was believed to be the 'reality', and
> to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if the
> person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he may feel
> they are 'not-normal', right?
>
> So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist'
> system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about
> this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this
> system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include
> being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as an
> 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental illness',
> and all that that means in the community. How others think and behave with
> you, and how you think about yourself.
>
> Really the question is not who is going to fund this *myth*, it is how to
> *EXPOSE* this myth. Show the *roots *of this evil myth. Because not only
> are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now under
> attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
>
> regarde
>
> Juliano
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* simon loxton <simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>
>  I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I want to
> say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told"
> which I will get to; but first lets look at the state of psychiatric care
> around the world. Most of the people who should be receiving in-patient care
> are on the streets or stuck with their families all due to excuses like lack
> of funding etc. Where I am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in
> a semi-working condition and the patients that really need it are not
> receiving the care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have
> seen dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats
> left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a change
> in the approach to the type of care or medication these people got where
> would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really cares and what percentage
> of any budget is currently allocated to these people? The only people that
> would possibly have access are the ones who have families to foot the bill.
> Its quite a change discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors
> for conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of
> decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is just as I
> got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats to prescribe the
> nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>
> This is the most powerful of statements,
>
> One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experiencing
> powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would be superfluous. But to be
> there with them offering loving support, yes.
>
>  And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.  Where most
> people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking how to approach
> this particular email.  Because, there are so many concurrent discussions
> going on right now that make this all very whole for me.
> There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now saying
> that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because everything you said
> about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch all term for the weird and
> bizarre unexplainable behavior that people some times display.  I say people
> because on this list at least most have had at least one type of break that
> is indescribable for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
> treatment for Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in
> the medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol and
> 2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats the truth.  I
> see the truth.
> http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
> So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know what
> alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your initialy on, then
> when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>
> Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic level with
> out the chemical masking making people fit in to the "norm" of what "should
> be".  But the medical community refuses to look at the whole picture.
>
> Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook format.
> http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>
>  I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my "label" that
> was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just manic depression when
> I was labeled with it, but now they even have levels on that.  Bi-Polar I
> and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down and not treating the person still.
> Anyhow, there I rant.
> Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and it is
> the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely treat people.
> Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
> Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look at
> Spirit and how that fits into the works.
> The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon, Sara and
> others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of their practice.  Of
> Course they do, has western society proven to conserve and validate those
> practices that are Sacred to people.  NEVER have we.  Point taken there.
> Now in the evolution of things, I feel Howards point of, They NEED to,
> because even when we treat addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual
> aspect that has worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of
> the plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical community
> has failed to treat people.
>
> Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted already.  But
> I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've seen it called, new
> newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much time we spend labeling.
> Its a form of scientific based sprituality that works for me,  I choose to
> call it Mine.
>
> Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a huge
> struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue benign points
> with likeminded people who are all here for the better good of humanity.
> Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to figure this out for himSELF
> is a beautiful thing,  I support his self on a very personal level.  Thats
> what I'm here for currently.  And where I have been currently trying to make
> a difference on a very 1:1 level.
> My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating addiction/beh
> health issues that are real for people.  Yet being able to be real with
> people with out it being unprofessional.  Practicing modalities from all the
> cultures, reki, hypmotism, all that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti
> if they will let us in.
> Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad your
> helping fight it.
> Mel
>
>
> On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>>  Hi Simon,
>>
>> I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start there is
>> no actual proof that mental illness is a biological disease. There are no
>> tests.
>> Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and unacceptable by
>> the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't make them diseases.
>> rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is oppressing
>> people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill', and then drugged,
>> and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up, and tied up, and all the abuse
>> of that, this means that the *bigger* picture--the community, society,
>> culture, world, is conveniently not being looked at.
>>
>> So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which means the
>> whole picture. And to do this means looking at the pharmaceutical industry
>> and its relationship with the military industrial complex!....the whole
>> schbangle.* Otherwise*, you can only be apporaoching this problem in a
>> very superficial way. No matter how arduous it may be to look!
>>
>> We *have* to look. Not only because people are suffering under this
>> oppression, but the very planet and its species are suffering under the
>> onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL connected to this problem we are
>> discussing. So to understand we need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which
>> is the usual western scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated
>> vision.
>>
>> In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very young, 15. I
>> had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the experience, and others to follow
>> brought me back to Nature. Ie., in that short speace of time from being a
>> small kid into Nature and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the
>> 'big city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>>
>> Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via
>> psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing culture
>> classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very subjective. In the
>> UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis called Skunk had been daignosed as
>> being 'psychotic'. And I am sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the
>> same, but usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>>
>> So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not using that
>> psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical disease but a process!
>>
>> Of?
>>
>> To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous pressure we
>> are under. For some, things become so pressurized that the 'ego''s
>> boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing energy that takes over. And the
>> person may experience mythical visions etc etc.
>> What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these visions. Drug
>> them away. And the person is given nervous-system damaging 'medication'. But
>> THAT is not mentioned!! As long as they can suppress it is all they want.
>> Because to deal with this challenges their worldviews.
>>
>> One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experincing
>> powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be superfluous. But to be
>> there with them offering loving support, yes.
>>
>> THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set & Setting.
>> And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a culture that classes all
>> forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal' as psychotic.
>>
>> it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this forum I am
>> with that is about psychedelics has recently shared his terrible experience
>> from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For simply saying things they are not
>> familiar with they diagnosed him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this
>> discussion continues I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>>
>> See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's of past,
>> etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own psychedelics etc. So
>> surely the most intelligen thing is to encourage and try and explore the
>> most resepctul and intelligent and benevolent ways to exeperience with
>> psychedelics.
>>
>> This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for the Land,
>> and animals, all other species, and community.
>>
>> regarde
>>
>> Juliano
>>
>>
>>
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* simon loxton <simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>   *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>>   I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails; they seem to
>> me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are the answer to mental
>> disorders. If I have missed the point I apologize but I have to bring up the
>> number of cases of psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances
>> have caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled circumstances
>> or approached medically. I would just like to get your comment  on how you
>> propose psychedelics are to be used in this respect. I only mention this as
>> I see a possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly in people
>> that have borderline personality disorders or mental imbalances.  I
>> apologize That I can come up with any other description other than mental
>> imbalance and personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to
>> describe the type of persons where this type of medication would be contra
>> indicated in my opinion, again I am only going with my limited understanding
>> of mental illness but have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>> especially instances where these conditions were aggravated or worsened by
>> taking mind altering substances. But as I said earlier this was not anything
>> to do with cases where the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a
>> clinical environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of what it
>> is you are advocating. I do believe in mental illness and think there is
>> enough evidence to support its existence; which is why I think I may be
>> misunderstanding some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
>> forward to your comment. I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant
>> took LSD about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting. This was
>> at the stage where they were trying to figure out what LSD was useful for.
>>   ----- Original Message ---- From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>>  Hi Randy,
>>
>> Sorry to hear about your son.
>>
>> Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS they throw
>> you off--which thers nothin you can do--please dont let anyone intimidate
>> you from speaking as you see fit. we ALL got seomthing to say from our
>> unique perspectives!
>> And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>>
>> regarde
>>
>> Juliano
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Randy Faulconer <bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>> *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>>           Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my Momma did
>> something and it went to saved drafts and I couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh
>> he said "get it up".............He He
>>        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time lately, my son got put
>> in jail and I've been having a lot of problems with my back. Other thing
>> too, too many to talk about really.
>>
>>          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit, all because of
>> alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it would have been opiates, but then he
>> wouldn't have been all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in jail
>> but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of everything but the
>> probation violation so he has to do 32 more days. When I got his first
>> letter I cried like a baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad
>> that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping each other out here
>> lately. God I love her so, but I digress. I felt like his upbringing was the
>> root of all of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but he was
>> so descriptive that I was right there in the cell with him and it killed be
>> to think of him in jail like that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he
>> can adapt to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is in jail.
>> The way he was brought up was a big part ot this. His mother didn't make him
>> mind, hell she smoked with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
>> years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I saw him on Christmas
>> and shit but that's just not enough to make any difference really. Not that
>> I'm any kind of saint or anything but I think I might have made a little
>> difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got divorced, hell the
>> papers were still wet from the ink. That was my fault.
>>
>>       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but I felt like I was
>> gonna bust or something. There were a couple of people slam me for not
>> trying to help in the right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
>> really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm just too sensitive
>> for my own feakin' good. I mean I didn't think there was a wrong way to do
>> the right thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I kept my
>> thoughts to myself and just read the list.
>>
>>      I'm still working on getting treatment reports and accounts together
>> so yall that haven't sent one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There
>> are a few of you that have been here a while now that haven't sent an
>> account, and I think that you all are important to the movement, we need to
>> hear from you. You know who you are. Some of the old timers too.
>>
>>       I'll try and write a little more to the list. It makes me feel
>> better and that is what this list is for, not just dry information. We need
>> all the information we can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>> important. My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I hope he
>> doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but I'll take the risk.
>>
>>          Peace Love and Kindness
>>             Randy
>>          BiscuitBoy Blues
>>  On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
>>>    On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>  I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy for a while... I miss
>>>> your witty repartae randy...... email back so that I chan feel the
>>>> love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep you are doing good.... let
>>>> me know if can help if you are having problems....... mujch love......
>>>> junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a junkboy.... damn... the
>>>> cops keep drivijg by thry ihg
>>>> specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and
>>>> snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can
>>>> get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is
>>>> obsolete.
>>>>
>>>> if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth,
>>>> ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> *From:* Brad Hays <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>>>> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>> *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article barcelona conference
>>>>  Would love to see all of this Howard, and thanks for your work on it.
>>>> Actually I'd like to see that article in opposition to ibogaine too if it's
>>>> around.
>>>>   On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I had forwarded the entire newsletter of May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>>>>> conference that had the promotional article for the ibogaine session to this
>>>>> list but, it does not appear to have landed.;  I have thus hoping that the
>>>>> article alone that is much smaller will work. A later edition of the Daily
>>>>> Update newsletter contained an article in opposition to ibogaine but, there
>>>>> is no doubt that ibogaine prevailed during the special session in which
>>>>> ibogaine presentations took place and in the minds and hearts of drug users
>>>>> and drug policy activists.
>>>>> I will see if I can get all of the slide shows and articles into a
>>>>> composite report within the next few weeks.
>>>>>  Howard
>>>>>
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>>>> ~~_/) ~~
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From sara119 at xs4all.nl  Sun Jun  1 10:07:09 2008
From: sara119 at xs4all.nl (Sara Glatt)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 16:07:09 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [Ibogaine] (no subject)
Message-ID: <13295.80.127.42.14.1212329229.squirrel@webmail.xs4all.nl>

Hi Juliano,

there is no need to go anywhere to do something about yourself, the truth
is that some people who are named Shaman or Medicine man or woman do have
healing energies, just like some plants and animals do.

for example, in Israel lives a lady who can't get children, she was
a victim of war crimes in the 2ed world war, now
 many years after she gives blessing to women who can not get pregnant,
(medically could not get any help) and most of her blessing are working.

there is another lady who experienced peyote in the Indian reservation she
can heal people tuning into that vibe she experienced while on Peyote
and she is using it for channeling healing energies.

Cabalistic healing, healing mantra's are also things we can learn,
 but we are not all capable to do so,then we look for help.

when people are mentally ill they don't think about themselves.
I have treated a man who thought he was The Messiah, and a lady who heard
voices, who were controlling her life,
also a person who didn't know where he was and what he should be eating 
or drinking, just tripping from too much interferon medication.
 those people couldn't take care of the most simple things kids know how
to do. they all got medication after their family couldn't take care of
them.

this is just to give you the idea that it is not that simple as you think,
people are complex being, the good, the bad and the ugly.

 Hi Simon,
>
> You said: " I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
> secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"
>
> Actually I said that the secret is already out. That in principle people
> could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get
> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>
> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is built
> on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as
> social control. And usually it has always been the poor that have been the
> main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive system that
> is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But that
> ,especially, the latter%2


From bradleyheathhays at gmail.com  Sun Jun  1 11:02:57 2008
From: bradleyheathhays at gmail.com (Brad Hays)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 11:02:57 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J> <48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>
	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>

Same advice here Warren.  Flipped through that video and theres no way I
could listen to that.  I would gradually make friends with that guy cause he
isn't gonna be too happy when they get taken away.  Sometimes with two dogs
only one of em is the barker so maybe he won't lose both of em



On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:33 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> wrote:

>  Warren,
> I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog is loose...
> it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the pound)... if the
> dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog breaking the noise
> ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the dog starts barking after
> the cops leave, call again... all citys have a nioise ordinance. needless to
> say keep a journal of each offence, even if the cops don't catch the dog,
> then after you have enough evidince to give to the animal cruality people,
> they will take the dog away, rehabilate it and find it a good
> home.........(ive had neighbors who wouldn't take care of their dog)
> just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
> junky
>
>
> specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and
> snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can
> get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is
> obsolete.
>
> if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect),
> google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Warren Theriot <wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
> *To:* The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>
> Word.
> What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
> where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
> What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
> words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>   to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
> prescription pain medications and returned home to this
> environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
> let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
> the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
> day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
> up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
> meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
> ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
> year and three months in this environment.
> Peace someday...
> Warren
>
>
> Juliano wrote:
> > Hi Simon,
> >
> > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you said
> > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
> >
> > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle
> > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get
> > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
> > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
> >
> > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
> > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is
> > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function
> > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that have
> > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive
> > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
> > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even
> > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds
> > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
> >
> > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away):
> > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be
> > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and
> > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
> >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the 'reality',
> > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if
> > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he
> > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
> >
> > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist'
> > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about
> > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this
> > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include
> > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as
> > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental
> > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others think and
> > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
> >
> > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it is how
> > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth. Because not
> > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now
> > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
> >
> > regarde
> >
> > Juliano
> >
> >     ----- Original Message -----
> >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
> >
> >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >
> >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
> >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
> (randy)
> >
> >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I
> >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets
> >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the
> >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the people who
> >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or stuck with
> >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc. Where I
> >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a semi-working
> >     condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving the
> >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen
> >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats
> >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a
> >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
> >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really
> >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to
> >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access are
> >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
> >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
> >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of
> >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is
> >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats
> >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
> >
> >     ----- Original Message ----
> >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
> >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
> >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
> >
> >     This is the most powerful of statements,
> >
> >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
> >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would
> >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
> >         support, yes.
> >
> >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.
> >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking
> >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so many
> >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very
> >     whole for me.
> >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now
> >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
> >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch
> >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
> >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list at
> >     least most have had at least one type of break that is indescribable
> >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of treatment for
> >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the
> >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol
> >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats
> >     the truth.  I see the truth.
> >     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
> >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know
> >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
> >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
> >
> >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
> >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
> >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to
> >     look at the whole picture.
> >
> >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook
> format.
> >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>
> >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
> >
> >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
> >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just
> >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have
> >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down
> >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
> >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and
> >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely
> >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
> >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look
> >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
> >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon,
> >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
> >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to
> >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people.
> >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things,
> >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat
> >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
> >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the
> >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
> >     community has failed to treat people.
> >
> >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
> >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've
> >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much
> >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality
> >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
> >
> >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a
> >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
> >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the better
> >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to
> >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his
> >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for currently.
> >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a
> >     very 1:1 level.
> >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
> >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being
> >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.
> >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all
> >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
> >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad
> >     your helping fight it.
> >     Mel
> >
> >
> >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
> >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>> wrote:
> >
> >         Hi Simon,
> >
> >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start
> >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological
> >         disease. There are no tests.
> >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
> >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't
> >         make them diseases.
> >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
> >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill',
> >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up,
> >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
> >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, is
> >         conveniently not being looked at.
> >
> >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which
> >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the
> >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military
> >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/, you can
> >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No
> >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
> >
> >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering under
> >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
> >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
> >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we
> >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western
> >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
> >
> >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
> >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
> >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie.,
> >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature
> >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
> >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
> >
> >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via
> >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing
> >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very
> >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
> >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am
> >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
> >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
> >
> >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not
> >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical
> >         disease but a process!
> >
> >         Of?
> >
> >         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
> >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized
> >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing
> >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience mythical
> >         visions etc etc.
> >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
> >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given nervous-system
> >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as
> >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this
> >         challenges their worldviews.
> >
> >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
> >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be
> >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support,
> yes.
> >
> >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set &
> >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a
> >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal'
> >         as psychotic.
> >
> >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
> >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently shared
> >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For
> >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed
> >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues
> >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
> >
> >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's
> >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own
> >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
> >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent
> >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
> >
> >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for
> >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
> >
> >         regarde
> >
> >         Juliano
> >
> >
> >
> >             ----- Original Message -----
> >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
> >
> >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >
> >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
> >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
> >             lately (randy)
> >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails;
> >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are
> >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the point I
> >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
> >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have
> >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
> >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just like to
> >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are to be
> >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
> >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly
> >             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
> >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any
> >             other description other than mental imbalance and
> >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to
> >             describe the type of persons where this type of medication
> >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only
> >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness but
> >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
> >             especially instances where these conditions were aggravated
> >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I
> >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where
> >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical
> >             environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of
> >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
> >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support its
> >             existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding
> >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
> >             forward to your comment.
> >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD
> >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting.
> >             This was at the stage where they were trying to figure out
> >             what LSD was useful for.
> >             ----- Original Message ----
> >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
> >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>>
> >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
> >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com <ibogaine at mindvox.com>>>
> >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
> >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
> >             (randy)
> >             Hi Randy,
> >
> >             Sorry to hear about your son.
> >
> >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS
> >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please
> >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit.
> >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
> >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
> >
> >             regarde
> >
> >             Juliano
> >
> >                 ----- Original Message -----
> >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com<bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
> >
> >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >
> >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
> >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
> >                 lately (randy)
> >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my
> >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I
> >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
> >                 up".............He He
> >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
> >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a
> >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many
> >                 to talk about really.
> >
> >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit,
> >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it
> >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been
> >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in
> >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of
> >                 everything but the probation violation so he has to do
> >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried like a
> >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad
> >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping
> >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I
> >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root of all
> >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but
> >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell
> >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail like
> >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can adapt
> >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is
> >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot
> >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she smoked
> >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
> >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I
> >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough
> >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of
> >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a little
> >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got
> >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the ink.
> >                 That was my fault.
> >
> >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but
> >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a
> >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the
> >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
> >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm
> >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I
> >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
> >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I
> >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
> >
> >                      I'm still working on getting treatment reports and
> >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
> >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a
> >                 few of you that have been here a while now that haven't
> >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are important
> >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You know who
> >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
> >
> >                       I'll try and write a little more to the list. It
> >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list is for,
> >                 not just dry information. We need all the information we
> >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as important.
> >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I
> >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but
> >                 I'll take the risk.
> >
> >                          Peace Love and Kindness
> >                             Randy
> >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
> >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
> >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
> >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>>
> wrote:
> >
> >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
> >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
> >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>>>
> wrote:
> >
> >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy
> >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
> >                         randy...... email back so that I chan feel the
> >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep
> >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can help
> >                         if you are having problems....... mujch
> love......
> >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a
> >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by
> >                         thry ihg
> >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three
> >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from
> >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or email,
> >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
> >                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
> >
> >                         if someone you love is addicted to something
> >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
> >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i
> promise....
> >
> >                             ----- Original Message -----
> >                             *From:* Brad Hays
> >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
> >
> >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
> >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >
> >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
> >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article
> >                             barcelona conference
> >                             Would love to see all of this Howard, and
> >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd
> >                             like to see that article in opposition to
> >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
> >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard
> >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
> >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com<hslotsof at phantom.com>>>
> wrote:
> >
> >                                 I had forwarded the entire newsletter of
> >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona conference
> >                                 that had the promotional article for the
> >                                 ibogaine session to this list but, it
> >                                 does not appear to have landed.;  I have
> >                                 thus hoping that the article alone that
> >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
> >                                 edition of the Daily Update newsletter
> >                                 contained an article in opposition to
> >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt that
> >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the special
> >                                 session in which ibogaine presentations
> >                                 took place and in the minds and hearts
> >                                 of drug users and drug policy activists.
> >                                 I will see if I can get all of the slide
> >                                 shows and articles into a composite
> >                                 report within the next few weeks.
> >                                 Howard
> >
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From juliano8 at ntlworld.com  Sun Jun  1 11:22:05 2008
From: juliano8 at ntlworld.com (Juliano)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 16:22:05 +0100
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
	<1f5488f0806010703r36234518n45afbed5c8c9878f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004201c8c3fb$411fcd70$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>

Hey brad,

'This kid' is 53 come August. Just thought i'd let ya know ;)

"anybody in your family ever been diagnosed with temporal lobe epilepsy?"

Nome learning

"and what do you see when you close your eyes to go to sleep at night?"

haha, quite funny you ask that actually. usually blackness. But I have been exploring stuff. I have been exploring the observation reported by people when on psychedelics--which I am familiar with of course--which are geometric patterns which can then 'become' landscapes, mythical scenes, animals, etc etc etc.

I was turned onto looking more closely at this after recently reading a very great book (I recommend!!!) called Sacred Mushroom of Visions: Teonanacatyl, Ralph Metzner. In it a woman shares a powerful psychedelic experience she had where she began seeing these geometric patterns, but then they seem to come alive, and are not only very curious about here, but also very humourous. So we are in the realms of faerieland. Which I am familiar with.

Later, I was reading about a book by Graham Hancock called 'Supernatural', which seemed to fit in with my research, because it goes into how there happened a very mysterious event for our species 40 odd thousand years ago when art appeared in caves and rock art. And he says that the geometric designs, and depctions of half human half animal hybrids begin appearing in the art work with Indigenous peoples are that are not only separate by vast geographical distances, but also chronologically. And Hancock is saying hos this points to anceint use of various psychedelics, and how similar reports are reported by modern users of psychedelics.

I personally had a VERY powerful 'OBE' where I met, and had an intimate encounter with a human animal hybrid!!! So I can identify with ALl the above! Needless to say I have ordered Hancocks book.
So returning to your question ;)...last night I began really seeing pattern forming with eyes shut. because I am exploring.........We are all the time learning beings. it is not first time I have experienced such patterns with eyes shut. But your question reminded me of last night.

The guy I mentioned is not really a 'buddy'. I have only just mentioned. And...he has some pretty weird ideas..LOL. For example he claims he is an alchemist, and can create this strange gold which acts like a spiritual drug of some kind. he reckons this is what has been referred to in myths etc. I challenged him he is wrong about that, and that what is being referred to are the various entheogenic plants, fungi, potions etc. No doubt in my opinion, and I have been researching this quite a few years

 But I will ask his permission next time I visit the thread

regarde

Juliano





  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Brad Hays 
  To: The Ibogaine List 
  Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:03 PM
  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


  Man alive! I'm gonna save this one for later, but I did get through your first post J.  Yes very well presented and yes disillusion is just that deeply a part of our culture.  I believe this kids got on to something yall.  

  This is gonna sound stupid, but if you'll indulge me got a couple questions:

  anybody in your family ever been diagnosed with temporal lobe epilepsy?
  and what do you see when you close your eyes to go to sleep at night?

  And if your buddy doesn't mind I'd like to see what he's had to say about things.  I've known a number of mentally disabled people that had artistic ability out the roof.  Whats on the outside is def not always whats on the inside.




  On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 7:51 AM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote:

    Hi Simon,

    You said: " I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;" 

    Actually I said that the secret is already out. That in principle people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
    Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man. 

    Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as social control. And usually it has always been the poor that have been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even be acknowledged by the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds brutality is being said to be the reality

    A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone away): IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would be dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
     Because the paradigm, 'communism' was believed to be the 'reality', and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal! Now if the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then even s/he may feel they are 'not-normal', right?

    So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 'capitalist' system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress about this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental illness', and all that that means in the community. How others think and behave with you, and how you think about yourself. 

    Really the question is not who is going to fund this myth, it is how to EXPOSE this myth. Show the roots of this evil myth. Because not only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth is now under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!

    regarde

    Juliano
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: simon loxton 
      To: The Ibogaine List 
      Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
      Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


      I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the people who should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or stuck with their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc. Where I am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a semi-working condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving the care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a change in the approach to the type of care or medication these people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to these people? The only people that would possibly have access are the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of decay outside of private health care. In private health care it is just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and thats to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.


      ----- Original Message ----
      From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
      To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
      Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
      Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


      This is the most powerful of statements,  
        One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.
       And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.  Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment thinking how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so many concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very whole for me.  
      There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that people some times display.  I say people because on this list at least most have had at least one type of break that is indescribable for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of treatment for Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of Haldol and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.  Thats the truth.  I see the truth.  
      http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
      So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage. 

      Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to look at the whole picture.

      Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook format.
      http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm

       I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.  
      Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
      Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look at Spirit and how that fits into the works.  
      The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon, Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people.  NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things, I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical community has failed to treat people.  

      Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.  

      Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the better good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for currently.  And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a very 1:1 level.  
      My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.  Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
      Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm glad your helping fight it.
      Mel


      On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote: 
        Hi Simon,

        I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a start there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological disease. There are no tests.
        Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't make them diseases.
        rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill', and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up, and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the bigger picture--the community, society, culture, world, is conveniently not being looked at.

        So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military industrial complex!....the whole schbangle. Otherwise, you can only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No matter how arduous it may be to look!

        We have to look. Not only because people are suffering under this oppression, but the very planet and its species are suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.

        In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie., in that short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.

        Now you claim that people have been pushed into 'psychosis' via psychedelics? This is very complex because what this prevailing culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but usually we dont hear it about drinkers.

        So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes, --not using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not physical disease but a process!

        Of?

        To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing energy that takes over. And the person may experience mythical visions etc etc.
        What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these visions. Drug them away. And the person is given nervous-system damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this challenges their worldviews.

        One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support, yes.

        THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is Set & Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not 'normal' as psychotic.

        it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently shared his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..

        See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret society's of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate their own psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.

        This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST respect for the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.

        regarde

        Juliano


          ----- Original Message ----- 
          From: simon loxton 
          To: The Ibogaine List 
          Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
          Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
          I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails; they seem to me to carry the sentiment that psychedelics are the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the point I apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled circumstances or approached medically. I would just like to get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are to be used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly in people that have borderline personality disorders or mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any other description other than mental imbalance and personality disorder but is the only two terms I can use to describe the type of persons where this type of medication would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only going with my limited understanding of mental illness but have witnessed these types of problems in people and especially instances where these conditions were aggravated or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental illness and think there is enough evidence to support its existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look forward to your comment. 
          I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting. This was at the stage where they were trying to figure out what LSD was useful for.
          ----- Original Message ---- 
          From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
          To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
          Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
          Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
          Hi Randy,

          Sorry to hear about your son.

          Just to say though/never worry about what people say. UNLESS they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit. we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
          And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)

          regarde

          Juliano
            ----- Original Message ----- 
            From: Randy Faulconer 
            To: The Ibogaine List 
            Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
            Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
                     Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it up".............He He
                   Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many to talk about really.

                     My son got himself in some pretty deep shit, all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him out of everything but the probation violation so he has to do 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried like a baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root of all of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell with him and it killed be to think of him in jail like that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can adapt to just about anything but still.........fuck, my boy is in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she smoked with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in line. I saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough to make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of saint or anything but I think I might have made a little difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after we got divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the ink. That was my fault.

                  I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the list but I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the right way here on the list, a couple of people that I really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I guess I'm just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right thing, but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.

                 I'm still working on getting treatment reports and accounts together so yall that haven't sent one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a few of you that have been here a while now that haven't sent an account, and I think that you all are important to the movement, we need to hear from you. You know who you are. Some of the old timers too.

                  I'll try and write a little more to the list. It makes me feel better and that is what this list is for, not just dry information. We need all the information we can get but dealing with feelings is just as important. My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like that, but I'll take the risk. 

                     Peace Love and Kindness
                        Randy
                     BiscuitBoy Blues 
            On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com> wrote: 
              Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure 
              On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> wrote: 
                I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy for a while... I miss your witty repartae randy...... email back so that I chan feel the love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep you are doing good.... let me know if can help if you are having problems....... mujch love...... 
                junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by thry ihg
                specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.

                if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
                  ----- Original Message ----- 
                  From: Brad Hays 
                  To: The Ibogaine List 
                  Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
                  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article barcelona conference
                  Would love to see all of this Howard, and thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd like to see that article in opposition to ibogaine too if it's around. 
                  On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com> wrote: 
                    I had forwarded the entire newsletter of May 11/12 from the Barcelona conference that had the promotional article for the ibogaine session to this list but, it does not appear to have landed.;  I have thus hoping that the article alone that is much smaller will work. A later edition of the Daily Update newsletter contained an article in opposition to ibogaine but, there is no doubt that ibogaine prevailed during the special session in which ibogaine presentations took place and in the minds and hearts of drug users and drug policy activists. 
                    I will see if I can get all of the slide shows and articles into a composite report within the next few weeks.
                    Howard
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From juliano8 at ntlworld.com  Sun Jun  1 11:30:16 2008
From: juliano8 at ntlworld.com (Juliano)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 16:30:16 +0100
Subject: [Ibogaine] (no subject)
References: <13295.80.127.42.14.1212329229.squirrel@webmail.xs4all.nl>
Message-ID: <005501c8c3fc$66041e60$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>

Hey Sara,

I know it is not simple, I really do. But ALSo you have to understand that 
powers that be can make things seem very complex! And they will do this by 
'blinding us' with science, and using lingo that cannot be understood by 
ordinary people. Are you familiar with 'gobblydegook', and 'legalize'?? 
These are all forms of communication designed to keep us--the common 
people--the hell out, and to manipulate us.

Regarding shamans etc. of course there will be people who have the skill of 
healing. But also understand that so do you. Dont give all your power to 
anotyher. Cultivate your own power. And authentic healer will tell you it is 
you that heals yourself. They act as a conduit.

regarding 'mentally ill' people 'who cant take care of themselves'. Again, 
we have to ask WHY? For if mental illness is a myth, then we ned a different 
kind of approach. FIRST you have to understand it is a myth. if you try and 
wonder what to do beliving it is biolgical disease, I see that as looking 
blind at the problem.

regarde

Juliano


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sara Glatt" <sara119 at xs4all.nl>
To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (no subject)


> Hi Juliano,
>
> there is no need to go anywhere to do something about yourself, the truth
> is that some people who are named Shaman or Medicine man or woman do have
> healing energies, just like some plants and animals do.
>
> for example, in Israel lives a lady who can't get children, she was
> a victim of war crimes in the 2ed world war, now
> many years after she gives blessing to women who can not get pregnant,
> (medically could not get any help) and most of her blessing are working.
>
> there is another lady who experienced peyote in the Indian reservation she
> can heal people tuning into that vibe she experienced while on Peyote
> and she is using it for channeling healing energies.
>
> Cabalistic healing, healing mantra's are also things we can learn,
> but we are not all capable to do so,then we look for help.
>
> when people are mentally ill they don't think about themselves.
> I have treated a man who thought he was The Messiah, and a lady who heard
> voices, who were controlling her life,
> also a person who didn't know where he was and what he should be eating
> or drinking, just tripping from too much interferon medication.
> those people couldn't take care of the most simple things kids know how
> to do. they all got medication after their family couldn't take care of
> them.
>
> this is just to give you the idea that it is not that simple as you think,
> people are complex being, the good, the bad and the ugly.
>
> Hi Simon,
>>
>> You said: " I want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
>> secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"
>>
>> Actually I said that the secret is already out. That in principle people
>> could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to, and get
>> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
>> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>>
>> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
>> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is 
>> built
>> on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as
>> social control. And usually it has always been the poor that have been 
>> the
>> main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive system that
>> is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But that
>> ,especially, the latter%2
>
>
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12:25


From simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk  Sun Jun  1 11:36:48 2008
From: simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk (simon loxton)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 15:36:48 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
Message-ID: <792456.19194.qm@web28609.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>

Hi J

I may have mis understood the part about "the secret" with regard to Bwiti as i thought it was some one else's post; never mind it does not really need my comment. Thanks for being clear and I understand where you are coming from. 


----- Original Message ----
From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 1:51:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)

?  
Hi Simon,
 
You said: "I want to say 
some thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I 
will get to;" 
 
Actually I said that the secret isalready out. That in principle people could cultivate their own 
psychedelics if they wished to, and get informtaion as to how to have a 
Tryp.
Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of 
some 'mystery school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man. 
 
Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental 
health movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is 
built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really function as social control. And usually it has always been the poor that 
have been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal oppressive 
system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also psychologically. But 
that ,especially, the latter brutality cannot even be acknowledged by 
the victims of it, because the paradigm that breeds brutality is being said 
to be thereality
 
A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really 
gone away): IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they would 
be dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and forcibly 
incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
 Because the paradigm, 'communism' was 
believed to be the 'reality', and to question it in whatever way was deemed to 
be not-normal! Now if the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system 
then even s/he may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
 
So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the 
'capitalist' system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show distress 
about this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse, of this 
system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can include being 
incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or stigmatized as an 'out 
patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental illness', and all 
that that means in the community. How others think and behave with you, and how 
you think about yourself. 
 
Really the question is not who is going to fund this myth, it is how to EXPOSE this myth. Show the roots of this evil myth. Because not only are people and children being abused by 
it, but planet Earth is now under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from 
the web of life!
 
regarde
 
Juliano
----- Original Message ----- 
From: simon  loxton 
To: The Ibogaine List 
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard  from buscit boy lately (randy)

I need  to read your entire email and really take it in because I want to say some  thing about the fact that you said "these secrets need to be told" which I  will get to; but first lets look at the state of psychiatric care around the  world. Most of the people who should be receiving in-patient care are on the  streets or stuck with their families all due to excuses like lack of funding  etc. Where I am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a  semi-working condition and the patients that really need it are not receiving  the care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I have seen dozens  of documentaries on the way these people are treated in whats left of the  facilities as well as first hand. So even if there was a change in the  approach to the type of care or medication these people got where would they  get it? Who would fund it? Who really cares and what percentage of any budget  is currently allocated to these people? The
 only people that would possibly  have access are the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a  change discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for  conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a state of decay  outside of private health care. In private health care it is just as I got the  impression of what is trying to be said and thats to prescribe the nearest  thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.


-----  Original Message ----
From: Melanie Gutierrez  <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
To: The Ibogaine List  <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36  AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately  (randy)


This is the most powerful of statements,  
One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are experiencing  powerful visionary experiences. Most likely would be superfluous. But to be  there with them offering loving support, yes.
 And that is totally where the medical community gets it  wrong.  Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment  thinking how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so  many concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very whole  for me.  
There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric illness.  Now  saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because everything you  said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch all term for the weird  and bizarre unexplainable behavior that people some times display.  I say  people because on this list at least most have had at least one type of break  that is indescribable for them for what ever reason.  And the main  line of treatment for Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I  see in the medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10  of Haldol and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking  out.  Thats the truth.  I see the truth.  
http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all  know what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your initialy  on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage. 
 
Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic level  with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the "norm" of what  "should be".  But the medical community refuses to look at the whole  picture.
 
Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini e-textbook  format.
http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
 
 I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my  "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it was just manic  depression when I was labeled with it, but now they even have levels on  that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking it down and not  treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.  
Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are describing and it  is the way the medical community needs to go in order to truely treat  people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses to look at  Spirit and how that fits into the works.  
The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard, Simon, Sara  and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of their  practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to conserve and  validate those practices that are Sacred to people.  NEVER have we.   Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of things, I feel Howards point  of, They NEED to, because even when we treat addiction with Ibogaine with out  the spiritual aspect that has worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the  sacred use of the plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the  medical community has failed to treat people.  
 
Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted  already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've  seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO how much time  we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based sprituality that works  for me,  I choose to call it Mine.  
 
Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is in a huge  struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue benign points with  likeminded people who are all here for the better good of humanity.   Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to figure this out for himSELF is  a beautiful thing,  I support his self on a very personal level.   Thats what I'm here for currently.  And where I have been currently  trying to make a difference on a very 1:1 level.  
My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating  addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being able to  be real with people with out it being unprofessional.  Practicing  modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all that newagish shit.  :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let us in.
Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm  glad your helping fight it.
Mel
 
 
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com> wrote: 
Hi Simon,
 
I will try and answer you questions best way I  can: For a start there is no actual proof that mental illness is a  biological disease. There are no tests.
Of course there are human behaviours deemed  disturbing and unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't  make them diseases.
rather, what is going on is a very serious game  which is oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being 'ill', and  then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and locked up, and tied up, and  all the abuse of that, this means that the bigger picture--the  community, society, culture, world, is conveniently not being looked  at.
 
So I encouage us to look directly at what is  going on, which means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the  pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the military industrial  complex!....the whole schbangle.Otherwise, you can only be  apporaoching this problem in a very superficial way. No matter how arduous  it may be to look!
 
We have to look. Not only because  people are suffering under this oppression, but the very planet and its  species are suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL  connected to this problem we are discussing. So to understand we need NOT  compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual western scientific model, but  a more Indigenous integrated vision.
 
In my own person experience I was given LSD  when I was very young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the  experience, and others to follow brought me back to Nature. Ie., in that  short speace of time from being a small kid into Nature and faeryland  to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big city', LSD dissolved all of  that conditioning.
 
Now you claim that people have been pushed into  'psychosis' via psychedelics? This is very complex because what this  prevailing culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and is very  subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis called Skunk had  been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And I am sure many people who drink  alcohol can seem the same, but usually we dont hear it about  drinkers.
 
So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'?  Wel...yes, --not using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not  physical disease but a process!
 
Of?
 
To understand we have to again understand the  vast enormous pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized  that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing energy that  takes over. And the person may experience mythical visions etc  etc.
What the shrinks usually want to do then is  suppress these visions. Drug them away. And the person is given  nervous-system damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as  they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal with this challenges  their worldviews.
 
One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people  who are experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey would be  superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving support,  yes.
 
THE most important thing to consider with  psychedelics is Set & Setting. And this includes loving open helpful  advice. Not a culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not  'normal' as psychotic.
 
it is somewhat of a coincidence that another  member of this forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently  shared his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in Germany. For  simply saying things they are not familiar with they diagnosed him  'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion continues I will ask his  permission to copy his posts here..
 
See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike  secret society's of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate  their own psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to  encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and intelligent and  benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
 
This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with  UTMOST respect for the Land, and animals, all other species, and  community.
 
regarde
 
Juliano
 
 
-----  Original Message ----- 
From: simon  loxton 
To: The  Ibogaine List 
Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
I  just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails; they seem to me to  carry the sentiment that psychedelics are the answer to mental disorders.  If I have missed the point I apologize but I have to bring up the number  of cases of psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic substances have  caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled circumstances or  approached medically. I would just like to get your comment  on how  you propose psychedelics are to be used in this respect. I only mention  this as I see a possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis possibly  in people that have borderline personality disorders or mental  imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up with any other  description other than mental imbalance and personality disorder but is  the only two terms I can use to describe the type of persons where this  type of medication would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am  only going with my limited
 understanding of mental illness but have  witnessed these types of problems in people and especially instances where  these conditions were aggravated or worsened by taking mind altering  substances. But as I said earlier this was not anything to do with cases  where the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical  environment. I am just trying to get to an understanding of what it is you  are advocating. I do believe in mental illness and think there is enough  evidence to support its existence; which is why I think I may be  misunderstanding some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look  forward to your comment. 
I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD about 80  timed for alcoholism which I found interesting. This was at the stage  where they were trying to figure out what LSD was useful for.
-----  Original Message ---- 
From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately  (randy)
Hi Randy,
 
Sorry to hear about your son.
 
Just to say though/never worry about what  people say. UNLESS they throw you off--which thers nothin you can  do--please dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you see fit. we  ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
And I would LOVE to hear what you say  ;)
 
regarde
 
Juliano
-----  Original Message ----- 
From: Randy  Faulconer 
To: The  Ibogaine List 
Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
         Hey yall, I had a  note all written up and my Momma did something and it went to saved  drafts and I couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it  up".............He He
       Anyway, I've been having a  pretty hard time lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a  lot of problems with my back. Other thing too, too many to talk about  really.
 
         My son got himself  in some pretty deep shit, all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on  probation it would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't have been all  stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in jail but that's just  supposing. Gatewood got him out of everything but the probation  violation so he has to do 32 more days. When I got his first letter I  cried like a baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so glad that  my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping each other out here  lately. God I love her so, but I digress. I felt like his upbringing was  the root of all of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know better, but  he was so descriptive that I was right there in the cell with him and it  killed be to think of him in jail like that. He'll do fine, he's a lot  like me so he can adapt to just about anything but still.........fuck,  my boy is in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot this. His  mother
 didn't make him mind, hell she smoked with him when he was 12. We  divorced when Randy was 8 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him  in line. I saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not enough to  make any difference really. Not that I'm any kind of saint or anything  but I think I might have made a little difference anyway. I moved to  Erie Pa right after we got divorced, hell the papers were still wet from  the ink. That was my fault.
 
      I wasn't gonna lay all of this out  on the list but I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There were a  couple of people slam me for not trying to help in the right way here on  the list, a couple of people that I really respect, and it hurt my  feelings bad. I guess I'm just too sensitive for my own feakin'  good. I mean I didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right thing,  but I guess some people don't feel that way, so I kept my thoughts to  myself and just read the list.
 
     I'm still working on getting  treatment reports and accounts together so yall that haven't sent  one................PLEASE help a brutha out. There are a few of you that  have been here a while now that haven't sent an account, and I think  that you all are important to the movement, we need to hear from you.  You know who you are. Some of the old timers too.
 
      I'll try and write a little more to  the list. It makes me feel better and that is what this  list is for, not just dry information. We need all the information  we can get but dealing with feelings is just as important. My opinion  anyway. I think that Patrick would agree. I hope he doesn't mind me  speaking for him like that, but I'll take the risk. 
 
         Peace Love and  Kindness
             Randy
         BiscuitBoy Blues 
On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>  wrote: 
Randy  will come back to us when he can, I'm sure 
On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> wrote: 
I just realizeed that I havent hearrd from randy for a while...  I miss your witty repartae randy...... email back so that I chan  feel the love...... I was thinking about you, and I hoep you are  doing good.... let me know if can help if you are having  problems....... mujch love...... 
junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a junkboy....  damn... the cops keep drivijg by thry ihg
specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four  wheelers), and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything  call or email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or  reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
 
if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine,  meth, ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i  promise....
-----  Original Message ----- 
From: Brad  Hays 
To: The Ibogaine List 
Sent: Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine article barcelona conferenceWould love to see all of this Howard, and thanks  for your work on it.  Actually I'd like to see that article  in opposition to ibogaine too if it's around. 
On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard  Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com>  wrote: 
I  had forwarded the entire newsletter of May 11/12 from the  Barcelona conference that had the promotional article for the  ibogaine session to this list but, it does not appear to have  landed.;  I have thus hoping that the article alone that is  much smaller will work. A later edition of the Daily Update  newsletter contained an article in opposition to ibogaine but,  there is no doubt that ibogaine prevailed during the special  session in which ibogaine presentations took place and in the  minds and hearts of drug users and drug policy activists. 
I will see if I can get all of the slide shows and articles  into a composite report within the next few weeks.Howard
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From wleetheriot at ca.rr.com  Sun Jun  1 14:59:25 2008
From: wleetheriot at ca.rr.com (Warren Theriot)
Date: Sun, 01 Jun 2008 11:59:25 -0700
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4842F18D.6000601@ca.rr.com>

I don't know how to make friends with these people. I can 
walk up to them and smile and say hi and talk about shit but
I would be having to be there with the vicious acting dog 
right in front of me feeling intimidated. I have't been 
given one break and every other neighbor has to put up with 
this dog too and nobody says a thing. How do you make this 
guy a "friend" unless I had the power of a Mob boss in this 
neigborhood. I just don't trust these people. I don't want 
to express any kind of xenophobia but I think these people 
like making asses out of themselves. I'll say this and it is 
as much as I am going to say for a rant statement:
Big Dog, Little Dick!
Warren

Brad Hays wrote:
> Same advice here Warren.  Flipped through that video and theres no way I 
> could listen to that.  I would gradually make friends with that guy 
> cause he isn't gonna be too happy when they get taken away.  Sometimes 
> with two dogs only one of em is the barker so maybe he won't lose both of em
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:33 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com 
> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
> 
>     Warren,
>     I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog
>     is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie,
>     the pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the
>     dog breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm
>     and the dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all
>     citys have a nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of
>     each offence, even if the cops don't catch the dog, then after you
>     have enough evidince to give to the animal cruality people, they
>     will take the dog away, rehabilate it and find it a good
>     home.........(ive had neighbors who wouldn't take care of their dog)
>     just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
>     junky
>      
>      
>     specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers),
>     and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or
>     email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even
>     if the part is obsolete.
>      
>     if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth,
>     ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
> 
>         ----- Original Message -----
>         *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
>         *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>         *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
>         *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>         (randy)
> 
>         Word.
>         What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
>         where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
>         What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
>         words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>           to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
>         prescription pain medications and returned home to this
>         environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
>         let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
>         the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
>         day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
>         up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
>         meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
>         ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
>         year and three months in this environment.
>         Peace someday...
>         Warren
> 
> 
>         Juliano wrote:
>          > Hi Simon,
>          > 
>          > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that
>         you said
>          > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>          > 
>          > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in
>         principle
>          > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished
>         to, and get
>          > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>          > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some
>         'mystery
>          > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>          > 
>          > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental
>         health
>          > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole
>         ediface is
>          > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions
>         really function
>          > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor
>         that have
>          > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
>         oppressive
>          > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
>          > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
>         cannot even
>          > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm
>         that breeds
>          > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>          > 
>          > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really
>         gone away):
>          > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
>         would be
>          > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally
>         ill' and
>          > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>          >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
>         'reality',
>          > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be
>         not-normal! Now if
>          > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
>         even s/he
>          > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>          > 
>          > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
>         'capitalist'
>          > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
>         distress about
>          > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and
>         abuse, of this
>          > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which
>         can include
>          > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
>         stigmatized as
>          > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of
>         'mental
>          > illness', and all that that means in the community. How
>         others think and
>          > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
>          > 
>          > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/,
>         it is how
>          > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
>         Because not
>          > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet
>         Earth is now
>          > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of
>         life!
>          > 
>          > regarde
>          > 
>          > Juliano
>          >
>          >     ----- Original Message -----
>          >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>          >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>          >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>         lately (randy)
>          >
>          >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in
>         because I
>          >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said
>         "these secrets
>          >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look
>         at the
>          >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
>         people who
>          >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
>         stuck with
>          >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding
>         etc. Where I
>          >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
>         semi-working
>          >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
>         receiving the
>          >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
>         have seen
>          >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are
>         treated in whats
>          >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
>         there was a
>          >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication
>         these
>          >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it?
>         Who really
>          >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently
>         allocated to
>          >     these people? The only people that would possibly have
>         access are
>          >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a
>         change
>          >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>          >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in
>         a state of
>          >     decay outside of private health care. In private health
>         care it is
>          >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said
>         and thats
>          >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the
>         symptoms.
>          >
>          >     ----- Original Message ----
>          >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
>         <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
>          >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>          >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>          >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>         lately (randy)
>          >
>          >     This is the most powerful of statements, 
>          >
>          >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>          >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>         likely would
>          >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>          >         support, yes.
>          >
>          >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it
>         wrong.
>          >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a
>         moment thinking
>          >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there
>         are so many
>          >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this
>         all very
>          >     whole for me.
>          >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
>         illness.  Now
>          >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>          >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only
>         a catch
>          >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior
>         that
>          >     people some times display.  I say people because on this
>         list at
>          >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
>         indescribable
>          >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
>         treatment for
>          >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see
>         in the
>          >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10
>         of Haldol
>          >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking
>         out.  Thats
>          >     the truth.  I see the truth.
>          >    
>         http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>          >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we
>         all know
>          >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms,
>         when your
>          >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>          >     
>          >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a
>         holistic
>          >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in
>         to the
>          >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community
>         refuses to
>          >     look at the whole picture.
>          >     
>          >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
>         e-textbook format.
>          >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>         <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
> 
>          >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>          >     
>          >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>          >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar,
>         it was just
>          >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
>         even have
>          >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep
>         breaking it down
>          >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
>          >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
>         describing and
>          >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order
>         to truely
>          >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>          >     Every medical scientific community for the most part
>         refuses to look
>          >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
>          >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with
>         Howard, Simon,
>          >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the
>         custom/religion of
>          >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society
>         proven to
>          >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to
>         people.
>          >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution
>         of things,
>          >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when
>         we treat
>          >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect
>         that has
>          >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use
>         of the
>          >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>          >     community has failed to treat people.
>          >     
>          >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>          >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism
>         shit.  I've
>          >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly
>         IMO how much
>          >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
>         sprituality
>          >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
>          >     
>          >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right
>         now is in a
>          >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to
>         argue
>          >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for
>         the better
>          >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his
>         quest to
>          >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I
>         support his
>          >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
>         currently.
>          >     And where I have been currently trying to make a
>         difference on a
>          >     very 1:1 level.
>          >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>          >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people. 
>         Yet being
>          >     able to be real with people with out it being
>         unprofessional.
>          >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki,
>         hypmotism, all
>          >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will
>         let us in.
>          >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues. 
>         I'm glad
>          >     your helping fight it.
>          >     Mel
>          >     
>          >     
>          >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
>         <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>          >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >         Hi Simon,
>          >         
>          >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can:
>         For a start
>          >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a
>         biological
>          >         disease. There are no tests.
>          >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed
>         disturbing and
>          >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this
>         doesn't
>          >         make them diseases.
>          >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>          >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of
>         being 'ill',
>          >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
>         locked up,
>          >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means
>         that the
>          >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture,
>         world, is
>          >         conveniently not being looked at.
>          >         
>          >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going
>         on, which
>          >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking
>         at the
>          >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
>         military
>          >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./
>         Otherwise/, you can
>          >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very
>         superficial way. No
>          >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
>          >         
>          >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are
>         suffering under
>          >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>          >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it
>         is ALL
>          >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
>         understand we
>          >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the
>         usual western
>          >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated
>         vision.
>          >         
>          >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I
>         was very
>          >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>          >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
>         Nature. Ie.,
>          >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid
>         into Nature
>          >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the
>         'big
>          >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>          >         
>          >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
>         'psychosis' via
>          >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
>         prevailing
>          >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category
>         and is very
>          >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong
>         cannabis
>          >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'.
>         And I am
>          >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>          >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>          >         
>          >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'?
>         Wel...yes, --not
>          >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is
>         not physical
>          >         disease but a process!
>          >         
>          >         Of?
>          >         
>          >         To understand we have to again understand the vast
>         enormous
>          >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so
>         pressurized
>          >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a
>         healing
>          >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
>         mythical
>          >         visions etc etc.
>          >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress
>         these
>          >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
>         nervous-system
>          >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As
>         long as
>          >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to
>         deal with this
>          >         challenges their worldviews.
>          >         
>          >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>          >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>         likey would be
>          >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering
>         loving support, yes.
>          >         
>          >         THE most important thing to consider with
>         psychedelics is Set &
>          >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful
>         advice. Not a
>          >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed
>         not 'normal'
>          >         as psychotic.
>          >         
>          >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member
>         of this
>          >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has
>         recently shared
>          >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
>         Germany. For
>          >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
>         diagnosed
>          >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this
>         discussion continues
>          >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>          >         
>          >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
>         society's
>          >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire
>         cultivate their own
>          >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing
>         is to
>          >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
>         intelligent
>          >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>          >         
>          >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
>         respect for
>          >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>          >         
>          >         regarde
>          >         
>          >         Juliano
>          >         
>          >         
>          >
>          >             ----- Original Message -----
>          >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>          >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>          >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>         buscit boy
>          >             lately (randy)
>          >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your
>         mails;
>          >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
>         psychedelics are
>          >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed
>         the point I
>          >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of
>         cases of
>          >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
>         substances have
>          >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in
>         controlled
>          >             circumstances or approached medically. I would
>         just like to
>          >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics
>         are to be
>          >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>          >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
>         possibly
>          >             in people that have borderline personality
>         disorders or
>          >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come
>         up with any
>          >             other description other than mental imbalance and
>          >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I
>         can use to
>          >             describe the type of persons where this type of
>         medication
>          >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I
>         am only
>          >             going with my limited understanding of mental
>         illness but
>          >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>          >             especially instances where these conditions were
>         aggravated
>          >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances.
>         But as I
>          >             said earlier this was not anything to do with
>         cases where
>          >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a
>         clinical
>          >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
>         understanding of
>          >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>          >             illness and think there is enough evidence to
>         support its
>          >             existence; which is why I think I may be
>         misunderstanding
>          >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I
>         look
>          >             forward to your comment.
>          >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant
>         took LSD
>          >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found
>         interesting.
>          >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
>         figure out
>          >             what LSD was useful for.
>          >             ----- Original Message ----
>          >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>         <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>          >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>          >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>          >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>          >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit
>         boy lately
>          >             (randy)
>          >             Hi Randy,
>          >             
>          >             Sorry to hear about your son.
>          >             
>          >             Just to say though/never worry about what people
>         say. UNLESS
>          >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can
>         do--please
>          >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as
>         you see fit.
>          >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique
>         perspectives!
>          >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>          >             
>          >             regarde
>          >             
>          >             Juliano
>          >
>          >                 ----- Original Message -----
>          >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
>         <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>          >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>          >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>         buscit boy
>          >                 lately (randy)
>          >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written
>         up and my
>          >                 Momma did something and it went to saved
>         drafts and I
>          >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>          >                 up".............He He
>          >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard
>         time
>          >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been
>         having a
>          >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing
>         too, too many
>          >                 to talk about really.
>          >                 
>          >                          My son got himself in some pretty
>         deep shit,
>          >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on
>         probation it
>          >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
>         have been
>          >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get
>         put in
>          >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got
>         him out of
>          >                 everything but the probation violation so he
>         has to do
>          >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I
>         cried like a
>          >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit.
>         I'm so glad
>          >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been
>         helping
>          >                 each other out here lately. God I love her
>         so, but I
>          >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the
>         root of all
>          >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
>         better, but
>          >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there
>         in the cell
>          >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in
>         jail like
>          >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he
>         can adapt
>          >                 to just about anything but
>         still.........fuck, my boy is
>          >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big
>         part ot
>          >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell
>         she smoked
>          >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when
>         Randy was 8
>          >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him
>         in line. I
>          >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just
>         not enough
>          >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm
>         any kind of
>          >                 saint or anything but I think I might have
>         made a little
>          >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right
>         after we got
>          >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from
>         the ink.
>          >                 That was my fault.
>          >                 
>          >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on
>         the list but
>          >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something.
>         There were a
>          >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to
>         help in the
>          >                 right way here on the list, a couple of
>         people that I
>          >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad.
>         I guess I'm
>          >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I
>         mean I
>          >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the
>         right
>          >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel
>         that way, so I
>          >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the
>         list.
>          >                 
>          >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
>         reports and
>          >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>          >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
>         There are a
>          >                 few of you that have been here a while now
>         that haven't
>          >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
>         important
>          >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you.
>         You know who
>          >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
>          >                 
>          >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
>         list. It
>          >                 makes me feel better and that is what this
>         list is for,
>          >                 not just dry information. We need all the
>         information we
>          >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>         important.
>          >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
>         agree. I
>          >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
>         that, but
>          >                 I'll take the risk.
>          >                 
>          >                          Peace Love and Kindness
>          >                             Randy
>          >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
>          >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>          >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>         <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>          >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                     Randy will come back to us when he can,
>         I'm sure
>          >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>          >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com
>         <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
>         from randy
>          >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>          >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
>         feel the
>          >                         love...... I was thinking about you,
>         and I hoep
>          >                         you are doing good.... let me know if
>         can help
>          >                         if you are having problems.......
>         mujch love......
>          >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it
>         seems im a
>          >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep
>         drivijg by
>          >                         thry ihg
>          >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle,
>         atv (three
>          >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile
>         parts from
>          >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call
>         or email,
>          >                         we can get any part you need.
>         new,used, or
>          >                         reproduction. even if the part is
>         obsolete.
>          >                         
>          >                         if someone you love is addicted to
>         something
>          >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>          >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time.....
>         i promise....
>          >
>          >                             ----- Original Message -----
>          >                             *From:* Brad Hays
>          >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>          >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
>          >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>          >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine]
>         ibogaine article
>          >                             barcelona conference
>          >                             Would love to see all of this
>         Howard, and
>          >                             thanks for your work on it. 
>         Actually I'd
>          >                             like to see that article in
>         opposition to
>          >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
>          >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM,
>         Howard
>          >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>         <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
>          >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                                 I had forwarded the entire
>         newsletter of
>          >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>         conference
>          >                                 that had the promotional
>         article for the
>          >                                 ibogaine session to this list
>         but, it
>          >                                 does not appear to have
>         landed.;  I have
>          >                                 thus hoping that the article
>         alone that
>          >                                 is much smaller will work. A
>         later
>          >                                 edition of the Daily Update
>         newsletter
>          >                                 contained an article in
>         opposition to
>          >                                 ibogaine but, there is no
>         doubt that
>          >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the
>         special
>          >                                 session in which ibogaine
>         presentations
>          >                                 took place and in the minds
>         and hearts
>          >                                 of drug users and drug policy
>         activists.
>          >                                 I will see if I can get all
>         of the slide
>          >                                 shows and articles into a
>         composite
>          >                                 report within the next few weeks.
>          >                                 Howard
>          >
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From wleetheriot at ca.rr.com  Sun Jun  1 14:45:53 2008
From: wleetheriot at ca.rr.com (Warren Theriot)
Date: Sun, 01 Jun 2008 11:45:53 -0700
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>
	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4842EE61.8030903@ca.rr.com>

Lee, Its not that the dog runs free in the street, it is my 
opinion the this neighborhood is the Los Angeles' DUMPING 
GROUND for "abused" animals that get "rescued" by neighbors 
with maybe good intentions, but they cannot control the 
animals after the adoptions and the results you see on my 
videos on You Tube. Call the pound. LOL ROTFL Split A GUT 
etc, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, The City Of Los Angeles responding 
to a non 911 call. Especially the Dept of Animal Regulation 
or whatever they call it exactly these days. Can Ibogaine 
help? Has it helped? So far I haven't totally exploded. I 
hope I don't have a stroke or a heart atttack I have become 
so livid about the dogs in my neighborhood like this.
When I went to Mexico to do Ibogaine last year, the first 
thing I noticed was all the dogs and I knew I was going to 
have to work this out among other things with Ibogaine. 
Halfway through the night with Ibogaine purging and 
cleansing my braincells, I was starting to laugh at the dogs 
barking outside randomly. It was a way different ambience in 
Mexico. The dogs ran free and barked at each other, cats, 
chickens, anything they wanted and if a dog was barking for 
too long someone would start yelling and it would shut up. 
When I got back home in 2 weeks after taking Ibogaine, I was 
feeling serene and the dog didn't bother me too much. The 
noises that used to bother me were miraculously not. I never 
felt so calm and unlikely to react to what had previously 
made me livid.
The other night at 11:45PM the dog started barking at 
someone and by midnight I started having a panic attack out 
of nowhere. I knew what was going on but it was still very 
unpleasant. I took my blood pressure and it was 158/96 pulse 
127. I figured that waa OK if I had been doing some exercise 
but I had been sitting still working on my videos. I called 
a friend and talked for a couple of hours. By 2:15 AM my 
readings were 118/78  pulse 79 and I felt calm. But I have 
lost hours and hours of sleep from the anxiety of 
anticipating another round of the noise I have to put up 
with. I got to sleep by 5:45 AM this morning and slept until 
10:30 AM. It was quiet this morning. But the dog sits out it 
is yard just waiting to challenge the first stranger it sees 
within 200 feet walking down the street or walking to or 
from their car.
I did some research, and found I can sue the neighbor for 
$5000 in small claims court. Thats going to happen if the 
city doesn't make this STOP 100% within 3 weeks. I have 
given the guy over a year to comply with the law and it 
hasn't happened and because of this situation I felt it was 
necessary to spend another $4000 or so to get another 
Ibogaine treatment in November to calm my nerves and help me 
gain some more strength to cope. Less than a week after 
returning home I became very ill with viral meningitus and I 
  was miserable. Now the barking starts again this very 
moment. I'll come out of this victorious that I am sure of. 
Cops won't respond to anything less than a 911 call around 
here, and then you have to wait to see if they will show up. 
They tend to blame the person making the complaint also in 
this place.
Peace, someday...
Warren

LEE wrote:
> Warren,
> I don?t like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog 
> is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the 
> pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog 
> breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the 
> dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all citys have a 
> nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of each offence, even 
> if the cops don?t catch the dog, then after you have enough evidince to 
> give to the animal cruality people, they will take the dog away, 
> rehabilate it and find it a good home.........(ive had neighbors who 
> wouldn?t take care of their dog)
> just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
> junky
>  
>  
> specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and 
> snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we 
> can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part 
> is obsolete.
>  
> if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, 
> ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
> 
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
>     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
> 
>     Word.
>     What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
>     where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
>     What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
>     words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>       to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
>     prescription pain medications and returned home to this
>     environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
>     let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
>     the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
>     day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
>     up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
>     meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
>     ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
>     year and three months in this environment.
>     Peace someday...
>     Warren
> 
> 
>     Juliano wrote:
>      > Hi Simon,
>      > 
>      > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you said
>      > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>      > 
>      > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle
>      > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to,
>     and get
>      > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>      > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
>      > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>      > 
>      > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
>      > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is
>      > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really
>     function
>      > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that
>     have
>      > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
>     oppressive
>      > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
>      > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
>     cannot even
>      > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that
>     breeds
>      > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>      > 
>      > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone
>     away):
>      > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
>     would be
>      > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and
>      > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>      >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
>     'reality',
>      > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal!
>     Now if
>      > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
>     even s/he
>      > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>      > 
>      > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
>     'capitalist'
>      > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
>     distress about
>      > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse,
>     of this
>      > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can
>     include
>      > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
>     stigmatized as
>      > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental
>      > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others
>     think and
>      > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
>      > 
>      > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it
>     is how
>      > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
>     Because not
>      > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth
>     is now
>      > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
>      > 
>      > regarde
>      > 
>      > Juliano
>      >
>      >     ----- Original Message -----
>      >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>      >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>      >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>     lately (randy)
>      >
>      >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I
>      >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
>     secrets
>      >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the
>      >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
>     people who
>      >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
>     stuck with
>      >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc.
>     Where I
>      >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
>     semi-working
>      >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
>     receiving the
>      >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
>     have seen
>      >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated
>     in whats
>      >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
>     there was a
>      >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
>      >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really
>      >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to
>      >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access are
>      >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
>      >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>      >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a
>     state of
>      >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care
>     it is
>      >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and
>     thats
>      >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
>      >
>      >     ----- Original Message ----
>      >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
>     <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
>      >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>      >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>      >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>     (randy)
>      >
>      >     This is the most powerful of statements, 
>      >
>      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>      >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely
>     would
>      >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>      >         support, yes.
>      >
>      >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.
>      >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment
>     thinking
>      >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so
>     many
>      >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very
>      >     whole for me.
>      >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
>     illness.  Now
>      >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>      >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch
>      >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
>      >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list at
>      >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
>     indescribable
>      >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
>     treatment for
>      >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the
>      >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of
>     Haldol
>      >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out. 
>     Thats
>      >     the truth.  I see the truth.
>      >    
>     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>      >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know
>      >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
>      >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>      >     
>      >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
>      >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
>      >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to
>      >     look at the whole picture.
>      >     
>      >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
>     e-textbook format.
>      >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>      >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>      >     
>      >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>      >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it
>     was just
>      >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
>     even have
>      >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking
>     it down
>      >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
>      >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
>     describing and
>      >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to
>     truely
>      >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>      >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses
>     to look
>      >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
>      >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard,
>     Simon,
>      >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
>      >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to
>      >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people.
>      >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of
>     things,
>      >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat
>      >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
>      >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the
>      >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>      >     community has failed to treat people.
>      >     
>      >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>      >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've
>      >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO
>     how much
>      >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
>     sprituality
>      >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
>      >     
>      >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is
>     in a
>      >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
>      >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the
>     better
>      >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to
>      >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his
>      >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
>     currently.
>      >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a
>      >     very 1:1 level.
>      >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>      >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being
>      >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.
>      >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all
>      >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let
>     us in.
>      >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm
>     glad
>      >     your helping fight it.
>      >     Mel
>      >     
>      >     
>      >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
>     <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>      >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >         Hi Simon,
>      >         
>      >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a
>     start
>      >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological
>      >         disease. There are no tests.
>      >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
>      >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't
>      >         make them diseases.
>      >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>      >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being
>     'ill',
>      >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
>     locked up,
>      >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
>      >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, is
>      >         conveniently not being looked at.
>      >         
>      >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which
>      >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the
>      >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
>     military
>      >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/,
>     you can
>      >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial
>     way. No
>      >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
>      >         
>      >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering
>     under
>      >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>      >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
>      >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
>     understand we
>      >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual
>     western
>      >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
>      >         
>      >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
>      >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>      >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
>     Nature. Ie.,
>      >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into
>     Nature
>      >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
>      >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>      >         
>      >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
>     'psychosis' via
>      >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
>     prevailing
>      >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and
>     is very
>      >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
>      >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And
>     I am
>      >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>      >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>      >         
>      >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes,
>     --not
>      >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not
>     physical
>      >         disease but a process!
>      >         
>      >         Of?
>      >         
>      >         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
>      >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized
>      >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing
>      >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
>     mythical
>      >         visions etc etc.
>      >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
>      >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
>     nervous-system
>      >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as
>      >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal
>     with this
>      >         challenges their worldviews.
>      >         
>      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>      >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey
>     would be
>      >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>     support, yes.
>      >         
>      >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is
>     Set &
>      >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a
>      >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not
>     'normal'
>      >         as psychotic.
>      >         
>      >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
>      >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently
>     shared
>      >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
>     Germany. For
>      >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
>     diagnosed
>      >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion
>     continues
>      >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>      >         
>      >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
>     society's
>      >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate
>     their own
>      >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
>      >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
>     intelligent
>      >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>      >         
>      >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
>     respect for
>      >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>      >         
>      >         regarde
>      >         
>      >         Juliano
>      >         
>      >         
>      >
>      >             ----- Original Message -----
>      >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>      >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>      >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>      >             lately (randy)
>      >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails;
>      >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
>     psychedelics are
>      >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the
>     point I
>      >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
>      >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
>     substances have
>      >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
>      >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just
>     like to
>      >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are
>     to be
>      >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>      >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
>     possibly
>      >             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
>      >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up
>     with any
>      >             other description other than mental imbalance and
>      >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can
>     use to
>      >             describe the type of persons where this type of
>     medication
>      >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only
>      >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness but
>      >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>      >             especially instances where these conditions were
>     aggravated
>      >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I
>      >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where
>      >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical
>      >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
>     understanding of
>      >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>      >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support its
>      >             existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding
>      >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
>      >             forward to your comment.
>      >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD
>      >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting.
>      >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
>     figure out
>      >             what LSD was useful for.
>      >             ----- Original Message ----
>      >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>      >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>      >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>      >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>      >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>     lately
>      >             (randy)
>      >             Hi Randy,
>      >             
>      >             Sorry to hear about your son.
>      >             
>      >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say.
>     UNLESS
>      >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please
>      >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you
>     see fit.
>      >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
>      >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>      >             
>      >             regarde
>      >             
>      >             Juliano
>      >
>      >                 ----- Original Message -----
>      >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
>     <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>      >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>      >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>     buscit boy
>      >                 lately (randy)
>      >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my
>      >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I
>      >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>      >                 up".............He He
>      >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
>      >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a
>      >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too,
>     too many
>      >                 to talk about really.
>      >                 
>      >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit,
>      >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it
>      >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
>     have been
>      >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in
>      >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him
>     out of
>      >                 everything but the probation violation so he has
>     to do
>      >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried
>     like a
>      >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so
>     glad
>      >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping
>      >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I
>      >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root
>     of all
>      >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
>     better, but
>      >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in
>     the cell
>      >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail
>     like
>      >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can
>     adapt
>      >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my
>     boy is
>      >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot
>      >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she
>     smoked
>      >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
>      >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in
>     line. I
>      >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not
>     enough
>      >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any
>     kind of
>      >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a
>     little
>      >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after
>     we got
>      >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the
>     ink.
>      >                 That was my fault.
>      >                 
>      >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the
>     list but
>      >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There
>     were a
>      >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help
>     in the
>      >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
>      >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I
>     guess I'm
>      >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I
>      >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
>      >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that
>     way, so I
>      >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
>      >                 
>      >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
>     reports and
>      >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>      >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
>     There are a
>      >                 few of you that have been here a while now that
>     haven't
>      >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
>     important
>      >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You
>     know who
>      >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
>      >                 
>      >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
>     list. It
>      >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list
>     is for,
>      >                 not just dry information. We need all the
>     information we
>      >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>     important.
>      >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
>     agree. I
>      >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
>     that, but
>      >                 I'll take the risk.
>      >                 
>      >                          Peace Love and Kindness
>      >                             Randy
>      >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
>      >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>      >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>     <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>      >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
>      >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>      >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>
>     <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
>     from randy
>      >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>      >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
>     feel the
>      >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and
>     I hoep
>      >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can
>     help
>      >                         if you are having problems....... mujch
>     love......
>      >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a
>      >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by
>      >                         thry ihg
>      >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv
>     (three
>      >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from
>      >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or
>     email,
>      >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
>      >                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
>      >                         
>      >                         if someone you love is addicted to something
>      >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>      >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i
>     promise....
>      >
>      >                             ----- Original Message -----
>      >                             *From:* Brad Hays
>      >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>      >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
>      >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>      >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine
>     article
>      >                             barcelona conference
>      >                             Would love to see all of this Howard, and
>      >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd
>      >                             like to see that article in opposition to
>      >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
>      >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard
>      >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>     <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
>      >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                                 I had forwarded the entire
>     newsletter of
>      >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>     conference
>      >                                 that had the promotional article
>     for the
>      >                                 ibogaine session to this list but, it
>      >                                 does not appear to have landed.; 
>     I have
>      >                                 thus hoping that the article
>     alone that
>      >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
>      >                                 edition of the Daily Update
>     newsletter
>      >                                 contained an article in opposition to
>      >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt that
>      >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the special
>      >                                 session in which ibogaine
>     presentations
>      >                                 took place and in the minds and
>     hearts
>      >                                 of drug users and drug policy
>     activists.
>      >                                 I will see if I can get all of
>     the slide
>      >                                 shows and articles into a composite
>      >                                 report within the next few weeks.
>      >                                 Howard
>      >
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From wleetheriot at ca.rr.com  Sun Jun  1 15:05:50 2008
From: wleetheriot at ca.rr.com (Warren Theriot)
Date: Sun, 01 Jun 2008 12:05:50 -0700
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4842F30E.6050608@ca.rr.com>

Theres only one dog. Maybe he won't be happy and I wish the 
city would take the dog away because he is either totally 
INCOMPETENT as an dog trainer or he is doing this on purpose 
to satisfy some ego-power trip he is on. If I have to suffer 
for a year, he can suffer the loss of his dog. I won't go 
near his place. I walk the opposite way when I want to go on 
a walk. Never the less. He is in violation of the stated law 
about barking dog nuiscances and that is that.
Warren

Brad Hays wrote:
> Same advice here Warren.  Flipped through that video and theres no way I 
> could listen to that.  I would gradually make friends with that guy 
> cause he isn't gonna be too happy when they get taken away.  Sometimes 
> with two dogs only one of em is the barker so maybe he won't lose both of em
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:33 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com 
> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
> 
>     Warren,
>     I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog
>     is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie,
>     the pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the
>     dog breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm
>     and the dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all
>     citys have a nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of
>     each offence, even if the cops don't catch the dog, then after you
>     have enough evidince to give to the animal cruality people, they
>     will take the dog away, rehabilate it and find it a good
>     home.........(ive had neighbors who wouldn't take care of their dog)
>     just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
>     junky
>      
>      
>     specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers),
>     and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or
>     email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even
>     if the part is obsolete.
>      
>     if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth,
>     ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
> 
>         ----- Original Message -----
>         *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
>         *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>         *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
>         *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>         (randy)
> 
>         Word.
>         What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
>         where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
>         What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
>         words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>           to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
>         prescription pain medications and returned home to this
>         environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
>         let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
>         the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
>         day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
>         up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
>         meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
>         ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
>         year and three months in this environment.
>         Peace someday...
>         Warren
> 
> 
>         Juliano wrote:
>          > Hi Simon,
>          > 
>          > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that
>         you said
>          > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>          > 
>          > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in
>         principle
>          > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished
>         to, and get
>          > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>          > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some
>         'mystery
>          > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>          > 
>          > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental
>         health
>          > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole
>         ediface is
>          > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions
>         really function
>          > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor
>         that have
>          > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
>         oppressive
>          > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
>          > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
>         cannot even
>          > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm
>         that breeds
>          > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>          > 
>          > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really
>         gone away):
>          > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
>         would be
>          > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally
>         ill' and
>          > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>          >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
>         'reality',
>          > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be
>         not-normal! Now if
>          > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
>         even s/he
>          > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>          > 
>          > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
>         'capitalist'
>          > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
>         distress about
>          > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and
>         abuse, of this
>          > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which
>         can include
>          > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
>         stigmatized as
>          > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of
>         'mental
>          > illness', and all that that means in the community. How
>         others think and
>          > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
>          > 
>          > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/,
>         it is how
>          > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
>         Because not
>          > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet
>         Earth is now
>          > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of
>         life!
>          > 
>          > regarde
>          > 
>          > Juliano
>          >
>          >     ----- Original Message -----
>          >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>          >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>          >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>         lately (randy)
>          >
>          >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in
>         because I
>          >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said
>         "these secrets
>          >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look
>         at the
>          >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
>         people who
>          >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
>         stuck with
>          >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding
>         etc. Where I
>          >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
>         semi-working
>          >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
>         receiving the
>          >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
>         have seen
>          >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are
>         treated in whats
>          >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
>         there was a
>          >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication
>         these
>          >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it?
>         Who really
>          >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently
>         allocated to
>          >     these people? The only people that would possibly have
>         access are
>          >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a
>         change
>          >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>          >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in
>         a state of
>          >     decay outside of private health care. In private health
>         care it is
>          >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said
>         and thats
>          >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the
>         symptoms.
>          >
>          >     ----- Original Message ----
>          >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
>         <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
>          >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>          >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>          >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>         lately (randy)
>          >
>          >     This is the most powerful of statements, 
>          >
>          >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>          >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>         likely would
>          >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>          >         support, yes.
>          >
>          >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it
>         wrong.
>          >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a
>         moment thinking
>          >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there
>         are so many
>          >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this
>         all very
>          >     whole for me.
>          >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
>         illness.  Now
>          >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>          >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only
>         a catch
>          >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior
>         that
>          >     people some times display.  I say people because on this
>         list at
>          >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
>         indescribable
>          >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
>         treatment for
>          >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see
>         in the
>          >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10
>         of Haldol
>          >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking
>         out.  Thats
>          >     the truth.  I see the truth.
>          >    
>         http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>          >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we
>         all know
>          >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms,
>         when your
>          >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>          >     
>          >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a
>         holistic
>          >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in
>         to the
>          >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community
>         refuses to
>          >     look at the whole picture.
>          >     
>          >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
>         e-textbook format.
>          >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>         <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
> 
>          >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>          >     
>          >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>          >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar,
>         it was just
>          >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
>         even have
>          >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep
>         breaking it down
>          >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
>          >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
>         describing and
>          >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order
>         to truely
>          >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>          >     Every medical scientific community for the most part
>         refuses to look
>          >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
>          >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with
>         Howard, Simon,
>          >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the
>         custom/religion of
>          >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society
>         proven to
>          >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to
>         people.
>          >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution
>         of things,
>          >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when
>         we treat
>          >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect
>         that has
>          >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use
>         of the
>          >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>          >     community has failed to treat people.
>          >     
>          >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>          >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism
>         shit.  I've
>          >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly
>         IMO how much
>          >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
>         sprituality
>          >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
>          >     
>          >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right
>         now is in a
>          >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to
>         argue
>          >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for
>         the better
>          >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his
>         quest to
>          >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I
>         support his
>          >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
>         currently.
>          >     And where I have been currently trying to make a
>         difference on a
>          >     very 1:1 level.
>          >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>          >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people. 
>         Yet being
>          >     able to be real with people with out it being
>         unprofessional.
>          >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki,
>         hypmotism, all
>          >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will
>         let us in.
>          >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues. 
>         I'm glad
>          >     your helping fight it.
>          >     Mel
>          >     
>          >     
>          >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
>         <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>          >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >         Hi Simon,
>          >         
>          >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can:
>         For a start
>          >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a
>         biological
>          >         disease. There are no tests.
>          >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed
>         disturbing and
>          >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this
>         doesn't
>          >         make them diseases.
>          >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>          >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of
>         being 'ill',
>          >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
>         locked up,
>          >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means
>         that the
>          >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture,
>         world, is
>          >         conveniently not being looked at.
>          >         
>          >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going
>         on, which
>          >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking
>         at the
>          >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
>         military
>          >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./
>         Otherwise/, you can
>          >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very
>         superficial way. No
>          >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
>          >         
>          >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are
>         suffering under
>          >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>          >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it
>         is ALL
>          >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
>         understand we
>          >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the
>         usual western
>          >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated
>         vision.
>          >         
>          >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I
>         was very
>          >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>          >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
>         Nature. Ie.,
>          >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid
>         into Nature
>          >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the
>         'big
>          >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>          >         
>          >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
>         'psychosis' via
>          >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
>         prevailing
>          >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category
>         and is very
>          >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong
>         cannabis
>          >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'.
>         And I am
>          >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>          >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>          >         
>          >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'?
>         Wel...yes, --not
>          >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is
>         not physical
>          >         disease but a process!
>          >         
>          >         Of?
>          >         
>          >         To understand we have to again understand the vast
>         enormous
>          >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so
>         pressurized
>          >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a
>         healing
>          >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
>         mythical
>          >         visions etc etc.
>          >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress
>         these
>          >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
>         nervous-system
>          >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As
>         long as
>          >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to
>         deal with this
>          >         challenges their worldviews.
>          >         
>          >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>          >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>         likey would be
>          >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering
>         loving support, yes.
>          >         
>          >         THE most important thing to consider with
>         psychedelics is Set &
>          >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful
>         advice. Not a
>          >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed
>         not 'normal'
>          >         as psychotic.
>          >         
>          >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member
>         of this
>          >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has
>         recently shared
>          >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
>         Germany. For
>          >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
>         diagnosed
>          >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this
>         discussion continues
>          >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>          >         
>          >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
>         society's
>          >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire
>         cultivate their own
>          >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing
>         is to
>          >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
>         intelligent
>          >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>          >         
>          >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
>         respect for
>          >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>          >         
>          >         regarde
>          >         
>          >         Juliano
>          >         
>          >         
>          >
>          >             ----- Original Message -----
>          >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>          >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>          >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>         buscit boy
>          >             lately (randy)
>          >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your
>         mails;
>          >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
>         psychedelics are
>          >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed
>         the point I
>          >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of
>         cases of
>          >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
>         substances have
>          >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in
>         controlled
>          >             circumstances or approached medically. I would
>         just like to
>          >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics
>         are to be
>          >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>          >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
>         possibly
>          >             in people that have borderline personality
>         disorders or
>          >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come
>         up with any
>          >             other description other than mental imbalance and
>          >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I
>         can use to
>          >             describe the type of persons where this type of
>         medication
>          >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I
>         am only
>          >             going with my limited understanding of mental
>         illness but
>          >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>          >             especially instances where these conditions were
>         aggravated
>          >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances.
>         But as I
>          >             said earlier this was not anything to do with
>         cases where
>          >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a
>         clinical
>          >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
>         understanding of
>          >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>          >             illness and think there is enough evidence to
>         support its
>          >             existence; which is why I think I may be
>         misunderstanding
>          >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I
>         look
>          >             forward to your comment.
>          >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant
>         took LSD
>          >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found
>         interesting.
>          >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
>         figure out
>          >             what LSD was useful for.
>          >             ----- Original Message ----
>          >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>         <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>          >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>          >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>          >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>          >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit
>         boy lately
>          >             (randy)
>          >             Hi Randy,
>          >             
>          >             Sorry to hear about your son.
>          >             
>          >             Just to say though/never worry about what people
>         say. UNLESS
>          >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can
>         do--please
>          >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as
>         you see fit.
>          >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique
>         perspectives!
>          >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>          >             
>          >             regarde
>          >             
>          >             Juliano
>          >
>          >                 ----- Original Message -----
>          >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
>         <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>          >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List
>         <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>          >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>         buscit boy
>          >                 lately (randy)
>          >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written
>         up and my
>          >                 Momma did something and it went to saved
>         drafts and I
>          >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>          >                 up".............He He
>          >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard
>         time
>          >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been
>         having a
>          >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing
>         too, too many
>          >                 to talk about really.
>          >                 
>          >                          My son got himself in some pretty
>         deep shit,
>          >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on
>         probation it
>          >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
>         have been
>          >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get
>         put in
>          >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got
>         him out of
>          >                 everything but the probation violation so he
>         has to do
>          >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I
>         cried like a
>          >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit.
>         I'm so glad
>          >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been
>         helping
>          >                 each other out here lately. God I love her
>         so, but I
>          >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the
>         root of all
>          >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
>         better, but
>          >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there
>         in the cell
>          >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in
>         jail like
>          >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he
>         can adapt
>          >                 to just about anything but
>         still.........fuck, my boy is
>          >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big
>         part ot
>          >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell
>         she smoked
>          >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when
>         Randy was 8
>          >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him
>         in line. I
>          >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just
>         not enough
>          >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm
>         any kind of
>          >                 saint or anything but I think I might have
>         made a little
>          >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right
>         after we got
>          >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from
>         the ink.
>          >                 That was my fault.
>          >                 
>          >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on
>         the list but
>          >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something.
>         There were a
>          >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to
>         help in the
>          >                 right way here on the list, a couple of
>         people that I
>          >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad.
>         I guess I'm
>          >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I
>         mean I
>          >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the
>         right
>          >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel
>         that way, so I
>          >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the
>         list.
>          >                 
>          >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
>         reports and
>          >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>          >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
>         There are a
>          >                 few of you that have been here a while now
>         that haven't
>          >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
>         important
>          >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you.
>         You know who
>          >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
>          >                 
>          >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
>         list. It
>          >                 makes me feel better and that is what this
>         list is for,
>          >                 not just dry information. We need all the
>         information we
>          >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>         important.
>          >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
>         agree. I
>          >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
>         that, but
>          >                 I'll take the risk.
>          >                 
>          >                          Peace Love and Kindness
>          >                             Randy
>          >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
>          >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>          >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>         <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>          >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                     Randy will come back to us when he can,
>         I'm sure
>          >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>          >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com
>         <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
>         from randy
>          >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>          >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
>         feel the
>          >                         love...... I was thinking about you,
>         and I hoep
>          >                         you are doing good.... let me know if
>         can help
>          >                         if you are having problems.......
>         mujch love......
>          >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it
>         seems im a
>          >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep
>         drivijg by
>          >                         thry ihg
>          >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle,
>         atv (three
>          >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile
>         parts from
>          >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call
>         or email,
>          >                         we can get any part you need.
>         new,used, or
>          >                         reproduction. even if the part is
>         obsolete.
>          >                         
>          >                         if someone you love is addicted to
>         something
>          >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>          >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time.....
>         i promise....
>          >
>          >                             ----- Original Message -----
>          >                             *From:* Brad Hays
>          >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>          >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
>          >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>          >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>          >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine]
>         ibogaine article
>          >                             barcelona conference
>          >                             Would love to see all of this
>         Howard, and
>          >                             thanks for your work on it. 
>         Actually I'd
>          >                             like to see that article in
>         opposition to
>          >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
>          >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM,
>         Howard
>          >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>         <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
>          >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
>          >
>          >                                 I had forwarded the entire
>         newsletter of
>          >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>         conference
>          >                                 that had the promotional
>         article for the
>          >                                 ibogaine session to this list
>         but, it
>          >                                 does not appear to have
>         landed.;  I have
>          >                                 thus hoping that the article
>         alone that
>          >                                 is much smaller will work. A
>         later
>          >                                 edition of the Daily Update
>         newsletter
>          >                                 contained an article in
>         opposition to
>          >                                 ibogaine but, there is no
>         doubt that
>          >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the
>         special
>          >                                 session in which ibogaine
>         presentations
>          >                                 took place and in the minds
>         and hearts
>          >                                 of drug users and drug policy
>         activists.
>          >                                 I will see if I can get all
>         of the slide
>          >                                 shows and articles into a
>         composite
>          >                                 report within the next few weeks.
>          >                                 Howard
>          >
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From juliano8 at ntlworld.com  Sun Jun  1 15:34:25 2008
From: juliano8 at ntlworld.com (Juliano)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 20:34:25 +0100
Subject: [Ibogaine] The Ecstasy of Wild, and !num
Message-ID: <001e01c8c41e$813164a0$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>

HI, 

Earlier I received this message and link to this really important audio interview. "A Most Important Message? Metanauts,

How many times does Joanna have to go over the top with her interviews on
futureprimitive.org before she gets our full attention? With the interview
with Bradford Kinney, she has captured what may be the most important
message of our time.

http://www.futureprimitive.org/mp3/Keeney080522.mp3

I have tried to say this again and again in many ways. Kinney puts it
incomparably. Listen to this interview!!

JLL"

It is a great and liberating interview, and I want to share it far and wide.


I know that Simon will maybe be particularly interested in this because it very much emphasizes the deepness of African  wisdom!
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From juliano8 at ntlworld.com  Sun Jun  1 16:03:25 2008
From: juliano8 at ntlworld.com (Juliano)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 21:03:25 +0100
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com><BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<4842EE61.8030903@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <004d01c8c422$92fac7e0$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>

Hi Warren,

In UK this is called 'noise pollution' and you can do something. the owner 
should know how to train the dog to not bark all day and night.

Dogs though must have some freedom. They are cooped up just like us. But not 
all the time barking. that drives us mad

regards

Juliano
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Warren Theriot" <wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


Lee, Its not that the dog runs free in the street, it is my
opinion the this neighborhood is the Los Angeles' DUMPING
GROUND for "abused" animals that get "rescued" by neighbors
with maybe good intentions, but they cannot control the
animals after the adoptions and the results you see on my
videos on You Tube. Call the pound. LOL ROTFL Split A GUT
etc, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, The City Of Los Angeles responding
to a non 911 call. Especially the Dept of Animal Regulation
or whatever they call it exactly these days. Can Ibogaine
help? Has it helped? So far I haven't totally exploded. I
hope I don't have a stroke or a heart atttack I have become
so livid about the dogs in my neighborhood like this.
When I went to Mexico to do Ibogaine last year, the first
thing I noticed was all the dogs and I knew I was going to
have to work this out among other things with Ibogaine.
Halfway through the night with Ibogaine purging and
cleansing my braincells, I was starting to laugh at the dogs
barking outside randomly. It was a way different ambience in
Mexico. The dogs ran free and barked at each other, cats,
chickens, anything they wanted and if a dog was barking for
too long someone would start yelling and it would shut up.
When I got back home in 2 weeks after taking Ibogaine, I was
feeling serene and the dog didn't bother me too much. The
noises that used to bother me were miraculously not. I never
felt so calm and unlikely to react to what had previously
made me livid.
The other night at 11:45PM the dog started barking at
someone and by midnight I started having a panic attack out
of nowhere. I knew what was going on but it was still very
unpleasant. I took my blood pressure and it was 158/96 pulse
127. I figured that waa OK if I had been doing some exercise
but I had been sitting still working on my videos. I called
a friend and talked for a couple of hours. By 2:15 AM my
readings were 118/78  pulse 79 and I felt calm. But I have
lost hours and hours of sleep from the anxiety of
anticipating another round of the noise I have to put up
with. I got to sleep by 5:45 AM this morning and slept until
10:30 AM. It was quiet this morning. But the dog sits out it
is yard just waiting to challenge the first stranger it sees
within 200 feet walking down the street or walking to or
from their car.
I did some research, and found I can sue the neighbor for
$5000 in small claims court. Thats going to happen if the
city doesn't make this STOP 100% within 3 weeks. I have
given the guy over a year to comply with the law and it
hasn't happened and because of this situation I felt it was
necessary to spend another $4000 or so to get another
Ibogaine treatment in November to calm my nerves and help me
gain some more strength to cope. Less than a week after
returning home I became very ill with viral meningitus and I
  was miserable. Now the barking starts again this very
moment. I'll come out of this victorious that I am sure of.
Cops won't respond to anything less than a 911 call around
here, and then you have to wait to see if they will show up.
They tend to blame the person making the complaint also in
this place.
Peace, someday...
Warren

LEE wrote:
> Warren,
> I don?t like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog
> is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the
> pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog
> breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the
> dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all citys have a
> nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of each offence, even
> if the cops don?t catch the dog, then after you have enough evidince to
> give to the animal cruality people, they will take the dog away,
> rehabilate it and find it a good home.........(ive had neighbors who
> wouldn?t take care of their dog)
> just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
> junky
>
>
> specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and
> snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we
> can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part
> is obsolete.
>
> if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth,
> ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
>
>     ----- Original Message -----
>     *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
>     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
>     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
>
>     Word.
>     What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
>     where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
>     What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
>     words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>       to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
>     prescription pain medications and returned home to this
>     environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
>     let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
>     the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
>     day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
>     up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
>     meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
>     ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
>     year and three months in this environment.
>     Peace someday...
>     Warren
>
>
>     Juliano wrote:
>      > Hi Simon,
>      >
>      > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you 
> said
>      > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>      >
>      > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle
>      > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to,
>     and get
>      > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>      > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
>      > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>      >
>      > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
>      > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface 
> is
>      > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really
>     function
>      > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that
>     have
>      > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
>     oppressive
>      > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
>      > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
>     cannot even
>      > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that
>     breeds
>      > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>      >
>      > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone
>     away):
>      > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
>     would be
>      > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' 
> and
>      > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>      >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
>     'reality',
>      > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal!
>     Now if
>      > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
>     even s/he
>      > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>      >
>      > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
>     'capitalist'
>      > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
>     distress about
>      > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse,
>     of this
>      > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can
>     include
>      > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
>     stigmatized as
>      > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental
>      > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others
>     think and
>      > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
>      >
>      > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it
>     is how
>      > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
>     Because not
>      > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth
>     is now
>      > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
>      >
>      > regarde
>      >
>      > Juliano
>      >
>      >     ----- Original Message -----
>      >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>      >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>      >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>     lately (randy)
>      >
>      >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because 
> I
>      >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
>     secrets
>      >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at 
> the
>      >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
>     people who
>      >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
>     stuck with
>      >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc.
>     Where I
>      >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
>     semi-working
>      >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
>     receiving the
>      >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
>     have seen
>      >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated
>     in whats
>      >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
>     there was a
>      >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
>      >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who 
> really
>      >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated 
> to
>      >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access 
> are
>      >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
>      >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>      >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a
>     state of
>      >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care
>     it is
>      >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and
>     thats
>      >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the 
> symptoms.
>      >
>      >     ----- Original Message ----
>      >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
>     <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
>      >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>      >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>      >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>     (randy)
>      >
>      >     This is the most powerful of statements,
>      >
>      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>      >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely
>     would
>      >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>      >         support, yes.
>      >
>      >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.
>      >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment
>     thinking
>      >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so
>     many
>      >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all 
> very
>      >     whole for me.
>      >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
>     illness.  Now
>      >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>      >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a 
> catch
>      >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
>      >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list 
> at
>      >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
>     indescribable
>      >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
>     treatment for
>      >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in 
> the
>      >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of
>     Haldol
>      >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.
>     Thats
>      >     the truth.  I see the truth.
>      >
>     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>      >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all 
> know
>      >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
>      >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>      >
>      >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
>      >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
>      >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses 
> to
>      >     look at the whole picture.
>      >
>      >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
>     e-textbook format.
>      >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>      >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>      >
>      >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>      >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it
>     was just
>      >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
>     even have
>      >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking
>     it down
>      >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
>      >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
>     describing and
>      >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to
>     truely
>      >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>      >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses
>     to look
>      >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
>      >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard,
>     Simon,
>      >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
>      >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven 
> to
>      >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to 
> people.
>      >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of
>     things,
>      >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we 
> treat
>      >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
>      >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of 
> the
>      >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>      >     community has failed to treat people.
>      >
>      >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>      >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit. 
> I've
>      >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO
>     how much
>      >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
>     sprituality
>      >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
>      >
>      >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is
>     in a
>      >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
>      >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the
>     better
>      >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest 
> to
>      >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support 
> his
>      >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
>     currently.
>      >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on 
> a
>      >     very 1:1 level.
>      >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>      >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet 
> being
>      >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.
>      >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, 
> all
>      >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let
>     us in.
>      >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm
>     glad
>      >     your helping fight it.
>      >     Mel
>      >
>      >
>      >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
>     <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>      >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >         Hi Simon,
>      >
>      >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a
>     start
>      >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a 
> biological
>      >         disease. There are no tests.
>      >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
>      >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this 
> doesn't
>      >         make them diseases.
>      >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>      >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being
>     'ill',
>      >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
>     locked up,
>      >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
>      >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, 
> is
>      >         conveniently not being looked at.
>      >
>      >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, 
> which
>      >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at 
> the
>      >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
>     military
>      >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/,
>     you can
>      >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial
>     way. No
>      >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
>      >
>      >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering
>     under
>      >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>      >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
>      >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
>     understand we
>      >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual
>     western
>      >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
>      >
>      >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
>      >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>      >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
>     Nature. Ie.,
>      >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into
>     Nature
>      >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
>      >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>      >
>      >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
>     'psychosis' via
>      >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
>     prevailing
>      >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and
>     is very
>      >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
>      >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And
>     I am
>      >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>      >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>      >
>      >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes,
>     --not
>      >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not
>     physical
>      >         disease but a process!
>      >
>      >         Of?
>      >
>      >         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
>      >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so 
> pressurized
>      >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a 
> healing
>      >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
>     mythical
>      >         visions etc etc.
>      >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
>      >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
>     nervous-system
>      >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long 
> as
>      >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal
>     with this
>      >         challenges their worldviews.
>      >
>      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>      >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey
>     would be
>      >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>     support, yes.
>      >
>      >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is
>     Set &
>      >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not 
> a
>      >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not
>     'normal'
>      >         as psychotic.
>      >
>      >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
>      >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently
>     shared
>      >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
>     Germany. For
>      >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
>     diagnosed
>      >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion
>     continues
>      >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>      >
>      >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
>     society's
>      >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate
>     their own
>      >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
>      >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
>     intelligent
>      >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>      >
>      >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
>     respect for
>      >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>      >
>      >         regarde
>      >
>      >         Juliano
>      >
>      >
>      >
>      >             ----- Original Message -----
>      >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>      >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>      >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>      >             lately (randy)
>      >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your 
> mails;
>      >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
>     psychedelics are
>      >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the
>     point I
>      >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
>      >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
>     substances have
>      >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
>      >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just
>     like to
>      >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are
>     to be
>      >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>      >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
>     possibly
>      >             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
>      >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up
>     with any
>      >             other description other than mental imbalance and
>      >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can
>     use to
>      >             describe the type of persons where this type of
>     medication
>      >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am 
> only
>      >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness 
> but
>      >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>      >             especially instances where these conditions were
>     aggravated
>      >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as 
> I
>      >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases 
> where
>      >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a 
> clinical
>      >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
>     understanding of
>      >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>      >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support 
> its
>      >             existence; which is why I think I may be 
> misunderstanding
>      >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
>      >             forward to your comment.
>      >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took 
> LSD
>      >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found 
> interesting.
>      >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
>     figure out
>      >             what LSD was useful for.
>      >             ----- Original Message ----
>      >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>      >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>      >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>      >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>      >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>     lately
>      >             (randy)
>      >             Hi Randy,
>      >
>      >             Sorry to hear about your son.
>      >
>      >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say.
>     UNLESS
>      >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can 
> do--please
>      >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you
>     see fit.
>      >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique 
> perspectives!
>      >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>      >
>      >             regarde
>      >
>      >             Juliano
>      >
>      >                 ----- Original Message -----
>      >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
>     <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>      >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List 
> <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>      >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>     buscit boy
>      >                 lately (randy)
>      >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and 
> my
>      >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and 
> I
>      >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>      >                 up".............He He
>      >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
>      >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having 
> a
>      >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too,
>     too many
>      >                 to talk about really.
>      >
>      >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep 
> shit,
>      >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation 
> it
>      >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
>     have been
>      >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put 
> in
>      >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him
>     out of
>      >                 everything but the probation violation so he has
>     to do
>      >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried
>     like a
>      >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so
>     glad
>      >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been 
> helping
>      >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but 
> I
>      >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root
>     of all
>      >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
>     better, but
>      >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in
>     the cell
>      >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail
>     like
>      >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can
>     adapt
>      >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my
>     boy is
>      >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part 
> ot
>      >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she
>     smoked
>      >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 
> 8
>      >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in
>     line. I
>      >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not
>     enough
>      >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any
>     kind of
>      >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a
>     little
>      >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after
>     we got
>      >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the
>     ink.
>      >                 That was my fault.
>      >
>      >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the
>     list but
>      >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There
>     were a
>      >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help
>     in the
>      >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that 
> I
>      >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I
>     guess I'm
>      >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean 
> I
>      >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
>      >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that
>     way, so I
>      >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
>      >
>      >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
>     reports and
>      >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>      >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
>     There are a
>      >                 few of you that have been here a while now that
>     haven't
>      >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
>     important
>      >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You
>     know who
>      >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
>      >
>      >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
>     list. It
>      >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list
>     is for,
>      >                 not just dry information. We need all the
>     information we
>      >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>     important.
>      >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
>     agree. I
>      >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
>     that, but
>      >                 I'll take the risk.
>      >
>      >                          Peace Love and Kindness
>      >                             Randy
>      >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
>      >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>      >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>     <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>      >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm 
> sure
>      >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>      >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>
>     <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
>     from randy
>      >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>      >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
>     feel the
>      >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and
>     I hoep
>      >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can
>     help
>      >                         if you are having problems....... mujch
>     love......
>      >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im 
> a
>      >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg 
> by
>      >                         thry ihg
>      >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv
>     (three
>      >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts 
> from
>      >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or
>     email,
>      >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
>      >                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
>      >
>      >                         if someone you love is addicted to 
> something
>      >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>      >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i
>     promise....
>      >
>      >                             ----- Original Message -----
>      >                             *From:* Brad Hays
>      >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>      >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
>      >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>      >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>      >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine
>     article
>      >                             barcelona conference
>      >                             Would love to see all of this Howard, 
> and
>      >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually 
> I'd
>      >                             like to see that article in opposition 
> to
>      >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
>      >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, 
> Howard
>      >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>     <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
>      >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
>      >
>      >                                 I had forwarded the entire
>     newsletter of
>      >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>     conference
>      >                                 that had the promotional article
>     for the
>      >                                 ibogaine session to this list but, 
> it
>      >                                 does not appear to have landed.;
>     I have
>      >                                 thus hoping that the article
>     alone that
>      >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
>      >                                 edition of the Daily Update
>     newsletter
>      >                                 contained an article in opposition 
> to
>      >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt 
> that
>      >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the 
> special
>      >                                 session in which ibogaine
>     presentations
>      >                                 took place and in the minds and
>     hearts
>      >                                 of drug users and drug policy
>     activists.
>      >                                 I will see if I can get all of
>     the slide
>      >                                 shows and articles into a composite
>      >                                 report within the next few weeks.
>      >                                 Howard
>      >
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12:25


From bicuitboy714 at gmail.com  Sun Jun  1 16:17:52 2008
From: bicuitboy714 at gmail.com (Randy Faulconer)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 16:17:52 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
In-Reply-To: <4842EE61.8030903@ca.rr.com>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J> <48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>
	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<4842EE61.8030903@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <29d165a30806011317p10cb2e62w5c341f29cfbea023@mail.gmail.com>

          Ya know Warren, you can make a silencer for a 22 real easy and
cheap.........ya take an old Vollkswagen
muffler.............................................did I say that???

         OK I'll shut up.

     Peace Love and Night Vision Scopes
          Randy

On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 2:45 PM, Warren Theriot <wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
wrote:

> Lee, Its not that the dog runs free in the street, it is my
> opinion the this neighborhood is the Los Angeles' DUMPING
> GROUND for "abused" animals that get "rescued" by neighbors
> with maybe good intentions, but they cannot control the
> animals after the adoptions and the results you see on my
> videos on You Tube. Call the pound. LOL ROTFL Split A GUT
> etc, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, The City Of Los Angeles responding
> to a non 911 call. Especially the Dept of Animal Regulation
> or whatever they call it exactly these days. Can Ibogaine
> help? Has it helped? So far I haven't totally exploded. I
> hope I don't have a stroke or a heart atttack I have become
> so livid about the dogs in my neighborhood like this.
> When I went to Mexico to do Ibogaine last year, the first
> thing I noticed was all the dogs and I knew I was going to
> have to work this out among other things with Ibogaine.
> Halfway through the night with Ibogaine purging and
> cleansing my braincells, I was starting to laugh at the dogs
> barking outside randomly. It was a way different ambience in
> Mexico. The dogs ran free and barked at each other, cats,
> chickens, anything they wanted and if a dog was barking for
> too long someone would start yelling and it would shut up.
> When I got back home in 2 weeks after taking Ibogaine, I was
> feeling serene and the dog didn't bother me too much. The
> noises that used to bother me were miraculously not. I never
> felt so calm and unlikely to react to what had previously
> made me livid.
> The other night at 11:45PM the dog started barking at
> someone and by midnight I started having a panic attack out
> of nowhere. I knew what was going on but it was still very
> unpleasant. I took my blood pressure and it was 158/96 pulse
> 127. I figured that waa OK if I had been doing some exercise
> but I had been sitting still working on my videos. I called
> a friend and talked for a couple of hours. By 2:15 AM my
> readings were 118/78  pulse 79 and I felt calm. But I have
> lost hours and hours of sleep from the anxiety of
> anticipating another round of the noise I have to put up
> with. I got to sleep by 5:45 AM this morning and slept until
> 10:30 AM. It was quiet this morning. But the dog sits out it
> is yard just waiting to challenge the first stranger it sees
> within 200 feet walking down the street or walking to or
> from their car.
> I did some research, and found I can sue the neighbor for
> $5000 in small claims court. Thats going to happen if the
> city doesn't make this STOP 100% within 3 weeks. I have
> given the guy over a year to comply with the law and it
> hasn't happened and because of this situation I felt it was
> necessary to spend another $4000 or so to get another
> Ibogaine treatment in November to calm my nerves and help me
> gain some more strength to cope. Less than a week after
> returning home I became very ill with viral meningitus and I
>  was miserable. Now the barking starts again this very
> moment. I'll come out of this victorious that I am sure of.
> Cops won't respond to anything less than a 911 call around
> here, and then you have to wait to see if they will show up.
> They tend to blame the person making the complaint also in
> this place.
> Peace, someday...
> Warren
>
> LEE wrote:
> > Warren,
> > I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog
> > is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the
> > pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog
> > breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the
> > dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all citys have a
> > nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of each offence, even
> > if the cops don't catch the dog, then after you have enough evidince to
> > give to the animal cruality people, they will take the dog away,
> > rehabilate it and find it a good home.........(ive had neighbors who
> > wouldn't take care of their dog)
> > just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
> > junky
> >
> >
> > specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and
> > snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we
> > can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part
> > is obsolete.
> >
> > if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth,
> > ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
> >
> >     ----- Original Message -----
> >     *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
> >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>  >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
> >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
> (randy)
> >
> >     Word.
> >     What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
> >     where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
> >     What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
> >     words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
> >       to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
> >     prescription pain medications and returned home to this
> >     environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
> >     let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
> >     the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
> >     day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
> >     up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
> >     meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
> >     ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
> >     year and three months in this environment.
> >     Peace someday...
> >     Warren
> >
> >
> >     Juliano wrote:
> >      > Hi Simon,
> >      >
> >      > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you
> said
> >      > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
> >      >
> >      > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in
> principle
> >      > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to,
> >     and get
> >      > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
> >      > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some
> 'mystery
> >      > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
> >      >
> >      > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
> >      > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface
> is
> >      > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really
> >     function
> >      > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that
> >     have
> >      > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
> >     oppressive
> >      > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
> >      > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
> >     cannot even
> >      > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that
> >     breeds
> >      > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
> >      >
> >      > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone
> >     away):
> >      > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
> >     would be
> >      > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill'
> and
> >      > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
> >      >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
> >     'reality',
> >      > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal!
> >     Now if
> >      > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
> >     even s/he
> >      > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
> >      >
> >      > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
> >     'capitalist'
> >      > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
> >     distress about
> >      > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse,
> >     of this
> >      > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can
> >     include
> >      > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
> >     stigmatized as
> >      > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of
> 'mental
> >      > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others
> >     think and
> >      > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
> >      >
> >      > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it
> >     is how
> >      > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
> >     Because not
> >      > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth
> >     is now
> >      > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of
> life!
> >      >
> >      > regarde
> >      >
> >      > Juliano
> >      >
> >      >     ----- Original Message -----
> >      >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
> >      >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >      >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
> >      >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
> >     lately (randy)
> >      >
> >      >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because
> I
> >      >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
> >     secrets
> >      >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at
> the
> >      >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
> >     people who
> >      >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
> >     stuck with
> >      >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc.
> >     Where I
> >      >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
> >     semi-working
> >      >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
> >     receiving the
> >      >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
> >     have seen
> >      >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated
> >     in whats
> >      >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
> >     there was a
> >      >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
> >      >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who
> really
> >      >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated
> to
> >      >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access
> are
> >      >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a
> change
> >      >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
> >      >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a
> >     state of
> >      >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care
> >     it is
> >      >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and
> >     thats
> >      >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the
> symptoms.
> >      >
> >      >     ----- Original Message ----
> >      >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
> >     <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
> >      >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>  >     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >      >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
> >      >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
> >     (randy)
> >      >
> >      >     This is the most powerful of statements,
> >      >
> >      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
> >      >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely
> >     would
> >      >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
> >      >         support, yes.
> >      >
> >      >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it
> wrong.
> >      >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment
> >     thinking
> >      >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so
> >     many
> >      >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all
> very
> >      >     whole for me.
> >      >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
> >     illness.  Now
> >      >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
> >      >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a
> catch
> >      >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
> >      >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list
> at
> >      >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
> >     indescribable
> >      >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
> >     treatment for
> >      >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in
> the
> >      >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of
> >     Haldol
> >      >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out.
> >     Thats
> >      >     the truth.  I see the truth.
> >      >
> >     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
> >      >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all
> know
> >      >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when
> your
> >      >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
> >      >
> >      >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a
> holistic
> >      >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to
> the
> >      >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses
> to
> >      >     look at the whole picture.
> >      >
> >      >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
> >     e-textbook format.
> >      >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
> >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>  >      >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
> >
> >      >
> >      >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
> >      >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it
> >     was just
> >      >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
> >     even have
> >      >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking
> >     it down
> >      >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
> >      >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
> >     describing and
> >      >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to
> >     truely
> >      >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
> >      >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses
> >     to look
> >      >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
> >      >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard,
> >     Simon,
> >      >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion
> of
> >      >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven
> to
> >      >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to
> people.
> >      >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of
> >     things,
> >      >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we
> treat
> >      >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
> >      >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of
> the
> >      >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
> >      >     community has failed to treat people.
> >      >
> >      >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
> >      >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.
>  I've
> >      >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO
> >     how much
> >      >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
> >     sprituality
> >      >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
> >      >
> >      >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is
> >     in a
> >      >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to
> argue
> >      >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the
> >     better
> >      >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest
> to
> >      >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support
> his
> >      >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
> >     currently.
> >      >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on
> a
> >      >     very 1:1 level.
> >      >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
> >      >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet
> being
> >      >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.
> >      >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism,
> all
> >      >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let
> >     us in.
> >      >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm
> >     glad
> >      >     your helping fight it.
> >      >     Mel
> >      >
> >      >
> >      >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
> >     <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
> >      >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >         Hi Simon,
> >      >
> >      >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a
> >     start
> >      >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a
> biological
> >      >         disease. There are no tests.
> >      >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
> >      >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this
> doesn't
> >      >         make them diseases.
> >      >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
> >      >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being
> >     'ill',
> >      >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
> >     locked up,
> >      >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that
> the
> >      >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world,
> is
> >      >         conveniently not being looked at.
> >      >
> >      >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on,
> which
> >      >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at
> the
> >      >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
> >     military
> >      >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/,
> >     you can
> >      >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial
> >     way. No
> >      >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
> >      >
> >      >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering
> >     under
> >      >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
> >      >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is
> ALL
> >      >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
> >     understand we
> >      >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual
> >     western
> >      >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
> >      >
> >      >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was
> very
> >      >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
> >      >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
> >     Nature. Ie.,
> >      >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into
> >     Nature
> >      >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
> >      >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
> >      >
> >      >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
> >     'psychosis' via
> >      >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
> >     prevailing
> >      >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and
> >     is very
> >      >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong
> cannabis
> >      >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And
> >     I am
> >      >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
> >      >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
> >      >
> >      >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes,
> >     --not
> >      >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not
> >     physical
> >      >         disease but a process!
> >      >
> >      >         Of?
> >      >
> >      >         To understand we have to again understand the vast
> enormous
> >      >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so
> pressurized
> >      >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a
> healing
> >      >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
> >     mythical
> >      >         visions etc etc.
> >      >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
> >      >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
> >     nervous-system
> >      >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long
> as
> >      >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal
> >     with this
> >      >         challenges their worldviews.
> >      >
> >      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
> >      >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey
> >     would be
> >      >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
> >     support, yes.
> >      >
> >      >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is
> >     Set &
> >      >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not
> a
> >      >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not
> >     'normal'
> >      >         as psychotic.
> >      >
> >      >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of
> this
> >      >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently
> >     shared
> >      >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
> >     Germany. For
> >      >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
> >     diagnosed
> >      >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion
> >     continues
> >      >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
> >      >
> >      >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
> >     society's
> >      >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate
> >     their own
> >      >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is
> to
> >      >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
> >     intelligent
> >      >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
> >      >
> >      >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
> >     respect for
> >      >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
> >      >
> >      >         regarde
> >      >
> >      >         Juliano
> >      >
> >      >
> >      >
> >      >             ----- Original Message -----
> >      >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
> >      >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >      >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
> >      >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit
> boy
> >      >             lately (randy)
> >      >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your
> mails;
> >      >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
> >     psychedelics are
> >      >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the
> >     point I
> >      >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases
> of
> >      >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
> >     substances have
> >      >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in
> controlled
> >      >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just
> >     like to
> >      >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are
> >     to be
> >      >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
> >      >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
> >     possibly
> >      >             in people that have borderline personality disorders
> or
> >      >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up
> >     with any
> >      >             other description other than mental imbalance and
> >      >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can
> >     use to
> >      >             describe the type of persons where this type of
> >     medication
> >      >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am
> only
> >      >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness
> but
> >      >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
> >      >             especially instances where these conditions were
> >     aggravated
> >      >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as
> I
> >      >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases
> where
> >      >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a
> clinical
> >      >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
> >     understanding of
> >      >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
> >      >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support
> its
> >      >             existence; which is why I think I may be
> misunderstanding
> >      >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
> >      >             forward to your comment.
> >      >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took
> LSD
> >      >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found
> interesting.
> >      >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
> >     figure out
> >      >             what LSD was useful for.
> >      >             ----- Original Message ----
> >      >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
> >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
> >      >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
> >      >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
> >     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >      >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
> >      >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
> >      >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
> >     lately
> >      >             (randy)
> >      >             Hi Randy,
> >      >
> >      >             Sorry to hear about your son.
> >      >
> >      >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say.
> >     UNLESS
> >      >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can
> do--please
> >      >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you
> >     see fit.
> >      >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique
> perspectives!
> >      >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
> >      >
> >      >             regarde
> >      >
> >      >             Juliano
> >      >
> >      >                 ----- Original Message -----
> >      >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
> >     <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
> >      >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:
> ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >      >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
> >      >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
> >     buscit boy
> >      >                 lately (randy)
> >      >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and
> my
> >      >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts
> and I
> >      >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
> >      >                 up".............He He
> >      >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
> >      >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been
> having a
> >      >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too,
> >     too many
> >      >                 to talk about really.
> >      >
> >      >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep
> shit,
> >      >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation
> it
> >      >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
> >     have been
> >      >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put
> in
> >      >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him
> >     out of
> >      >                 everything but the probation violation so he has
> >     to do
> >      >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried
> >     like a
> >      >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so
> >     glad
> >      >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been
> helping
> >      >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but
> I
> >      >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root
> >     of all
> >      >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
> >     better, but
> >      >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in
> >     the cell
> >      >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail
> >     like
> >      >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can
> >     adapt
> >      >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my
> >     boy is
> >      >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part
> ot
> >      >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she
> >     smoked
> >      >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy
> was 8
> >      >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in
> >     line. I
> >      >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not
> >     enough
> >      >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any
> >     kind of
> >      >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a
> >     little
> >      >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after
> >     we got
> >      >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the
> >     ink.
> >      >                 That was my fault.
> >      >
> >      >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the
> >     list but
> >      >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There
> >     were a
> >      >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help
> >     in the
> >      >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people
> that I
> >      >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I
> >     guess I'm
> >      >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean
> I
> >      >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
> >      >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that
> >     way, so I
> >      >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
> >      >
> >      >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
> >     reports and
> >      >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
> >      >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
> >     There are a
> >      >                 few of you that have been here a while now that
> >     haven't
> >      >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
> >     important
> >      >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You
> >     know who
> >      >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
> >      >
> >      >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
> >     list. It
> >      >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list
> >     is for,
> >      >                 not just dry information. We need all the
> >     information we
> >      >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
> >     important.
> >      >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
> >     agree. I
> >      >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
> >     that, but
> >      >                 I'll take the risk.
> >      >
> >      >                          Peace Love and Kindness
> >      >                             Randy
> >      >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
> >      >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
> >      >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
> >     <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
> >      >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm
> sure
> >      >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
> >      >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>
> >     <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
> >     from randy
> >      >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
> >      >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
> >     feel the
> >      >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and
> >     I hoep
> >      >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can
> >     help
> >      >                         if you are having problems....... mujch
> >     love......
> >      >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im
> a
> >      >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg
> by
> >      >                         thry ihg
> >      >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv
> >     (three
> >      >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts
> from
> >      >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or
> >     email,
> >      >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
> >      >                         reproduction. even if the part is
> obsolete.
> >      >
> >      >                         if someone you love is addicted to
> something
> >      >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
> >      >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i
> >     promise....
> >      >
> >      >                             ----- Original Message -----
> >      >                             *From:* Brad Hays
> >      >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
> >      >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
> >      >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> >      >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
> >      >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine
> >     article
> >      >                             barcelona conference
> >      >                             Would love to see all of this Howard,
> and
> >      >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually
> I'd
> >      >                             like to see that article in opposition
> to
> >      >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
> >      >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM,
> Howard
> >      >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
> >     <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
> >      >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
> >      >
> >      >                                 I had forwarded the entire
> >     newsletter of
> >      >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
> >     conference
> >      >                                 that had the promotional article
> >     for the
> >      >                                 ibogaine session to this list but,
> it
> >      >                                 does not appear to have landed.;
> >     I have
> >      >                                 thus hoping that the article
> >     alone that
> >      >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
> >      >                                 edition of the Daily Update
> >     newsletter
> >      >                                 contained an article in opposition
> to
> >      >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt
> that
> >      >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the
> special
> >      >                                 session in which ibogaine
> >     presentations
> >      >                                 took place and in the minds and
> >     hearts
> >      >                                 of drug users and drug policy
> >     activists.
> >      >                                 I will see if I can get all of
> >     the slide
> >      >                                 shows and articles into a
> composite
> >      >                                 report within the next few weeks.
> >      >                                 Howard
> >      >
> >      >                              -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine |
> List
> >      >                             Commands ::::::: (]=-
> >      >                             (][%]  ::
> >      >
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From wleetheriot at ca.rr.com  Sun Jun  1 16:30:37 2008
From: wleetheriot at ca.rr.com (Warren Theriot)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 13:30:37 -0700
Subject: [Ibogaine] barking dog OT sort of
In-Reply-To: <4842F18D.6000601@ca.rr.com>
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>	<008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>
	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com>	<BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<1f5488f0806010802k390dc50bu8d2927a22c6855d0@mail.gmail.com>
	<4842F18D.6000601@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <77663ADC-842B-4005-884D-92F51B7B4822@ca.rr.com>

Sorry to hijack this thread so I'll make a new one. And it isn't  
barking dogs in general that bother me. That changed last year after  
taking Ibogaine. I can't think of the word right now, it escapes me  
the word for inner peace, unflappability. It's right on the tip of my  
tongue but it's being blocked. It is the nature of a guard dog, junk  
yard dog that disturbs me. California made a law in the last couple of  
years that enhances a pet like a dog to the status of "family member".  
IF this one in particular is a so-called family member its like having  
an insane with rage and pain person yelling and screaming at every  
stranger they see living in the front yard across the street. I'll  
respect these people as human beings with their dog but I don't have  
to talk to them when they have an intimidating family member out in  
the front yard challenging every strangers' right to exist on a public  
street in front of the house. When will I shut the fuck up? When the  
dog leaves this neighborhood for good. I'm sorry to say but the  
animal's soul would be at peace if it had been put down like was  
planned before it was adopted into my neighborhood.
Warren

On Jun 1, 2008, at 11:59 AM, Warren Theriot wrote:

> I don't know how to make friends with these people. I can
> walk up to them and smile and say hi and talk about shit but
> I would be having to be there with the vicious acting dog
> right in front of me feeling intimidated. I have't been
> given one break and every other neighbor has to put up with
> this dog too and nobody says a thing. How do you make this
> guy a "friend" unless I had the power of a Mob boss in this
> neigborhood. I just don't trust these people. I don't want
> to express any kind of xenophobia but I think these people
> like making asses out of themselves. I'll say this and it is
> as much as I am going to say for a rant statement:
> Big Dog, Little Dick!
> Warren
>
> Brad Hays wrote:
>> Same advice here Warren.  Flipped through that video and theres no  
>> way I
>> could listen to that.  I would gradually make friends with that guy
>> cause he isn't gonna be too happy when they get taken away.   
>> Sometimes
>> with two dogs only one of em is the barker so maybe he won't lose  
>> both of em
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 9:33 AM, LEE <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com
>> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>>
>>    Warren,
>>    I don't like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog
>>    is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie,
>>    the pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the
>>    dog breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm
>>    and the dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all
>>    citys have a nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of
>>    each offence, even if the cops don't catch the dog, then after you
>>    have enough evidince to give to the animal cruality people, they
>>    will take the dog away, rehabilate it and find it a good
>>    home.........(ive had neighbors who wouldn't take care of their  
>> dog)
>>    just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
>>    junky
>>
>>
>>    specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers),
>>    and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or
>>    email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction.  
>> even
>>    if the part is obsolete.
>>
>>    if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine,  
>> meth,
>>    ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
>>
>>        ----- Original Message -----
>>        *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>
>>        *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>        *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
>>        *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
>>        (randy)
>>
>>        Word.
>>        What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
>>        where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
>>        What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
>>        words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
>>          to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
>>        prescription pain medications and returned home to this
>>        environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
>>        let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
>>        the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
>>        day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
>>        up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
>>        meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
>>        ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
>>        year and three months in this environment.
>>        Peace someday...
>>        Warren
>>
>>
>>        Juliano wrote:
>>> Hi Simon,
>>>
>>> You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that
>>        you said
>>> "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
>>>
>>> Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in
>>        principle
>>> people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished
>>        to, and get
>>> informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
>>> Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some
>>        'mystery
>>> school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
>>>
>>> Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental
>>        health
>>> movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole
>>        ediface is
>>> built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions
>>        really function
>>> as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor
>>        that have
>>> been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
>>        oppressive
>>> system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
>>> psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
>>        cannot even
>>> be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm
>>        that breeds
>>> brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
>>>
>>> A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really
>>        gone away):
>>> IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
>>        would be
>>> dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally
>>        ill' and
>>> forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
>>> Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
>>        'reality',
>>> and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be
>>        not-normal! Now if
>>> the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
>>        even s/he
>>> may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
>>>
>>> So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
>>        'capitalist'
>>> system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
>>        distress about
>>> this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and
>>        abuse, of this
>>> system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which
>>        can include
>>> being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
>>        stigmatized as
>>> an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of
>>        'mental
>>> illness', and all that that means in the community. How
>>        others think and
>>> behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
>>>
>>> Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/,
>>        it is how
>>> to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
>>        Because not
>>> only are people and children being abused by it, but planet
>>        Earth is now
>>> under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of
>>        life!
>>>
>>> regarde
>>>
>>> Juliano
>>>
>>>    ----- Original Message -----
>>>    *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>    *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>    *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
>>>    *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>>        lately (randy)
>>>
>>>    I need to read your entire email and really take it in
>>        because I
>>>    want to say some thing about the fact that you said
>>        "these secrets
>>>    need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look
>>        at the
>>>    state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
>>        people who
>>>    should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
>>        stuck with
>>>    their families all due to excuses like lack of funding
>>        etc. Where I
>>>    am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
>>        semi-working
>>>    condition and the patients that really need it are not
>>        receiving the
>>>    care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
>>        have seen
>>>    dozens of documentaries on the way these people are
>>        treated in whats
>>>    left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
>>        there was a
>>>    change in the approach to the type of care or medication
>>        these
>>>    people got where would they get it? Who would fund it?
>>        Who really
>>>    cares and what percentage of any budget is currently
>>        allocated to
>>>    these people? The only people that would possibly have
>>        access are
>>>    the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a
>>        change
>>>    discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
>>>    conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in
>>        a state of
>>>    decay outside of private health care. In private health
>>        care it is
>>>    just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said
>>        and thats
>>>    to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the
>>        symptoms.
>>>
>>>    ----- Original Message ----
>>>    From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com
>>        <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>
>>>    To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>>        <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>>>    Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
>>>    Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
>>        lately (randy)
>>>
>>>    This is the most powerful of statements,
>>>
>>>        One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>>>        experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>>        likely would
>>>        be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
>>>        support, yes.
>>>
>>>     And that is totally where the medical community gets it
>>        wrong.
>>>    Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a
>>        moment thinking
>>>    how to approach this particular email.  Because, there
>>        are so many
>>>    concurrent discussions going on right now that make this
>>        all very
>>>    whole for me.
>>>    There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
>>        illness.  Now
>>>    saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
>>>    everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only
>>        a catch
>>>    all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior
>>        that
>>>    people some times display.  I say people because on this
>>        list at
>>>    least most have had at least one type of break that is
>>        indescribable
>>>    for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
>>        treatment for
>>>    Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see
>>        in the
>>>    medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10
>>        of Haldol
>>>    and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking
>>        out.  Thats
>>>    the truth.  I see the truth.
>>>
>>        http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm
>>>    So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we
>>        all know
>>>    what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms,
>>        when your
>>>    initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
>>>
>>>    Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a
>>        holistic
>>>    level with out the chemical masking making people fit in
>>        to the
>>>    "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community
>>        refuses to
>>>    look at the whole picture.
>>>
>>>    Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
>>        e-textbook format.
>>>    http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm
>>        <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>>
>>>    <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm>
>>>
>>>     I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
>>>    "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar,
>>        it was just
>>>    manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
>>        even have
>>>    levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep
>>        breaking it down
>>>    and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
>>>    Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
>>        describing and
>>>    it is the way the medical community needs to go in order
>>        to truely
>>>    treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
>>>    Every medical scientific community for the most part
>>        refuses to look
>>>    at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
>>>    The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with
>>        Howard, Simon,
>>>    Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the
>>        custom/religion of
>>>    their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society
>>        proven to
>>>    conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to
>>        people.
>>>    NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution
>>        of things,
>>>    I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when
>>        we treat
>>>    addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect
>>        that has
>>>    worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use
>>        of the
>>>    plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
>>>    community has failed to treat people.
>>>
>>>    Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
>>>    already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism
>>        shit.  I've
>>>    seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly
>>        IMO how much
>>>    time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
>>        sprituality
>>>    that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
>>>
>>>    Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right
>>        now is in a
>>>    huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to
>>        argue
>>>    benign points with likeminded people who are all here for
>>        the better
>>>    good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his
>>        quest to
>>>    figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I
>>        support his
>>>    self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
>>        currently.
>>>    And where I have been currently trying to make a
>>        difference on a
>>>    very 1:1 level.
>>>    My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
>>>    addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.
>>        Yet being
>>>    able to be real with people with out it being
>>        unprofessional.
>>>    Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki,
>>        hypmotism, all
>>>    that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will
>>        let us in.
>>>    Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.
>>        I'm glad
>>>    your helping fight it.
>>>    Mel
>>>
>>>
>>>    On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
>>        <juliano8 at ntlworld.com <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>>>    <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>        Hi Simon,
>>>
>>>        I will try and answer you questions best way I can:
>>        For a start
>>>        there is no actual proof that mental illness is a
>>        biological
>>>        disease. There are no tests.
>>>        Of course there are human behaviours deemed
>>        disturbing and
>>>        unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this
>>        doesn't
>>>        make them diseases.
>>>        rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
>>>        oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of
>>        being 'ill',
>>>        and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
>>        locked up,
>>>        and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means
>>        that the
>>>        /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture,
>>        world, is
>>>        conveniently not being looked at.
>>>
>>>        So I encouage us to look directly at what is going
>>        on, which
>>>        means the whole picture. And to do this means looking
>>        at the
>>>        pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
>>        military
>>>        industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./
>>        Otherwise/, you can
>>>        only be apporaoching this problem in a very
>>        superficial way. No
>>>        matter how arduous it may be to look!
>>>
>>>        We /have/ to look. Not only because people are
>>        suffering under
>>>        this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
>>>        suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it
>>        is ALL
>>>        connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
>>        understand we
>>>        need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the
>>        usual western
>>>        scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated
>>        vision.
>>>
>>>        In my own person experience I was given LSD when I
>>        was very
>>>        young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
>>>        experience, and others to follow brought me back to
>>        Nature. Ie.,
>>>        in that short speace of time from being a small kid
>>        into Nature
>>>        and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the
>>        'big
>>>        city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
>>>
>>>        Now you claim that people have been pushed into
>>        'psychosis' via
>>>        psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
>>        prevailing
>>>        culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category
>>        and is very
>>>        subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong
>>        cannabis
>>>        called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'.
>>        And I am
>>>        sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
>>>        usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
>>>
>>>        So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'?
>>        Wel...yes, --not
>>>        using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is
>>        not physical
>>>        disease but a process!
>>>
>>>        Of?
>>>
>>>        To understand we have to again understand the vast
>>        enormous
>>>        pressure we are under. For some, things become so
>>        pressurized
>>>        that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a
>>        healing
>>>        energy that takes over. And the person may experience
>>        mythical
>>>        visions etc etc.
>>>        What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress
>>        these
>>>        visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
>>        nervous-system
>>>        damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As
>>        long as
>>>        they can suppress it is all they want. Because to
>>        deal with this
>>>        challenges their worldviews.
>>>
>>>        One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
>>>        experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most
>>        likey would be
>>>        superfluous. But to be there with them offering
>>        loving support, yes.
>>>
>>>        THE most important thing to consider with
>>        psychedelics is Set &
>>>        Setting. And this includes loving open helpful
>>        advice. Not a
>>>        culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed
>>        not 'normal'
>>>        as psychotic.
>>>
>>>        it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member
>>        of this
>>>        forum I am with that is about psychedelics has
>>        recently shared
>>>        his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
>>        Germany. For
>>>        simply saying things they are not familiar with they
>>        diagnosed
>>>        him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this
>>        discussion continues
>>>        I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
>>>
>>>        See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
>>        society's
>>>        of past, etc. many people can if they desire
>>        cultivate their own
>>>        psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing
>>        is to
>>>        encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
>>        intelligent
>>>        and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
>>>
>>>        This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
>>        respect for
>>>        the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
>>>
>>>        regarde
>>>
>>>        Juliano
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>            ----- Original Message -----
>>>            *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>            *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>            *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
>>>            *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>>        buscit boy
>>>            lately (randy)
>>>            I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your
>>        mails;
>>>            they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
>>        psychedelics are
>>>            the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed
>>        the point I
>>>            apologize but I have to bring up the number of
>>        cases of
>>>            psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
>>        substances have
>>>            caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in
>>        controlled
>>>            circumstances or approached medically. I would
>>        just like to
>>>            get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics
>>        are to be
>>>            used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
>>>            possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
>>        possibly
>>>            in people that have borderline personality
>>        disorders or
>>>            mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come
>>        up with any
>>>            other description other than mental imbalance and
>>>            personality disorder but is the only two terms I
>>        can use to
>>>            describe the type of persons where this type of
>>        medication
>>>            would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I
>>        am only
>>>            going with my limited understanding of mental
>>        illness but
>>>            have witnessed these types of problems in people and
>>>            especially instances where these conditions were
>>        aggravated
>>>            or worsened by taking mind altering substances.
>>        But as I
>>>            said earlier this was not anything to do with
>>        cases where
>>>            the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a
>>        clinical
>>>            environment. I am just trying to get to an
>>        understanding of
>>>            what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
>>>            illness and think there is enough evidence to
>>        support its
>>>            existence; which is why I think I may be
>>        misunderstanding
>>>            some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I
>>        look
>>>            forward to your comment.
>>>            I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant
>>        took LSD
>>>            about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found
>>        interesting.
>>>            This was at the stage where they were trying to
>>        figure out
>>>            what LSD was useful for.
>>>            ----- Original Message ----
>>>            From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com
>>        <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
>>>            <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
>>>            To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com
>>        <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>            <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
>>>            Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
>>>            Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit
>>        boy lately
>>>            (randy)
>>>            Hi Randy,
>>>
>>>            Sorry to hear about your son.
>>>
>>>            Just to say though/never worry about what people
>>        say. UNLESS
>>>            they throw you off--which thers nothin you can
>>        do--please
>>>            dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as
>>        you see fit.
>>>            we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique
>>        perspectives!
>>>            And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
>>>
>>>            regarde
>>>
>>>            Juliano
>>>
>>>                ----- Original Message -----
>>>                *From:* Randy Faulconer
>>        <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>
>>>                *To:* The Ibogaine List
>>        <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>                *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
>>>                *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
>>        buscit boy
>>>                lately (randy)
>>>                         Hey yall, I had a note all written
>>        up and my
>>>                Momma did something and it went to saved
>>        drafts and I
>>>                couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
>>>                up".............He He
>>>                       Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard
>>        time
>>>                lately, my son got put in jail and I've been
>>        having a
>>>                lot of problems with my back. Other thing
>>        too, too many
>>>                to talk about really.
>>>
>>>                         My son got himself in some pretty
>>        deep shit,
>>>                all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on
>>        probation it
>>>                would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
>>        have been
>>>                all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get
>>        put in
>>>                jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got
>>        him out of
>>>                everything but the probation violation so he
>>        has to do
>>>                32 more days. When I got his first letter I
>>        cried like a
>>>                baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit.
>>        I'm so glad
>>>                that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been
>>        helping
>>>                each other out here lately. God I love her
>>        so, but I
>>>                digress. I felt like his upbringing was the
>>        root of all
>>>                of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
>>        better, but
>>>                he was so descriptive that I was right there
>>        in the cell
>>>                with him and it killed be to think of him in
>>        jail like
>>>                that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he
>>        can adapt
>>>                to just about anything but
>>        still.........fuck, my boy is
>>>                in jail. The way he was brought up was a big
>>        part ot
>>>                this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell
>>        she smoked
>>>                with him when he was 12. We divorced when
>>        Randy was 8
>>>                years old so I couldn't be there to keep him
>>        in line. I
>>>                saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just
>>        not enough
>>>                to make any difference really. Not that I'm
>>        any kind of
>>>                saint or anything but I think I might have
>>        made a little
>>>                difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right
>>        after we got
>>>                divorced, hell the papers were still wet from
>>        the ink.
>>>                That was my fault.
>>>
>>>                      I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on
>>        the list but
>>>                I felt like I was gonna bust or something.
>>        There were a
>>>                couple of people slam me for not trying to
>>        help in the
>>>                right way here on the list, a couple of
>>        people that I
>>>                really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad.
>>        I guess I'm
>>>                just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I
>>        mean I
>>>                didn't think there was a wrong way to do the
>>        right
>>>                thing, but I guess some people don't feel
>>        that way, so I
>>>                kept my thoughts to myself and just read the
>>        list.
>>>
>>>                     I'm still working on getting treatment
>>        reports and
>>>                accounts together so yall that haven't sent
>>>                one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
>>        There are a
>>>                few of you that have been here a while now
>>        that haven't
>>>                sent an account, and I think that you all are
>>        important
>>>                to the movement, we need to hear from you.
>>        You know who
>>>                you are. Some of the old timers too.
>>>
>>>                      I'll try and write a little more to the
>>        list. It
>>>                makes me feel better and that is what this
>>        list is for,
>>>                not just dry information. We need all the
>>        information we
>>>                can get but dealing with feelings is just as
>>        important.
>>>                My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
>>        agree. I
>>>                hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
>>        that, but
>>>                I'll take the risk.
>>>
>>>                         Peace Love and Kindness
>>>                            Randy
>>>                         BiscuitBoy Blues
>>>                On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
>>>                <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com
>>        <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>>>                <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                    Randy will come back to us when he can,
>>        I'm sure
>>>                    On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
>>>                    <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com
>>        <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                        I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
>>        from randy
>>>                        for a while... I miss your witty repartae
>>>                        randy...... email back so that I chan
>>        feel the
>>>                        love...... I was thinking about you,
>>        and I hoep
>>>                        you are doing good.... let me know if
>>        can help
>>>                        if you are having problems.......
>>        mujch love......
>>>                        junkster..... the junkboy..... it
>>        seems im a
>>>                        junkboy.... damn... the cops keep
>>        drivijg by
>>>                        thry ihg
>>>                        specializing in vintage motorcycle,
>>        atv (three
>>>                        and four wheelers), and snowmobile
>>        parts from
>>>                        1959-1989. if you need anything call
>>        or email,
>>>                        we can get any part you need.
>>        new,used, or
>>>                        reproduction. even if the part is
>>        obsolete.
>>>
>>>                        if someone you love is addicted to
>>        something
>>>                        (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
>>>                        ibogaine.... its worth your time.....
>>        i promise....
>>>
>>>                            ----- Original Message -----
>>>                            *From:* Brad Hays
>>>                            <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
>>>                            *To:* The Ibogaine List
>>>                            <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>>                            *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
>>>                            *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine]
>>        ibogaine article
>>>                            barcelona conference
>>>                            Would love to see all of this
>>        Howard, and
>>>                            thanks for your work on it.
>>        Actually I'd
>>>                            like to see that article in
>>        opposition to
>>>                            ibogaine too if it's around.
>>>                            On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM,
>>        Howard
>>>                            Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com
>>        <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
>>>                            <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                                I had forwarded the entire
>>        newsletter of
>>>                                May 11/12 from the Barcelona
>>        conference
>>>                                that had the promotional
>>        article for the
>>>                                ibogaine session to this list
>>        but, it
>>>                                does not appear to have
>>        landed.;  I have
>>>                                thus hoping that the article
>>        alone that
>>>                                is much smaller will work. A
>>        later
>>>                                edition of the Daily Update
>>        newsletter
>>>                                contained an article in
>>        opposition to
>>>                                ibogaine but, there is no
>>        doubt that
>>>                                ibogaine prevailed during the
>>        special
>>>                                session in which ibogaine
>>        presentations
>>>                                took place and in the minds
>>        and hearts
>>>                                of drug users and drug policy
>>        activists.
>>>                                I will see if I can get all
>>        of the slide
>>>                                shows and articles into a
>>        composite
>>>                                report within the next few weeks.
>>>                                Howard
>>>
>>>                             -=[) ::::::: MindVox | Ibogaine
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From JUNKBOY64 at MSN.COM  Sun Jun  1 16:25:46 2008
From: JUNKBOY64 at MSN.COM (LEE)
Date: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 14:25:46 -0600
Subject: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
References: <265891.89008.qm@web28602.mail.ukl.yahoo.com><008f01c8c3dd$e651d310$a55c1752@DHVZBJ2J>	<48429BF0.2080104@ca.rr.com><BAY103-DAV2C79475B3141C7DFC3221A9B80@phx.gbl>
	<4842EE61.8030903@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <BAY103-DAV23031E45E598C1200F738A9B80@phx.gbl>

iboageine the dogs.... maybe that will open their brains up to understanding that they are driving you crazy... lol
or give them a shot....... when they nod off. take them up to the top of the hill and squeese them through the gated communities...... preoblem solved.... I gaurentee that they will be taken care of.......
just my ididot opininon......
junky


specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.

if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Warren Theriot<mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com> 
  To: The Ibogaine List<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com> 
  Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2008 12:45 PM
  Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)


  Lee, Its not that the dog runs free in the street, it is my 
  opinion the this neighborhood is the Los Angeles' DUMPING 
  GROUND for "abused" animals that get "rescued" by neighbors 
  with maybe good intentions, but they cannot control the 
  animals after the adoptions and the results you see on my 
  videos on You Tube. Call the pound. LOL ROTFL Split A GUT 
  etc, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, The City Of Los Angeles responding 
  to a non 911 call. Especially the Dept of Animal Regulation 
  or whatever they call it exactly these days. Can Ibogaine 
  help? Has it helped? So far I haven't totally exploded. I 
  hope I don't have a stroke or a heart atttack I have become 
  so livid about the dogs in my neighborhood like this.
  When I went to Mexico to do Ibogaine last year, the first 
  thing I noticed was all the dogs and I knew I was going to 
  have to work this out among other things with Ibogaine. 
  Halfway through the night with Ibogaine purging and 
  cleansing my braincells, I was starting to laugh at the dogs 
  barking outside randomly. It was a way different ambience in 
  Mexico. The dogs ran free and barked at each other, cats, 
  chickens, anything they wanted and if a dog was barking for 
  too long someone would start yelling and it would shut up. 
  When I got back home in 2 weeks after taking Ibogaine, I was 
  feeling serene and the dog didn't bother me too much. The 
  noises that used to bother me were miraculously not. I never 
  felt so calm and unlikely to react to what had previously 
  made me livid.
  The other night at 11:45PM the dog started barking at 
  someone and by midnight I started having a panic attack out 
  of nowhere. I knew what was going on but it was still very 
  unpleasant. I took my blood pressure and it was 158/96 pulse 
  127. I figured that waa OK if I had been doing some exercise 
  but I had been sitting still working on my videos. I called 
  a friend and talked for a couple of hours. By 2:15 AM my 
  readings were 118/78  pulse 79 and I felt calm. But I have 
  lost hours and hours of sleep from the anxiety of 
  anticipating another round of the noise I have to put up 
  with. I got to sleep by 5:45 AM this morning and slept until 
  10:30 AM. It was quiet this morning. But the dog sits out it 
  is yard just waiting to challenge the first stranger it sees 
  within 200 feet walking down the street or walking to or 
  from their car.
  I did some research, and found I can sue the neighbor for 
  $5000 in small claims court. Thats going to happen if the 
  city doesn't make this STOP 100% within 3 weeks. I have 
  given the guy over a year to comply with the law and it 
  hasn't happened and because of this situation I felt it was 
  necessary to spend another $4000 or so to get another 
  Ibogaine treatment in November to calm my nerves and help me 
  gain some more strength to cope. Less than a week after 
  returning home I became very ill with viral meningitus and I 
    was miserable. Now the barking starts again this very 
  moment. I'll come out of this victorious that I am sure of. 
  Cops won't respond to anything less than a 911 call around 
  here, and then you have to wait to see if they will show up. 
  They tend to blame the person making the complaint also in 
  this place.
  Peace, someday...
  Warren

  LEE wrote:
  > Warren,
  > I don?t like to say this, but call the pound everytime the dog 
  > is loose... it costs money to get your dog out of doggie jail (ie, the 
  > pound)... if the dog is always barking.. call the cops for the dog 
  > breaking the noise ordinance, call them especially after 10pm and the 
  > dog starts barking after the cops leave, call again... all citys have a 
  > nioise ordinance. needless to say keep a journal of each offence, even 
  > if the cops don?t catch the dog, then after you have enough evidince to 
  > give to the animal cruality people, they will take the dog away, 
  > rehabilate it and find it a good home.........(ive had neighbors who 
  > wouldn?t take care of their dog)
  > just my opinion......... people like to keep their money.....
  > junky
  >  
  >  
  > specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv (three and four wheelers), and 
  > snowmobile parts from 1959-1989. if you need anything call or email, we 
  > can get any part you need. new,used, or reproduction. even if the part 
  > is obsolete.
  >  
  > if someone you love is addicted to something (heroin, cocaine, meth, 
  > ect), google ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i promise....
  > 
  >     ----- Original Message -----
  >     *From:* Warren Theriot <mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com<mailto:wleetheriot at ca.rr.com>>
  >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 6:54 AM
  >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately (randy)
  > 
  >     Word.
  >     What about abused animals that are "unleashed" into the city
  >     where their sickness spreads to affect the entire community?
  >     What am I talking about? See my videos on You Tube, key
  >     words Barking Dog Tujunga Beckett. Last year I took Ibogaine
  >       to get free from the anger I felt and the damned
  >     prescription pain medications and returned home to this
  >     environment where I survive by denying anger so as to not
  >     let it get the best of me. No influence from drugs causing
  >     the anger this time. It's the scene outside my front door
  >     day and night that makes this world seem very cruel. I put
  >     up with this after Thankgiving trying not to die from viral
  >     meningitus, too sick to hardly move to put a pillow over my
  >     ears over the spectacle across the street. Now its been a
  >     year and three months in this environment.
  >     Peace someday...
  >     Warren
  > 
  > 
  >     Juliano wrote:
  >      > Hi Simon,
  >      > 
  >      > You said: /"// I want to say some thing about the fact that you said
  >      > "these secrets need to be told" which I will get to;"/
  >      > 
  >      > Actually I said that the secret is/ already/ out. That in principle
  >      > people could cultivate their own psychedelics if they wished to,
  >     and get
  >      > informtaion as to how to have a Tryp.
  >      > Ie., there is no need to be  relying on being part of some 'mystery
  >      > school', or going to a shaman, or medicine man.
  >      > 
  >      > Regarding the rest of your post. Yes the so-called 'mental health
  >      > movement' it is all a shambles. This is because the whole ediface is
  >      > built on a myth of mental illness. The very institutions really
  >     function
  >      > as *social control*. And usually it has always been the poor that
  >     have
  >      > been the main victims. So for example we have a VERY brutal
  >     oppressive
  >      > system that is not just harsh physically for many, but also
  >      > psychologically. But that ,especially, the latter brutality
  >     cannot even
  >      > be /acknowledged /by the victims of it, because the paradigm that
  >     breeds
  >      > brutality is being said to be the/ reality/
  >      > 
  >      > A good example is Soviet Russia (and this has never really gone
  >     away):
  >      > IF an individual did not accept the 'communist' ideology they
  >     would be
  >      > dragged before the psychiatrists and deemed to be 'mentally ill' and
  >      > forcibly incarcerated and  drugged against their will.
  >      >  Because the paradigm, '/communism/' was believed to be the
  >     'reality',
  >      > and to question it in whatever way was deemed to be not-normal!
  >     Now if
  >      > the person accused doesn't know anything BUT that system then
  >     even s/he
  >      > may feel they are 'not-normal', right?
  >      > 
  >      > So compare that terrible scenario with ours. We have the
  >     'capitalist'
  >      > system which includes consumerism, and so on. IF you show
  >     distress about
  >      > this, and any rebelliousness against the injustices, and abuse,
  >     of this
  >      > system you too can be classed as being 'mentally ill', which can
  >     include
  >      > being incarcerated and drugged against one's will, and/or
  >     stigmatized as
  >      > an 'out patient' who needs to be 'on medication' because of 'mental
  >      > illness', and all that that means in the community. How others
  >     think and
  >      > behave with you, and how you think about yourself.
  >      > 
  >      > Really the question is not who is going to fund this /myth/, it
  >     is how
  >      > to /EXPOSE/ this myth. Show the /roots /of this evil myth.
  >     Because not
  >      > only are people and children being abused by it, but planet Earth
  >     is now
  >      > under attack by mindsets totally disconnected from the web of life!
  >      > 
  >      > regarde
  >      > 
  >      > Juliano
  >      >
  >      >     ----- Original Message -----
  >      >     *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>>
  >      >     *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >      >     *Sent:* Sunday, June 01, 2008 3:33 AM
  >      >     *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
  >     lately (randy)
  >      >
  >      >     I need to read your entire email and really take it in because I
  >      >     want to say some thing about the fact that you said "these
  >     secrets
  >      >     need to be told" which I will get to; but first lets look at the
  >      >     state of psychiatric care around the world. Most of the
  >     people who
  >      >     should be receiving in-patient care are on the streets or
  >     stuck with
  >      >     their families all due to excuses like lack of funding etc.
  >     Where I
  >      >     am about 25% of the main psychiatric hospital is in a
  >     semi-working
  >      >     condition and the patients that really need it are not
  >     receiving the
  >      >     care that they need. The same happened or is in the UK. I
  >     have seen
  >      >     dozens of documentaries on the way these people are treated
  >     in whats
  >      >     left of the facilities as well as first hand. So even if
  >     there was a
  >      >     change in the approach to the type of care or medication these
  >      >     people got where would they get it? Who would fund it? Who really
  >      >     cares and what percentage of any budget is currently allocated to
  >      >     these people? The only people that would possibly have access are
  >      >     the ones who have families to foot the bill. Its quite a change
  >      >     discussing psychiatric issues and it opens a lot of doors for
  >      >     conversation but I honestly see it as something that's in a
  >     state of
  >      >     decay outside of private health care. In private health care
  >     it is
  >      >     just as I got the impression of what is trying to be said and
  >     thats
  >      >     to prescribe the nearest thing at hand to deal with the symptoms.
  >      >
  >      >     ----- Original Message ----
  >      >     From: Melanie Gutierrez <gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com<mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>
  >     <mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com<mailto:gutierrezmelanie at gmail.com>>>
  >      >     To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
  >     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>>
  >      >     Sent: Sunday, 1 June, 2008 3:55:36 AM
  >      >     Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy lately
  >     (randy)
  >      >
  >      >     This is the most powerful of statements, 
  >      >
  >      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
  >      >         experiencing powerful visionary experiences. Most likely
  >     would
  >      >         be superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
  >      >         support, yes.
  >      >
  >      >      And that is totally where the medical community gets it wrong.
  >      >     Where most people get it wrong.  I've spent quite a moment
  >     thinking
  >      >     how to approach this particular email.  Because, there are so
  >     many
  >      >     concurrent discussions going on right now that make this all very
  >      >     whole for me.
  >      >     There is a science behind, and tests for psychiatric
  >     illness.  Now
  >      >     saying that, putting your example of Psychosis aside, because
  >      >     everything you said about psychosis is correct.  Its only a catch
  >      >     all term for the weird and bizarre unexplainable behavior that
  >      >     people some times display.  I say people because on this list at
  >      >     least most have had at least one type of break that is
  >     indescribable
  >      >     for them for what ever reason.  And the main line of
  >     treatment for
  >      >     Psychotic episodes is Anti- and benzo's, thats what I see in the
  >      >     medical community.  Just knock um out till its over.  10 of
  >     Haldol
  >      >     and  2 of Ativan standard ER care for someone freaking out. 
  >     Thats
  >      >     the truth.  I see the truth.
  >      >    
  >     http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm<http://www.icd9data.com/2008/Volume1/290-319/290-294/291/291.3.htm>
  >      >     So there is alcohol physchosis.   Of course there is, we all know
  >      >     what alcohol does to the body in not moderated forms, when your
  >      >     initialy on, then when you initially stop a chronic useage.
  >      >     
  >      >     Other psychatric D/O are very testable, treatable on a holistic
  >      >     level with out the chemical masking making people fit in to the
  >      >     "norm" of what "should be".  But the medical community refuses to
  >      >     look at the whole picture.
  >      >     
  >      >     Good little link on Biological psychiatry in a mini
  >     e-textbook format.
  >      >     http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>
  >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>>
  >      >     <http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/%7Ezfisar/bpen/default.htm<http://www1.lf1.cuni.cz/~zfisar/bpen/default.htm>>
  >      >     
  >      >      I picked the page on Affective disorders, because that is my
  >      >     "label" that was given to me oh so long ago.  Bi-Polar, it
  >     was just
  >      >     manic depression when I was labeled with it, but now they
  >     even have
  >      >     levels on that.  Bi-Polar I and II.  Brillant, keep breaking
  >     it down
  >      >     and not treating the person still.  Anyhow, there I rant.
  >      >     Holistic Medicine is what you (Juliano) basically are
  >     describing and
  >      >     it is the way the medical community needs to go in order to
  >     truely
  >      >     treat people.  Which brings me to Body, Mind and Soul/Spirit
  >      >     Every medical scientific community for the most part refuses
  >     to look
  >      >     at Spirit and how that fits into the works.
  >      >     The concurrent discussion of Ibogaine going on with Howard,
  >     Simon,
  >      >     Sara and others.  Bwiti want to preserve the custom/religion of
  >      >     their practice.  Of Course they do, has western society proven to
  >      >     conserve and validate those practices that are Sacred to people.
  >      >     NEVER have we.  Point taken there.  Now in the evolution of
  >     things,
  >      >     I feel Howards point of, They NEED to, because even when we treat
  >      >     addiction with Ibogaine with out the spiritual aspect that has
  >      >     worked for the Bwiti, we are still failing the sacred use of the
  >      >     plant, and just using it as a drug.  Much the way the medical
  >      >     community has failed to treat people.
  >      >     
  >      >     Well I just proofed and this has went on longer than I wanted
  >      >     already.  But I must mention one more time, Newagism shit.  I've
  >      >     seen it called, new newagism even.  Ridiculous honestly IMO
  >     how much
  >      >     time we spend labeling.  Its a form of scientific based
  >     sprituality
  >      >     that works for me,  I choose to call it Mine.
  >      >     
  >      >     Sharing common threads with people like Matt who right now is
  >     in a
  >      >     huge struggle and is winning is what I'm here for, Not to argue
  >      >     benign points with likeminded people who are all here for the
  >     better
  >      >     good of humanity.  Watching the evolution of Matt in his quest to
  >      >     figure this out for himSELF is a beautiful thing,  I support his
  >      >     self on a very personal level.  Thats what I'm here for
  >     currently.
  >      >     And where I have been currently trying to make a difference on a
  >      >     very 1:1 level.
  >      >     My dream job, working in the holistic energy center treating
  >      >     addiction/beh health issues that are real for people.  Yet being
  >      >     able to be real with people with out it being unprofessional.
  >      >     Practicing modalities from all the cultures, reki, hypmotism, all
  >      >     that newagish shit. :)  Maybe even the Bwiti if they will let
  >     us in.
  >      >     Keep on Keepin on, Juliano.  The global fight continues.  I'm
  >     glad
  >      >     your helping fight it.
  >      >     Mel
  >      >     
  >      >     
  >      >     On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Juliano
  >     <juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com> <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
  >      >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>> wrote:
  >      >
  >      >         Hi Simon,
  >      >         
  >      >         I will try and answer you questions best way I can: For a
  >     start
  >      >         there is no actual proof that mental illness is a biological
  >      >         disease. There are no tests.
  >      >         Of course there are human behaviours deemed disturbing and
  >      >         unacceptable by the prevailing authorities, but this doesn't
  >      >         make them diseases.
  >      >         rather, what is going on is a very serious game which is
  >      >         oppressing people. Ie., when people are accused of being
  >     'ill',
  >      >         and then drugged, and/or electrocuted with ECT, and
  >     locked up,
  >      >         and tied up, and all the abuse of that, this means that the
  >      >         /bigger/ picture--the community, society, culture, world, is
  >      >         conveniently not being looked at.
  >      >         
  >      >         So I encouage us to look directly at what is going on, which
  >      >         means the whole picture. And to do this means looking at the
  >      >         pharmaceutical industry and its relationship with the
  >     military
  >      >         industrial complex!....the whole schbangle./ Otherwise/,
  >     you can
  >      >         only be apporaoching this problem in a very superficial
  >     way. No
  >      >         matter how arduous it may be to look!
  >      >         
  >      >         We /have/ to look. Not only because people are suffering
  >     under
  >      >         this oppression, but the very planet and its species are
  >      >         suffering under the onslaught of this oppression. it is ALL
  >      >         connected to this problem we are discussing. So to
  >     understand we
  >      >         need NOT compartmentalized thinking, which is the usual
  >     western
  >      >         scientific model, but a more Indigenous integrated vision.
  >      >         
  >      >         In my own person experience I was given LSD when I was very
  >      >         young, 15. I had no idea what the tiny pill was. But the
  >      >         experience, and others to follow brought me back to
  >     Nature. Ie.,
  >      >         in that short speace of time from being a small kid into
  >     Nature
  >      >         and faeryland to a school-hardened young lad into the 'big
  >      >         city', LSD dissolved all of that conditioning.
  >      >         
  >      >         Now you claim that people have been pushed into
  >     'psychosis' via
  >      >         psychedelics? This is very complex because what this
  >     prevailing
  >      >         culture classes 'psychosis' is not an exact category and
  >     is very
  >      >         subjective. In the UK kids who smoke a very strong cannabis
  >      >         called Skunk had been daignosed as being 'psychotic'. And
  >     I am
  >      >         sure many people who drink alcohol can seem the same, but
  >      >         usually we dont hear it about drinkers.
  >      >         
  >      >         So, is there such a condition as 'psychosis'? Wel...yes,
  >     --not
  >      >         using that psychiatric term if possible--but it is not
  >     physical
  >      >         disease but a process!
  >      >         
  >      >         Of?
  >      >         
  >      >         To understand we have to again understand the vast enormous
  >      >         pressure we are under. For some, things become so pressurized
  >      >         that the 'ego''s boudaries--if you like--give up to a healing
  >      >         energy that takes over. And the person may experience
  >     mythical
  >      >         visions etc etc.
  >      >         What the shrinks usually want to do then is suppress these
  >      >         visions. Drug them away. And the person is given
  >     nervous-system
  >      >         damaging 'medication'. But THAT is not mentioned!! As long as
  >      >         they can suppress it is all they want. Because to deal
  >     with this
  >      >         challenges their worldviews.
  >      >         
  >      >         One doesn't need to give psychedelics to people who are
  >      >         experincing powerful visionary experiences. Most likey
  >     would be
  >      >         superfluous. But to be there with them offering loving
  >     support, yes.
  >      >         
  >      >         THE most important thing to consider with psychedelics is
  >     Set &
  >      >         Setting. And this includes loving open helpful advice. Not a
  >      >         culture that classes all forms of behaviour deemed not
  >     'normal'
  >      >         as psychotic.
  >      >         
  >      >         it is somewhat of a coincidence that another member of this
  >      >         forum I am with that is about psychedelics has recently
  >     shared
  >      >         his terrible experience from the pharma-shrinks in
  >     Germany. For
  >      >         simply saying things they are not familiar with they
  >     diagnosed
  >      >         him 'psychotic' and locked him up!! If this discussion
  >     continues
  >      >         I will ask his permission to copy his posts here..
  >      >         
  >      >         See thing is Simon. the SECRET IS OUT! Unlike secret
  >     society's
  >      >         of past, etc. many people can if they desire cultivate
  >     their own
  >      >         psychedelics etc. So surely the most intelligen thing is to
  >      >         encourage and try and explore the most resepctul and
  >     intelligent
  >      >         and benevolent ways to exeperience with psychedelics.
  >      >         
  >      >         This must, in my opinion go hand in hand with UTMOST
  >     respect for
  >      >         the Land, and animals, all other species, and community.
  >      >         
  >      >         regarde
  >      >         
  >      >         Juliano
  >      >         
  >      >         
  >      >
  >      >             ----- Original Message -----
  >      >             *From:* simon loxton <mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk<mailto:simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk>>
  >      >             *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >      >             *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 11:01 PM
  >      >             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
  >      >             lately (randy)
  >      >             I just wanted to comment Juliano; on some of your mails;
  >      >             they seem to me to carry the sentiment that
  >     psychedelics are
  >      >             the answer to mental disorders. If I have missed the
  >     point I
  >      >             apologize but I have to bring up the number of cases of
  >      >             psychosis that psychedelics or psychotropic
  >     substances have
  >      >             caused. I cant comment on cases occurring in controlled
  >      >             circumstances or approached medically. I would just
  >     like to
  >      >             get your comment  on how you propose psychedelics are
  >     to be
  >      >             used in this respect. I only mention this as I see a
  >      >             possible danger from the drugs creating psychosis
  >     possibly
  >      >             in people that have borderline personality disorders or
  >      >             mental imbalances.  I apologize That I can come up
  >     with any
  >      >             other description other than mental imbalance and
  >      >             personality disorder but is the only two terms I can
  >     use to
  >      >             describe the type of persons where this type of
  >     medication
  >      >             would be contra indicated in my opinion, again I am only
  >      >             going with my limited understanding of mental illness but
  >      >             have witnessed these types of problems in people and
  >      >             especially instances where these conditions were
  >     aggravated
  >      >             or worsened by taking mind altering substances. But as I
  >      >             said earlier this was not anything to do with cases where
  >      >             the drugs were administered by a doctor or in a clinical
  >      >             environment. I am just trying to get to an
  >     understanding of
  >      >             what it is you are advocating. I do believe in mental
  >      >             illness and think there is enough evidence to support its
  >      >             existence; which is why I think I may be misunderstanding
  >      >             some of the sentiments you are bringing across. I look
  >      >             forward to your comment.
  >      >             I just saw a documentary that noted Carey Grant took LSD
  >      >             about 80 timed for alcoholism which I found interesting.
  >      >             This was at the stage where they were trying to
  >     figure out
  >      >             what LSD was useful for.
  >      >             ----- Original Message ----
  >      >             From: Juliano <juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>
  >     <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>
  >      >             <mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com<mailto:juliano8 at ntlworld.com>>>
  >      >             To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>
  >     <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >      >             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>>
  >      >             Sent: Saturday, 31 May, 2008 10:07:11 AM
  >      >             Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from buscit boy
  >     lately
  >      >             (randy)
  >      >             Hi Randy,
  >      >             
  >      >             Sorry to hear about your son.
  >      >             
  >      >             Just to say though/never worry about what people say.
  >     UNLESS
  >      >             they throw you off--which thers nothin you can do--please
  >      >             dont let anyone intimidate you from speaking as you
  >     see fit.
  >      >             we ALL got seomthing to say from our unique perspectives!
  >      >             And I would LOVE to hear what you say ;)
  >      >             
  >      >             regarde
  >      >             
  >      >             Juliano
  >      >
  >      >                 ----- Original Message -----
  >      >                 *From:* Randy Faulconer
  >     <mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com<mailto:bicuitboy714 at gmail.com>>
  >      >                 *To:* The Ibogaine List <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >      >                 *Sent:* Saturday, May 31, 2008 4:09 AM
  >      >                 *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ianyone heard from
  >     buscit boy
  >      >                 lately (randy)
  >      >                          Hey yall, I had a note all written up and my
  >      >                 Momma did something and it went to saved drafts and I
  >      >                 couldn't get it back up. Uhhhhhh he said "get it
  >      >                 up".............He He
  >      >                        Anyway, I've been having a pretty hard time
  >      >                 lately, my son got put in jail and I've been having a
  >      >                 lot of problems with my back. Other thing too,
  >     too many
  >      >                 to talk about really.
  >      >                 
  >      >                          My son got himself in some pretty deep shit,
  >      >                 all because of alcohol. If he wasn't on probation it
  >      >                 would have been opiates, but then he wouldn't
  >     have been
  >      >                 all stupid and loud and idiotic enough to get put in
  >      >                 jail but that's just supposing. Gatewood got him
  >     out of
  >      >                 everything but the probation violation so he has
  >     to do
  >      >                 32 more days. When I got his first letter I cried
  >     like a
  >      >                 baby, I mean sobbing and whaling and shit. I'm so
  >     glad
  >      >                 that my Momma was here to lean on. We've been helping
  >      >                 each other out here lately. God I love her so, but I
  >      >                 digress. I felt like his upbringing was the root
  >     of all
  >      >                 of this shit and I damn near lost it. I know
  >     better, but
  >      >                 he was so descriptive that I was right there in
  >     the cell
  >      >                 with him and it killed be to think of him in jail
  >     like
  >      >                 that. He'll do fine, he's a lot like me so he can
  >     adapt
  >      >                 to just about anything but still.........fuck, my
  >     boy is
  >      >                 in jail. The way he was brought up was a big part ot
  >      >                 this. His mother didn't make him mind, hell she
  >     smoked
  >      >                 with him when he was 12. We divorced when Randy was 8
  >      >                 years old so I couldn't be there to keep him in
  >     line. I
  >      >                 saw him on Christmas and shit but that's just not
  >     enough
  >      >                 to make any difference really. Not that I'm any
  >     kind of
  >      >                 saint or anything but I think I might have made a
  >     little
  >      >                 difference anyway. I moved to Erie Pa right after
  >     we got
  >      >                 divorced, hell the papers were still wet from the
  >     ink.
  >      >                 That was my fault.
  >      >                 
  >      >                       I wasn't gonna lay all of this out on the
  >     list but
  >      >                 I felt like I was gonna bust or something. There
  >     were a
  >      >                 couple of people slam me for not trying to help
  >     in the
  >      >                 right way here on the list, a couple of people that I
  >      >                 really respect, and it hurt my feelings bad. I
  >     guess I'm
  >      >                 just too sensitive for my own feakin' good. I mean I
  >      >                 didn't think there was a wrong way to do the right
  >      >                 thing, but I guess some people don't feel that
  >     way, so I
  >      >                 kept my thoughts to myself and just read the list.
  >      >                 
  >      >                      I'm still working on getting treatment
  >     reports and
  >      >                 accounts together so yall that haven't sent
  >      >                 one................PLEASE help a brutha out.
  >     There are a
  >      >                 few of you that have been here a while now that
  >     haven't
  >      >                 sent an account, and I think that you all are
  >     important
  >      >                 to the movement, we need to hear from you. You
  >     know who
  >      >                 you are. Some of the old timers too.
  >      >                 
  >      >                       I'll try and write a little more to the
  >     list. It
  >      >                 makes me feel better and that is what this list
  >     is for,
  >      >                 not just dry information. We need all the
  >     information we
  >      >                 can get but dealing with feelings is just as
  >     important.
  >      >                 My opinion anyway. I think that Patrick would
  >     agree. I
  >      >                 hope he doesn't mind me speaking for him like
  >     that, but
  >      >                 I'll take the risk.
  >      >                 
  >      >                          Peace Love and Kindness
  >      >                             Randy
  >      >                          BiscuitBoy Blues
  >      >                 On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Brad Hays
  >      >                 <bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>
  >     <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>
  >      >                 <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>> wrote:
  >      >
  >      >                     Randy will come back to us when he can, I'm sure
  >      >                     On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 6:03 AM, LEE
  >      >                     <JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com> <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>>
  >     <mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com<mailto:JUNKBOY64 at msn.com>>> wrote:
  >      >
  >      >                         I just realizeed that I havent hearrd
  >     from randy
  >      >                         for a while... I miss your witty repartae
  >      >                         randy...... email back so that I chan
  >     feel the
  >      >                         love...... I was thinking about you, and
  >     I hoep
  >      >                         you are doing good.... let me know if can
  >     help
  >      >                         if you are having problems....... mujch
  >     love......
  >      >                         junkster..... the junkboy..... it seems im a
  >      >                         junkboy.... damn... the cops keep drivijg by
  >      >                         thry ihg
  >      >                         specializing in vintage motorcycle, atv
  >     (three
  >      >                         and four wheelers), and snowmobile parts from
  >      >                         1959-1989. if you need anything call or
  >     email,
  >      >                         we can get any part you need. new,used, or
  >      >                         reproduction. even if the part is obsolete.
  >      >                         
  >      >                         if someone you love is addicted to something
  >      >                         (heroin, cocaine, meth, ect), google
  >      >                         ibogaine.... its worth your time..... i
  >     promise....
  >      >
  >      >                             ----- Original Message -----
  >      >                             *From:* Brad Hays
  >      >                             <mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com<mailto:bradleyheathhays at gmail.com>>
  >      >                             *To:* The Ibogaine List
  >      >                             <mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com<mailto:ibogaine at mindvox.com>>
  >      >                             *Sent:* Monday, May 26, 2008 3:28 PM
  >      >                             *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine
  >     article
  >      >                             barcelona conference
  >      >                             Would love to see all of this Howard, and
  >      >                             thanks for your work on it.  Actually I'd
  >      >                             like to see that article in opposition to
  >      >                             ibogaine too if it's around.
  >      >                             On Mon, May 26, 2008 at 11:37 AM, Howard
  >      >                             Lotsof <hslotsof at phantom.com<mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>
  >     <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com<mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>>
  >      >                             <mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com<mailto:hslotsof at phantom.com>>> wrote:
  >      >
  >      >                                 I had forwarded the entire
  >     newsletter of
  >      >                                 May 11/12 from the Barcelona
  >     conference
  >      >                                 that had the promotional article
  >     for the
  >      >                                 ibogaine session to this list but, it
  >      >                                 does not appear to have landed.; 
  >     I have
  >      >                                 thus hoping that the article
  >     alone that
  >      >                                 is much smaller will work. A later
  >      >                                 edition of the Daily Update
  >     newsletter
  >      >                                 contained an article in opposition to
  >      >                                 ibogaine but, there is no doubt that
  >      >                                 ibogaine prevailed during the special
  >      >                                 session in which ibogaine
  >     presentations
  >      >                                 took place and in the minds and
  >     hearts
  >      >                                 of drug users and drug policy
  >     activists.
  >      >                                 I will see if I can get all of
  >     the slide
  >      >                                 shows and articles into a composite
  >      >                                 report within the next few weeks.
  >      >                                 Howard
  >      >
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