[Ibogaine] Dana and Sara

j0n at just-say-know.org j0n at just-say-know.org
Sat Jul 12 15:44:30 EDT 2008


obviously, the only solution is a STEEL CAGE MATCH.

>           It's been pretty quiet around here as of late about this
> issue. Since you brought it up again Vector, I would like to say one
> more thing, and then bow out.
>
>       Nobody wants to have to choose one person or the other, nobody
> that I know of anyway. I would think that these two leaders in our
> movement couild come to some kind of understanding without shredding
> the reputation of the other.
>
>        Spread the Love
>
>              Randy
>
> On 7/12/08, Vector Vector <vector620022002 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Simon and Broc, both of you have shown you are too stoned to be reading
>> anything right now, go to dana beal's corner ;)
>>
>> Dana and Sara would the two of you please somehow deal with each other?
>> Sara
>> I think you're an amazing healer and have been reading your words for
>> alot
>> of my life, I do think alot of what you say may be true, dana throws
>> away a
>> lot of money. I also truly think that sending people private email off
>> list
>> about Dana isn't the way to resolve it. I hear you, I'm listening but I
>> don't think that all of mindvox is some conspiricy that protects dana
>> and
>> makes the world see everything his way. I do think Dana and Patrick are
>> friends and all, I do think Dana has helped a lot of people here, so
>> have
>> you. I really wish you'd both talk to each other, Please?
>>
>> .:vector:.
>> --- On Sat, 7/12/08, Dave Brockman <davebroc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> From: Dave Brockman <davebroc at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vancouver's "four pillars" drug policy
>>> To: "The Ibogaine List" <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>> Date: Saturday, July 12, 2008, 3:53 AM
>>> I was wondering the same thing...... you posted a quote as a
>>> reply to
>>> a cool ibogaine article, that has nothing to do with the
>>> article. wtf
>>> am i missing?
>>>
>>> -broc
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 3:33 AM, simon loxton
>>> <simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> > Hello;
>>> >
>>> > Where was that excerpt from?
>>> > That would be appreciated; really!.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks
>>> >
>>> > Si'
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original Message ----
>>> > From: DC in AZ <dcollier9 at cox.net>
>>> > To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>> > Sent: Saturday, 12 July, 2008 3:26:35 AM
>>> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vancouver's "four
>>> pillars" drug policy
>>> >
>>> >>>Vancouver's "four pillars" drug
>>> policy already includes safe injection
>>> >>>sites and prescription heroin for harm
>>> reduction. Ibogaine programs
>>> >
>>> > - what ? how to get RX for horsey-pung in Vancouver ?
>>> >
>>> > wow
>>> >
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> > Donzo
>>> > "Love converts hearts, and gives peace."
>>> > __________________________________________________
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: "Vector Vector"
>>> <vector620022002 at yahoo.com>
>>> > To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>>> > Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 12:43 PM
>>> > Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga Therapy House
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> http://thismagazine.ca/issues/2008/07/lastrefuge.php
>>> >>
>>> >> .:vector:.
>>> >>
>>> >> THE ADDICT'S LAST REFUGE?
>>> >>
>>> >> B.C.'s Iboga Therapy House is following in a
>>> decades-old tradition of
>>> >> underground rehab—administering a drug called
>>> ibogaine, which has the
>>> >> reported side effect of curbing addiction. But can
>>> these activists take
>>> >> their experiment mainstream?
>>> >>
>>> >> BY PETER TUPPER
>>> >> PHOTOGRAPHY BY REUTERS: ANDY CLARK
>>> >>
>>> >> The drug rehabilitation facility is an ordinary
>>> split-level house in a
>>> >> sleepy residential neighbourhood in a small town
>>> on B.C.'s Sunshine Coast.
>>> >> Inside, the many bookshelves contain everything
>>> from psychopharmacology
>>> >> textbooks to psychedelic graphic novels. Visitors
>>> are welcomed by a small,
>>> >> dark-haired woman named Sandra Karpetas. Though
>>> she has no formal training
>>> >> in medicine, she speaks knowledgeably about
>>> neurochemistry.
>>> >>
>>> >> The people who come here need help. They're
>>> looking for a substance called
>>> >> ibogaine, a psychotropic drug that is reported to
>>> be an addiction
>>> >> interrupter. Iboga Therapy House is often the last
>>> hope of people wishing
>>> >> to free themselves from addiction to heroin,
>>> cocaine, prescription
>>> >> painkillers or other substances. A potentially
>>> powerful tool in the
>>> >> treatment of addiction, ibogaine is unregulated in
>>> Canada. In the U.S. it
>>> >> is a Schedule I controlled substance, alongside
>>> heroin, cannabis and LSD.
>>> >>
>>> >> For decades, an underground network has
>>> administered it to addicts in need
>>> >> worldwide. But ibogaine's profound effect on
>>> the recipient's mind and
>>> >> body, which is what makes it an effective
>>> treatment, may also be its
>>> >> biggest obstacle to acceptance as a medicine. Now,
>>> Iboga Therapy House is
>>> >> where ibogaine may be recognized as a legitimate
>>> medical treatment.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> The original Iboga House was founded in 2002 by
>>> Marc Emery, B.C.'s
>>> >> infamous marijuana activist and seed merchant.
>>> Financed by his marijuana
>>> >> seed sales, Emery helped deliver ibogaine for free
>>> to addicts in the
>>> >> Sunshine Coast, personally administering it to
>>> close to 70 people. Two
>>> >> years later, when financial and legal troubles
>>> forced Emery to close the
>>> >> house, he encouraged Karpetas, a comrade in the
>>> project, to continue the
>>> >> work. In 2005, she registered the house as a
>>> non-profit, and reopened it
>>> >> the following year at a rented property about an
>>> hour and a half from
>>> >> Vancouver.
>>> >>
>>> >> The location was chosen to be peaceful and
>>> isolated, and kept secret for
>>> >> the confidentiality of both clients and staff.
>>> Karpetas professionalized
>>> >> Emery's operation, setting up protocols for
>>> screening patients for mental
>>> >> and physical problems at Iboga Therapy House, to
>>> reduce potential danger
>>> >> and prevent fatalities. Iboga is now a non-profit
>>> company, with 10 people
>>> >> on call, including a registered nurse, two EMTs,
>>> several facilitators, two
>>> >> substance counsellors and one follow-up
>>> coordinator. There is also an MD
>>> >> who acts as a consultant. Karpetas, now
>>> Iboga's program director, is one
>>> >> of two full-time employees. So far, 59 people have
>>> undergone treatment at
>>> >> Iboga House.
>>> >>
>>> >> The not-for-profit, which is no longer free—the
>>> five- to seven-day course
>>> >> of treatment costs close to $5,000—can generally
>>> accept only those who can
>>> >> afford it. "There are people in every class
>>> who use substances and it's
>>> >> not just people who live on the street who become
>>> dependent, necessarily,"
>>> >> says the 32-year-old Karpetas, though the clinic
>>> does sometimes donate
>>> >> services to addicts in need. Ibogaine, like other
>>> detoxification methods,
>>> >> is not enough on its own to get people off the
>>> streets, and works best on
>>> >> people with support systems in place.
>>> >>
>>> >> People seek out Iboga House after learning of it
>>> through word of mouth or
>>> >> on the internet. The candidates for treatment are
>>> screened for a variety
>>> >> of medical conditions, including psychiatric
>>> problems, epilepsy, heart
>>> >> problems and HIV, and must submit a general
>>> medical evaluation from a
>>> >> doctor, along with details on their social support
>>> network and their plans
>>> >> for recovery.
>>> >>
>>> >> Karpetas is primarily self-educated, but has a
>>> background doing
>>> >> harm-reduction counselling with addicts. "I
>>> have some of the best mentors
>>> >> in the world," she says. "I didn't
>>> go to university. But my self-education
>>> >> has included a lot of workshops, a lot of
>>> conferences, reading books,
>>> >> talking to people, particularly on the topics of
>>> harm reduction,
>>> >> psychotherapy, drug education and facilitation.
>>> There really is no
>>> >> training program for what I do."
>>> >>
>>> >> Karpetas first heard of ibogaine in the late
>>> 1990s, through Jonathan Ott's
>>> >> book Pharmacotheon: Entheogenic Drugs, Their Plant
>>> Sources and History. At
>>> >> the time, she found herself moving in two
>>> different worlds; in one, she
>>> >> saw people using psychoactive substances for
>>> therapeutic and
>>> >> self-explorative purposes; in another, she saw
>>> people inflicting great
>>> >> harm on themselves through drug abuse. Ibogaine
>>> seemed to bridge the two
>>> >> worlds, a substance that could fight addiction by
>>> awakening the mind.
>>> >> Despite her interest, Karpetas didn't know
>>> there were people distributing
>>> >> ibogaine in B.C.
>>> >>
>>> >> She planned a trip to West Africa to test ibogaine
>>> out, but instead had a
>>> >> chance encounter with a colleague who told her
>>> about Emery's project. She
>>> >> immediately contacted him, and toured the facility
>>> the following day. "I
>>> >> could see that there was some really good
>>> potential for philanthropic
>>> >> work," she says, "but I could also see
>>> that, unless they instituted a
>>> >> number of changes to the way they did things, that
>>> it could also be
>>> >> potentially dangerous." There have been
>>> several known fatalities
>>> >> associated with ibogaine, though not necessarily
>>> caused by it. For
>>> >> example, in 2005, a 48-year-old woman died in a
>>> Mexican ibogaine clinic
>>> >> from acute myocardial infarct and acute coronary
>>> syndrome. In 2006, a
>>> >> 38-year-old U.S. man died at an ibogaine clinic in
>>> Tijuana from pulmonary
>>> >> thrombosis. Karpetas says, "They seem to be
>>> related to improper medical
>>> >> screening, improper monitoring during the therapy,
>>> and just a basic lack
>>> >> of education on the part of the
>>> >> individuals taking it."
>>> >>
>>> >> The present-day Iboga House provides a controlled
>>> setting that minimizes
>>> >> these risks. Clients go through a thorough medical
>>> screening and wait 12
>>> >> hours from the last dose of their drug. When they
>>> arrive at the house,
>>> >> clients are lead to its lower level, where one
>>> room serves as an
>>> >> altar-like space with elements of many different
>>> religious traditions.
>>> >>
>>> >> The individual takes a small test dose of ibogaine
>>> to ensure no adverse
>>> >> reactions, then the full dose in capsules an hour
>>> later. The drug causes a
>>> >> temporary loss of co-ordination, but also
>>> minimizes withdrawal symptoms,
>>> >> which can typically include diarrhea, stomach
>>> cramps, leg restlessness,
>>> >> the inability to sleep, extreme agitation and
>>> depression. "The symptoms of
>>> >> withdrawal can be very much like the most intense
>>> flu you've ever had. It
>>> >> lasts for weeks and can be extremely
>>> painful," says Karpetas. "None of
>>> >> that occurs with ibogaine. I haven't seen
>>> anything like [ibogaine]
>>> >> anywhere, ever." The rehabilitating trip is
>>> intense. Once dosed, the
>>> >> patient experiences a dream-like state lasting
>>> anywhere from 24 to 36
>>> >> hours. An RN and an EMT watch the client
>>> constantly during the first 16
>>> >> hours, with a portable defibrillator kit, an
>>> oxygen tank and a full
>>> >> medical bag close at hand, and the local hospital
>>> is five minutes away.
>>> >>
>>> >> Karpetas avoids calling ibogaine
>>> "psychedelic," saying instead that it's
>>> >> an oneirogen—a dreaminducing substance.
>>> "It's like a prolonged waking
>>> >> dream experience," she says. "It has a
>>> totally different mode of action
>>> >> than most of what are termed
>>> "psychedelics."
>>> >>
>>> >> She also emphasizes that ibogaine is no miracle
>>> cure. "People really have
>>> >> to have a number of things set in place in their
>>> life that are going to
>>> >> assist them in recovery," she says.
>>> "They should have factors such as
>>> >> housing, social support, employment or
>>> employability skills, or a career
>>> >> of some sort, and long-term follow-up and
>>> aftercare."
>>> >>
>>> >> Because of ibogaine's murky legal status,
>>> there are few studies of its
>>> >> effectiveness. Dr. Ken Alper, an assistant
>>> professor of psychiatry and
>>> >> neurology at New York University School of
>>> Medicine, conducted lengthy
>>> >> clinical trials of ibogaine detoxification in the
>>> 1990s. In a study of 33
>>> >> opioid users, 25 were found free of withdrawal
>>> symptoms 24 hours after
>>> >> ibogaine treatment, and they showed no
>>> drug-seeking behaviour 72 hours
>>> >> later. Testing on animals yielded similar results.
>>> >>
>>> >> Used in the initiation rituals of the Bwiti people
>>> in Gabon and Cameroon,
>>> >> ibogaine's addiction-treating properties were
>>> discovered by a young
>>> >> American man named Howard Lotsof in the early
>>> 1960s. A drug user, Lotsof
>>> >> took ibogaine, which is derived from the bark of a
>>> West African bush, and
>>> >> experienced a 36- hour trip full of Freudian
>>> imagery. Lotsof noticed after
>>> >> coming down that "for the first time in
>>> months, I did not want or need to
>>> >> go cop heroin. In fact, I viewed heroin as a drug
>>> that emulated death; I
>>> >> wanted life."
>>> >>
>>> >> He ordered more ibogaine, an uncontrolled chemical
>>> at the time, and
>>> >> administered it to an informal focus group. Out of
>>> the 20 people he
>>> >> tested, seven heroin users had no withdrawal
>>> symptoms and five had no
>>> >> desire to use heroin again during the six-month
>>> monitoring period.
>>> >> However, hippie culture had no use for ibogaine,
>>> which was not a party
>>> >> drug, and the U.S. government was criminalizing
>>> psychedelic drugs.
>>> >>
>>> >> Lotsof continued his ibogaine research, despite
>>> limited resources and a
>>> >> 14-month prison term for conspiracy to sell LSD,
>>> and succeeded in getting
>>> >> a U.S. patent on the use of ibogaine in narcotic
>>> dependency interruption
>>> >> in 1985. However, drug companies were indifferent,
>>> seeing no profit in
>>> >> ibogaine, which is a natural product that
>>> can't be patented, and is
>>> >> administered in a single, large dose instead of
>>> regular, ongoing doses,
>>> >> like methadone.
>>> >>
>>> >> Meanwhile, knowledge of ibogaine's therapeutic
>>> use spread by word of
>>> >> mouth, and an underground detoxification movement
>>> grew in many countries.
>>> >> Professional, above-ground clinics in Europe,
>>> Mexico and the Caribbean
>>> >> provide it, and lay practitioners administer it to
>>> addicts in their homes
>>> >> or makeshift clinics.
>>> >>
>>> >> Iboga House is not the only above-ground ibogaine
>>> clinic in the world, but
>>> >> it is the first to contribute to the slowly
>>> growing body of research on
>>> >> the drug, in partnership with U.S.-based
>>> Multidisciplinary Association for
>>> >> Psychedelic Studies (MAPS), a nonprofit research
>>> organization studying the
>>> >> application of psychedelics and marijuana. When
>>> Rick Doblin, MAPS founder
>>> >> and president, met Karpetas at a conference in
>>> 2001, he had long been
>>> >> interested in studying ibogaine. He couldn't
>>> do so in the United States,
>>> >> so jumped at the chance to work with Iboga House,
>>> once that became an
>>> >> option five years later. "[Karpetas] was
>>> willing to be honest, to look at
>>> >> the data of how well the treatment worked,"
>>> Doblin says. "She welcomed the
>>> >> research into the therapeutic context of the
>>> clinic, and also the
>>> >> spotlight that it would put on her methods."
>>> >>
>>> >> Since 2006, Iboga House and the MAPS study have
>>> worked in parallel. The
>>> >> clinic medically screens and treats clients, after
>>> which MAPS phones them
>>> >> once a month for a year to administer the standard
>>> addiction severity
>>> >> index interview recognized by the U.S. Food and
>>> Drug Administration and
>>> >> the National Institute on Drug Abuse, which tracks
>>> many aspects of a
>>> >> person's life, including drug use.
>>> >>
>>> >> Ibogaine must be compared with other forms of
>>> medicated detoxification,
>>> >> which include using general anesthesia in a
>>> clinical setting to make the
>>> >> patient unconscious through the withdrawal
>>> symptoms.
>>> >>
>>> >> Other treatment programs have high rates of
>>> dropouts. A 2004 American
>>> >> study found that only 16.6 percent of methadone
>>> users completed their
>>> >> programs, and even detoxification programs only
>>> had a completion rate of
>>> >> 62.3. The remainder of participants drop out or
>>> are discharged. Treatment
>>> >> programs can also leave the patient dependent on
>>> regular doses of drugs
>>> >> such as methadone.
>>> >>
>>> >> In contrast to the more institutional programs,
>>> Iboga House's philosophy
>>> >> and goal is harm reduction, not abstinence. If,
>>> after taking ibogaine,
>>> >> people reduce their drug use or switch to less
>>> dangerous drugs, that's
>>> >> still viewed as an improvement. "If they do
>>> happen to relapse and they
>>> >> need support," says Karpetas "they can
>>> call us or the follow-up
>>> >> co-ordinator and say, 'Look, I'm feeling
>>> like I'm going to relapse or I
>>> >> have relapsed once or I had a one-time binge or
>>> something.' We're there to
>>> >> support them through that period to make sure they
>>> essentially understand
>>> >> that even if they relapse, they're not
>>> complete failures, that they can
>>> >> still work toward improving their life." She
>>> adds, "Generally, we find
>>> >> people who have not succeeded in religion-based or
>>> 12-step-based programs
>>> >> might have a better chance of succeeding in a
>>> program like ours."
>>> >>
>>> >> Karpetas's goal is that, once demonstrated
>>> effective, ibogaine be
>>> >> recognized under Canada's Natural Health
>>> Products Regulations, as a
>>> >> product to be used in a specific protocol in a
>>> clinical setting, with
>>> >> Iboga House as the model and the results of the
>>> MAPS study as evidence.
>>> >> "We would like to get accredited in the
>>> future," she says. "But that would
>>> >> have to go hand-in-hand with demonstrating the
>>> effectiveness of ibogaine,
>>> >> and trying to get it regulated through the Natural
>>> Health Products
>>> >> program." A Health Canada official stated in
>>> an email that no ibogaine
>>> >> containing product has yet been licensed, and it
>>> is up to the manufacturer
>>> >> to prove that their product is safe, effective and
>>> high quality. Also, the
>>> >> Vancouver Coastal Health Authority inspected the
>>> house in April 2008 and
>>> >> found that it didn't come under the Community
>>> Care and Assisted Living Act
>>> >> because it didn't have the facilities to treat
>>> three or more people.
>>> >> Karpetas says that her
>>> >> house meets all the requirements of the act
>>> otherwise.
>>> >>
>>> >> Ibogaine's therapeutic use has grown in the
>>> grey area outside medical and
>>> >> scientific authority because of the need for
>>> better addiction treatment
>>> >> than methadone dependency or anesthetic detox.
>>> Underground treatment
>>> >> providers continue to operate in the U.S., where
>>> ibogaine is highly
>>> >> illegal, because they feel people need it enough
>>> to take risks. One
>>> >> American provider told Karpetas that, if anything
>>> went wrong for his
>>> >> clients, his emergency procedure was, "I call
>>> emergency services and I
>>> >> jet."
>>> >>
>>> >> Regardless of whether legal and medical
>>> authorities legitimize ibogaine,
>>> >> people will continue using it, just as people keep
>>> using drugs.
>>> >> Vancouver's
>>> >> "four pillars" drug policy already
>>> includes safe injection sites and
>>> >> prescription heroin for harm reduction. Ibogaine
>>> programs like Iboga House
>>> >> could be part of the treatment pillar, recognizing
>>> that in addiction the
>>> >> mind, as well as the body, needs to be healed.
>>> >>
>>> >> Paula, a 42-year-old woman who had used cocaine
>>> intermittently since age
>>> >> 19 and recently graduated to smoking crack, says
>>> that 12-step programs
>>> >> didn't work for her because she was constantly
>>> being reminded she was an
>>> >> addict. She went through the ibogaine treatment in
>>> January 2008. Five
>>> >> weeks after her treatment, she says she feels no
>>> cravings, has improved
>>> >> her health, reconnected with her daughter and is
>>> in the process of getting
>>> >> her business back. "I know what it's been
>>> like going through a treatment
>>> >> centre for seven months, and it's not like
>>> this," she says. "I don't taste
>>> >> cocaine, smell it, want it, crave it, dream it.
>>> Nothing at all. I feel
>>> >> like I've got a second chance at life, where
>>> before I was just going day
>>> >> by day, step by step. I don't feel that with
>>> this. It's gone."
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
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