[Ibogaine] FW: Ibogaine Talk

Douglas Fraser doug_fraser at microcinema.com
Wed Feb 20 16:58:59 EST 2008


well, what ARE the dangers of ibogaine?   why have people died?   a) as far 
as i understand, there are certain types of cardiovascular irregularies 
that preclude one from dealing with the stress of the experience.   b) 
patients do stupid things like mix ibogaine with other drugs, in violation 
of protocol and sheer common sense.   i haven't heard of any other causes, 
but i am not an expert here...

a) can be checked out and thus people filtered out

b) will happen, period, and is not the fault of ibogaine.   quite frankly, 
such people have to be held responsible for their death or medical 
emergency.  it's quite clear that ibogaine is a complicated sort of 
substance and to mix it with anything is playing with fire

I also understand there is some percentage who are allergic, so ... again, 
there are tests to determine that.

I think all this can be categorized as safety checks.  IMO, I don't think 
genetic analysis and the like is needed (I haven't heard of issues)- so it 
seems the risk factors in taking ibogaine are well known and can be dealt 
with appropriately

as for psychological risk factors.... well that is another ballpark 
entirely, but common sense should be able to guide reasonably well

so I'd say the medical / physical risks around ibogaine are known

the question of "is ibogaine effective?" is a entirely separate discussion 
and it could be argued it isn't (if you define "effectiveness" as getting 
everyone off whatever substance they were hooked on immediately in one or 
two treatments)

but ...  Western medicine does not seem to care much about the problem of 
prescription drugs causing deaths for various reasons, like inadvertent 
side effects and mixing....   (versus the hysteria over illegal drugs) so 
Western medicine and conventional wisdom can shove it

please stop spamming the list with the idiotic crap from this idiot.  I'd 
say a component of his attitude lies in the fact that ibogaine could very 
well put him out of a job



Nick Sandberg wrote:
> More from Alex
> 
> Nick
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>   _____  
> 
> From: Alex Wodak [mailto:awodak at stvincents.com.au] 
> Sent: 18 February 2008 21:55
> To: Nick Sandberg
> Cc: gerry.stimson at ihra.net
> Subject: RE: Ibogaine Talk
> 
>  
> 
> Dear Nick,
> 
>  
> 
> It seems to me that you support safety checks for aircraft because a lot of
> people want to fly but don't support safety checks on ibogaine because a lot
> of people want to take it
> 
>  
> 
> Is my summary correct?
> 
>  
> 
> If not, what's wrong with it?
> 
>  
> 
> best wishes, 
> 
>  
> 
> Alex
> 
>  
> 
> Dr. Alex Wodak,
> Director, Alcohol and Drug Service,
> St. Vincent's Hospital, 
> Darlinghurst, NSW, 2010,
> AUSTRALIA
> 
>  
> 
> Telephone: (61+02) 9361 8012
> If no prompt answer, try 9361 8014
> Facsimile: (61+02) 8382 4738
> awodak at stvincents.com.au
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
>   _____  
> 
> From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:nick227 at tiscali.co.uk] 
> Sent: 19 February 2008 14:18
> To: 'Alex Wodak'
> Subject: RE: Ibogaine Talk
> 
>  
> 
> Dear Alex,
> 
> I think I would say that I support safety checks but when the existing
> mechanism for providing them is not providing them I accept that people
> might fly without them. I am an acute realist. I am not so bothered with
> some fantasy world PR that is being pushed out by the pharm business. You
> might lap it all up. I look deeper. That is my nature. When you want to
> start to deal in the real world feel free to get in touch.
> 
> Nick 
> 
>  
> 
> ********
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>  
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