[Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada

Luke Christoffersen luke.christoffersen at gmail.com
Wed Sep 26 15:59:13 EDT 2007


I was a bit disappointed with my first experience of ibogaine too.

I'm not surprised you took a while to use the computer, I try to use it as
little as possible. Mostly only for entertainment or email.   I think it can
be a bit draining. I don't think we were made to sit in front of screens all
day.

It sounds interesting anyway.  The whole spirit thing I'm not to familiar
with, I guess I kind of stayed away from it to focus on the emotional
healing area but I've begun to wonder more about it and whether I should
have been more open to spiritual things and if that would help me to get
well.

Luke


On 9/22/07, simon loxton <simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I don't think having previous ibogaine experiences had anything to do with
> it. I was actually disappointed with my early experiences until it helped me
> bring issues to the surface later on. I am not sure what I am supposed to
> reveal and what not to but to stay on the safe side as I know that they did
> not want me to impart knowledge over the net all I can say is its about
> understanding iboga as an energy and this can be explained scientifically to
> a degree, but also spirits of the forest are called or invoked. Once you
> feel that for your self and know how it can be used there is no drug that
> can compare and it made a complete change in the way I see things. It took
> me a while to get back to using a computer ( down to earth!)but once you
> have experienced that you just want more of it and this is what is needed if
> you want to completely change your life. I just cant wait until the next
> Bwiti, as Tatayo says "its Bwitifull" I wish everyone could experience it
> and you can! Then its just a matter of learning, same as going to school. I
> feel it has been a permanent change that has taken place but as i said
> before you have to keep the spirit alive by feeding it. The trouble with us
> (people in the west) is that we have become so unique and hybrid even in our
> expression that this can leave us feeling useless and unable to connect with
> other people and the world around us. This is easily achieved with Bwiti.
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Luke Christoffersen <luke.christoffersen at gmail.com>
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> Sent: Saturday, 22 September, 2007 7:36:03 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
>
> Hi Simon,
>              It sounds very good. You took what sounded like a fairly
> small dose from what I saw in your other mail.  To be blown away sounds
> great. :) It might have helped that you had previous treatments?  I found
> that you seem to be able to connect to the energy better once you've done
> some treatments. I don't suppose you can reveal what was happening in your
> experience that made saying fuck to doing drugs seem so easy?
>
> Luke
>
> On 9/22/07, simon loxton <simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >  Yes! and its for everyone. I found that this was the kind of thing I
> > personally found lacking in conventional ibogaine treatments because it was
> > after an experience like this that it becomes life changing. When you
> > connect with this kind of energy its very easy to say fuck doing drugs and
> > fucking up my life. Its a passion with these people and its some thing you
> > feel.... you don't have to think am I experiencing this...it blows you away.
> > Maybe I had a strong connection, I don't know. After sunrise they do a
> > benediction and they said the Bwiti was very happy to have me there and
> > everyone was very uplifted so I guess I cant say different as this is just
> > the beginning for me. I am just happy to be able to pass on what I have
> > learnt.
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Matthew Shriver < Matt at ITSupport.net>
> > To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, 22 September, 2007 4:05:36 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> >  I'm a little envious of you to hear this description.  I would love an
> > opportunity to experience it for myself some day.
> >
> >
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
> > *From:* ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com [mailto:
> > ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com] *On Behalf Of *simon loxton
> > *Sent:* Saturday, September 22, 2007 3:12 AM
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> >
> >
> > This was in the evening as the preparation for the ceremony started at
> > about 4pm and started at sundown until sunrise. Also with them dancing and
> > waving those torches around........it was a great experience. You know how
> > you can feel bass at a concert or a dance party? well this is how I could
> > feel the energy that they were directing around the circle. One woman was
> > there for healing (And this is interesting) it was for epilepsy. She
> > suffered no contra indications and from displaying some signs when she
> > arrived probably due to nerves she totally relaxed while they were working
> > on her!
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Matthew Shriver < Matt at ITSupport.net>
> > To: The Ibogaine List < ibogaine at mindvox.com >
> > Sent: Saturday, 22 September, 2007 12:08:02 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> > I agree Simon that the hcl has to be the way to go for a treatment.  But
> > perhaps boosters could be done with bark as well as any spiritual use.  The
> > amount you mention sounds about like the dose I sometimes take about 4 hours
> > before going mountain biking.  I think the bark is more stimulant like than
> > the hcl.  At that does I usually find my balance ever so slightly affected
> > but only enough to make the slightest difference with the mountain biking
> > and that's a pretty balance intensive activity.  I never notice any visual
> > effects until the evening in dim lights.
> >
> >
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
> > *From:* ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com [mailto:
> > ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com] *On Behalf Of *simon loxton
> > *Sent:* Friday, September 21, 2007 10:49 AM
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Matt,
> >
> > The added effect would be from the other alkaloids in the root bark.
> > During the Bwiti I attended we all took an amount which could be described
> > "dosage wise" as a pile that fitted within the palm of the hand. This way of
> > working dosage works well as the bigger you are the larger your hands are.
> > If the person has more bulk then a little more is given. Now this is just a
> > dose that is used for Bwiti not an initiatory dose, an initiatory dose: I
> > was told is sixteen to seventeen times the amount. I had what could be
> > described as a heaped table spoon in quantity. This was enough to see trails
> > and with the addition of the music and singing as well as the way they
> > manipulate the flow of energy I felt the combined effect very powerful and
> > much more than ibogaine hcl on its own. This is all very well for spiritual
> > or psychological work, or even in treating afflictions of the mind which is
> > another topic in its self which I hope to get the chance to share about at
> > some point. But the point I am trying to make especially where opioid
> > withdrawal is being treated the hcl is far easier on the patient. It would
> > be interesting to discover more about the other alkaloids though and I hope
> > to discover more about this through Bwiti while the funding is still absent
> > for laboratory work. Basse
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Matthew Shriver < Matt at ITSupport.net>
> > To: The Ibogaine List < ibogaine at mindvox.com >
> > Sent: Friday, 21 September, 2007 3:07:37 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> > Maybe we should all be switching to bark?  That yield is low. If you ate
> > a kilo of bark you would get way, way, more effect then the equivalent of 1
> > to 1.5 grams.  Which is good considering you realistically could never
> > eat a kilo of bark.
> >
> >
> >
> > Matt
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
> > *From:* ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com [mailto:
> > ibogaine-bounces at mindvox.com] *On Behalf Of *simon loxton
> > *Sent:* Friday, September 21, 2007 4:43 AM
> > *To:* The Ibogaine List
> > *Subject:* Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> >
> >
> > And just to add to Patrick's post, on a larger scale it takes half a ton
> > of root bark to produce on kilogramme of hydrochloride. Besides the
> > difficulty to grow the plant there are also statutory laws surrounding the
> > export of iboga from Gabon . The other thing is that it is a time consuming
> > process. The roots have to be washed and then all the debarking is done by
> > hand. I was given a rough idea that it would take about six months to
> > produce a ton of root bark. I am not sure how many people would be working
> > on the project but it is not a simple task at all and as Patrick said the
> > yield is not very high for a pharmaceutical grade of ibogaine hydrochloride.
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Patrick K. Kroupa < digital at phantom.com>
> > To: The Ibogaine List < ibogaine at mindvox.com >
> > Sent: Friday, 21 September, 2007 10:59:57 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Practicing Iboga Therapy in Canada
> >
> > On Sep 19, 2007, at 11:42 PM, Marc Emery wrote:
> >
> > > Hmmmm, that sounds about right as to the scarcity in the marketplace.
> > >
> > > Buts its confounding, Ibogaine is legal in almost all countries, I
> > > don't understand the difficulty in production. I understood that
> > > Ibogaine HCI isn't from iboga root but in fact is a by-product of
> > > other laboratory extractions.
> > >
> >
> > Ibogaine HCl is from iboga root bark, it takes roughly 1 kilo to
> > produce 1 - 1.5GM of HCl.  The world demand has significantly
> > increased, the availability has not.  The future of ibogaine is most
> > likely cell-culture technology; which is presently prohibitively
> > expensive to utilize for mass-production.  Once demand hits a certain
> > peak, it will become more feasible.
> >
> > There are of course other possibilities, but ibogaine grows VERY
> > SLOWLY, it's difficult to use the cannabis paradigm of Overgrow the
> > Government in this case...
> >
> > Patrick
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
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