[Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , Marc Emery

simon loxton simonloxton at yahoo.co.uk
Sun Sep 23 05:23:55 EDT 2007


"it is a certainty that I have more hands-on experience with ibogaine and addiction that anyone on this list" Mark with all due respect maybe you should make sure who is on this list before you make broad statements like this, I don't know you this is the first time I have ever heard your Name in conjunction with ibogaine. I can say that from your emails you don't know all that much about addiction if you want to put it down to missing father figures, and there are sure as hell people on this list with more experience.


----- Original Message ----
From: Marc Emery <Marc420Emery at shaw.ca>
To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, 23 September, 2007 1:40:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , Marc Emery

There would be a greater degree of success with ibogaine if the patient's the body has metabolized some of the drug that is in the patients system. Also, the patient wouldn't get a very strong visual experience if the drug in the body was recent. The ibogaine also costs money, none of these patients were paying one cent for the treatment that with a staff of four costs $3,000 per person, and for methadone patients, $5,000 - $8,000 per person (one person had to stay with us 13 days, from a 300 mg. daily methadone volume).  


So anyone who wants to criticize may well temper their unkindness because it is a certainty that I have more hands-on experience with ibogaine and addiction that anyone on this list, and that I did it with no monetary motive in mind.


Marc Emery

----- Original Message -----
From: Adam Nodelman <jonathanswiftboat at yahoo.com>
Date: Saturday, September 22, 2007 12:35 am
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , Marc Emery
To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>

> also what exactly do mean by "sweating out" ? i mean that kinda 
> sounds like some kind of wrong headed victorian era medical 
> assumption.what comes next? the leeches?what i mean is,your 
> gonna sweat out alot of shit no matter what,and a booster when 
> someone BEGINS to feel discomfort will not in any way prevent 
> any nessesary "sweating out" that will take place.what im 
> getting at is i sense some perhaps  completely wrong 
> assumptions on the subject of methadone,or  opiate 
> withdrawl;that of a non addict.suffering is not a good or 
> beneficial state to be in.nothing good comes from it;its not for 
> ones own good.also,a timely booster can and will prevent 
> heroin,or methadone use at that stage and can both save the 
> treatment,and in some cases the very LIFE of the patient. adam
> 
> Marc Emery <Marc420Emery at shaw.ca> wrote: I treated 14 people 
> for methadone, including my own son. I treated individuals 
> taking 300 mg a day, 140-mg a day, and amounts ranging from 30 
> mg to 100 mg. The American patients were always taking huge 
> amounts their doctor had prescribed them.
> 
> I never found it necessary to re-dose anyone in the first week 
> after the first dose. Addicts do feel familiar aches after 
> ibogaine, but full blown withdrawl, I have never seen it. 
> Usually it is three to four weeks after the first and only 
> treatment that the patient called me up and said in vague ways 
> that a non-addict finds difficult to understand that "I think I 
> want to go back on methadone again..." and I would ask why, and 
> they usually could not say, as though the only answer to their 
> malaise was a return to methadone. Most addicts were in very 
> poor health (as John was) and aren't at all exercising and 
> sweating the methadone out of their body. Once you have ibogaine 
> you have to keep busy and be very physical, or else you will 
> focus on discomfort and absence (of the familiar). Ultimately, 
> every opiate addict knows withdrawl is something they can 
> survive, but they are lacking insight and will to endure this 
> discomfort. 
> 
> 
> Marc Emery
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: John Schwarzkopf <jmcreature at telus.net>
> Date: Friday, September 21, 2007 10:59 pm
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , Marc Emery
> To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> 
> > Hi Marc,
> > 
> > John went to your store and talked to you. Asked you if you 
> > could recommend someone that knew what they were doing, had 
> > experience and you put us in touch with Linette.
> > You accompanied her is some occasions before the treatment and 
> > she gave you accounts of how the treatment was going hourly. I 
> > do feel that you are somewhat responsible for her 
> > shortcomings because you recommended her and because once she 
> > left and decided that John didn't have withdrawals even though 
> > she wasn't even here , as her mentor, you didn't contact her 
> to 
> > ask 
> > "what are you doing??"   and because I still think 
> > that you are not so aware of the method of treatment for 
> > methadone users and wouldn't have been able to give her proper 
> advice.> 
> > I am glad that you agree that she did a less than satisfactory job.
> > 
> > About the schedule.. You know, I read your post as I was gonna 
> > leave to go have dinner at the restaurant, and the whole time 
> I 
> > was there I kept wondering : if the man being treated starts
> > to have withdrawals 3 days after treatment then what? does he 
> do 
> > dope ? or methadone? or just suffer ? until day 7..
> > Why not do the booster when the withdrawals start? Also, I 
> think 
> > that the boosters John took were a lot less than 14mg/kg.
> > and i do think John took the dose 24 hr after his last 
> methadone 
> > .. I can't be sure but if he did it was at his own request and 
> > he probably should have waited 48 hours.
> > 
> > Eric Taub had agreed to talk to Linette or you and explain how 
> > to use boosters  but both of you were acting like it was 
> > bad to take assistance from another provider because it means
> > they are more knowledgeable than you are!!
> > 
> > I wrote you an e-mail after John was ok and said that he took 
> > boosters as recommended by "someone in the US" and you e-
> mailed 
> > be back and asked 
> > Did you give him a booster dose of ibogaine or a small dose of 
> > methadone?
> > I don't think you knew how to treat someone for methadone. I 
> > have doubts you know now. I have no idea who is involved with 
> > the Iboga Therapy House and no idea of what they know.
> > If you knew about booster doses and the difficulties specific 
> to 
> > methadone treatment and didn't tell Linette.. then that means 
> > you would have done it intentionally.. meant for John to 
> fail.. 
> > I don't think 
> > that's the case and I really don't see why you would have?
> > 
> > Catherine
> > 
> > 
> >   ----- Original Message ----- 
> >   From: Marc Emery 
> >   To: The Ibogaine List 
> >   Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 7:08 PM
> >   Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , 
> Marc Emery
> > 
> > 
> >   Some points about this story,
> > 
> > 
> >   I never got payment from anybody for anything to 
> do with 
> > ibogaine.
> > 
> >   This was when Linette, one of my proteges, was on 
> her own 
> > and I was giving advice. When it was under my auspices, there 
> > was no charge for any service to any patient.
> > 
> > 
> >   Linette should have stayed longer. I offered all 
> my time 
> > to her free, of course, but I can't see where I did anything 
> > odd. It wasn't under my care. Linette came out to the man's 
> > home, which I rarely did in my treatments, and made an arrangement.
> > 
> > 
> >   Alas, Linette was probably not up to doing the job 
> on her 
> > own, in fact, and did a less than satisfactory job. My 
> proteges 
> > Linette and Sandra Karpetas really never were able to do well 
> on 
> > their own and this one experience was Linette's only solo 
> > experience. She couldn't do it well and never did it again.
> > 
> > 
> >   I worked on this schedule for methadone, 20 mg/kg 
> of body 
> > weight on Day One, and if it was possible, a booster dose of 
> > 14mg/kg 7 days later. But thats expensive. Methadone people 
> > required 5 - 13 days of treatment, they were the most 
> > challenging to help.
> > 
> > 
> >   Marc Emery
> > 
> >   ----- Original Message -----
> >   From: John Schwarzkopf <jmcreature at telus.net>
> >   Date: Friday, September 21, 2007 1:26 pm
> >   Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness , 
> Marc Emery
> >   To: The Ibogaine List <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
> > 
> >   > 
> >   > The temptation has grown since I got back on the 
> list 
> > somehow?? 
> >   > and  got to 
> >   > read the post from and about Marc Emery..
> >   > 
> >   > I wanted to say BEWARE OF MARC EMERY!!
> >   > 
> >   > Marc recommended a woman to treat John (who had 
> been on 
> >   > Methadone for 5 
> >   > years),Linette.
> >   > Marc attended one of the pre-treatment meeting 
> with us 
> > and he 
> >   > took Linette 
> >   > to our home the night
> >   > of the treatment and collected the second half 
> of the 
> > payment.  > 
> >   > (At some point between the pre-treatment meeting 
> and 
> > the 
> >   > treatment Linette 
> >   > called us and said something like "John is gonna 
> die! 
> > John is 
> >   > gonna die! I 
> >   > can't do this treatment!!
> >   > I don't want to go to jail!! My family don't 
> have money 
> > to bail 
> >   > me out!My 
> >   > family can't afford a good lawyer! John is gonna 
> die 
> > !!" She was 
> >   > completely 
> >   > hysteric and refused to give
> >   >  us back the half of the payment we already 
> given 
> > her (she 
> >   > said she had 
> >   > spent some of the money on Indra which is kind 
> of funny 
> > since in 
> >   > the end we 
> >   > used HCL(which we trusted better anyhow))).
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > The treatment went fine (Linette called  
> Marc 
> > every hour to 
> >   > report on what 
> >   > was happening) and Linette asked to go home 
> early after 
> > 24 
> >   > hours( if I 
> >   > remember well)
> >   >  because she was coming up with a cold.
> >   > I gave her a ride home. and thanked her.. I was 
> so 
> > happy..though 
> >   > we had paid 
> >   > her (or someone.. she told us that Marc and the 
> Iboga 
> > house were 
> >   > getting 
> >   > some $$ and Marc told us that
> >   > he was not taking any of the cash, just holding 
> it for 
> > Linette) 
> >   > , I was 
> >   > thinking of buying her a present for her help!!
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > I think it was the next day that John started to 
> have 
> >   > withdrawals.. at first 
> >   > I thought it was in his head. but after a while 
> I could 
> > see 
> >   > physical 
> >   > symptoms he couldn't have faked.
> >   > 
> >   > I called Linette and she told me that John was 
> not 
> > having 
> >   > withdrawals. and 
> >   > that she was going out for dinner with her 
> family who 
> > was 
> >   > visiting from 
> >   > Winnipeg.
> >   > Also contacted Marc Emery.. couldn't help.
> >   > 
> >   > I was very lucky that Eric Taub explained 
> to  me 
> > (on the 
> >   > phone) what was 
> >   > happening and recommended booster doses.
> >   > 
> >   > Called Linette again. She was too busy. Didn't 
> believe 
> > we needed 
> >   > the 
> >   > boosters. Agreed to give us some Indra .. enough 
> for 
> > one 
> >   > booster.. in 2 or 3 
> >   > days.
> >   > 
> >   > That's when we dug out a HCL stash John had had 
> for 
> > years. 
> >   > bought it from 
> >   > someone.. didn't know if it was what it was 
> supposed to 
> > be. 
> >   > didn't know if 
> >   > it had lost potency.
> >   > but that was all we had.  And NO SCALE!! as 
> i 
> > tried to 
> >   > figure who I could 
> >   > call to go get me a scale and bring it over.. 
> John 
> > decided to 
> >   > just guess and 
> >   > helped himself to a booster dose.
> >   > 
> >   > It worked. John had to take a few booster doses 
> but it 
> > worked. 
> >   > And Linette 
> >   > was mad that John took booster doses, she said 
> it 
> > messed with 
> >   > her data!!
> >   > 
> >   > If we hadn't had that stash John would have had 
> to 
> > either do 
> >   > dope or 
> >   > methadone ?? and what are the dangers of that???
> >   > How long after Ibogaine is it safe to take anything??
> >   > 
> >   > Marc Emery and his friend put us in a situation 
> way 
> > worse that 
> >   > where we had 
> >   > been in the first place.
> >   > 
> >   > My idea is that they didn't know about booster 
> doses . 
> > Didn't 
> >   > know that 
> >   > methadone users are more likely to require them.
> >   > 
> >   > Other people said that John's treatment was a 
> set up 
> > and that he 
> >   > was 
> >   > supposed to relapse. (That Marc's crew knew full 
> well 
> > he would 
> >   > need 
> >   > boosters).
> >   > I have to attribute this to paranoia.
> >   > Or is it a possibility?
> >   > 
> >   > I think it would be very wrong for Canada to 
> extradite 
> > Marc Emery.
> >   > but I would feel way better knowing he wasn't 
> treating 
> > people 
> >   > with Ibogaine.
> >   > 
> >   > If you get treated by his crew for 
> Methadone  I'd 
> > recommend 
> >   > having a stash 
> >   > of Ibogaine handy in case they drop you  
> half way.
> >   > 
> >   > Catherine Morency
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > ----- Original Message ----- 
> >   > From: "Patrick K. Kroupa" <digital at phantom.com>
> >   > To: "The Ibogaine List" 
> <ibogaine at mindvox.com>; "The 
> > War on 
> >   > Consciousness" 
> >   > <drugwar at mindvox.com>; 
> <sacrament at mindvox.com>; 
> >   > <vox at mindvox.com>; 
> >   > <crashtestdummies at mindvox.com>; 
> > <resurrection at mindvox.com>  > Sent: Friday, September 
> > 21, 2007 2:01 AM
> >   > Subject: [Ibogaine] The War on Consciousness
> >   > 
> >   > 
> >   > >
> >   > > If you have any interest whatsoever regarding 
> the 
> > negative 
> >   > impact of
> >   > > the War on Consciousness; I meant to say DRUGS 
> -- 
> > PLEASE take the
> >   > > time to check out the following link, and take 
> some 
> > sort of action.
> >   > >
> >   > > http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/4639.html
> >   > >
> >   > > Even if you're broke, you can write a letter 
> or make 
> > a phone call.
> >   > >
> >   > > Amongst his other projects, Marc Emery is the 
> founder 
> > of Iboga
> >   > > Therapy House, and has devoted a tremendous 
> amount of 
> > his time,
> >   > > effort and cashflow, to helping drug-dependent 
> > individuals obtain
> >   > > free access to ibogaine.
> >   > >
> >   > > His extradition hearing has been scheduled to 
> begin 
> > on 
> >   > November 5th,
> >   > > 2007.
> >   > >
> >   > > If you support drug-reform, harm reduction, or 
> basic 
> > human liberty
> >   > > and freedom of choice, please take a few 
> minutes and 
> > do 
> >   > whatever you
> >   > > can.
> >   > >
> >   > > Thanks,
> >   > >
> >   > > Patrick
> >   > >
> >   > >
> >   > >
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