[Ibogaine] Daniel Pinchbeck's new book in NY Times

edward conn wardconn at hotmail.com
Thu Jun 29 19:36:54 EDT 2006


>From: "Nick Sandberg" <nick227 at tiscali.co.uk>
>Reply-To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
>To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
>Subject: RE: Re: [Ibogaine] Daniel Pinchbeck's new book in NY Times
>Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2006 19:38:04 +0100
>The whole idea of therapy is someone does'nt tell you what to do and 
>think....its called someone being a 'blank canvas' upon which we see our 
>projections and therefore can own them, integrate and understand fromthem 
>that we do it. From there we can take control of our lives without blame to 
>others and free ourselves from the onus of lack of power, learnt from our 
>mchildhood situation of being dependent on others for our life, and its 
>support.

One of the main misconceptions of therapy is just this, that is about 
someone else telling us how to live ourlives. Like psychedelics, or anything 
at that, like I did myself, I did'nt find this out until I had tried it and 
ran with it for some time.

The interpretation of what psychedelics are showing us is the difficulty and 
the not buying into the first interpretations we make, as these will be 
based on our foremost ideas and in fact then not any genuinely deep 
questioning quality about what that experience or 'showing' was about. A 
major misconception here is that somehow  psychedelics are pure and reveal 
the true mind. Well the true mind is only the mind that that persons 
presently posesses and if that is all that you know, per se, how can you 
step back from that and objectify what that experience 'really was' as 
opposed to what you think it was, based on your own previous experience. 
Which by all rights it has to be because thats all you have to fall back 
on...the contents of your own memory banks.

So more accurately, what psychedelics do is throw up what is already there, 
but hidden, which can include good, and thus we have revelation, because it 
has been supressed, because its had to have been to survive in a trying and 
challenging world. But the inteligence of the mind, inherent, is the growth 
space which is created by, stepping back, objectifying, questioning and 
querrying, about what that actually says about me. Rather than buying into 
it as some prophesy, derived from some embodied power that exists elsewhere 
or outside of me. And by all accounts then, disempowering me.

The quality and power of truth is that inthat space which exists between 
what I already am, and what I'm discovering I might be and am becomming 
exists the potential of conceptual and total change on a relativistic level. 
That is, we can't change everything, everytime, and all of the time, 
suddenly. Its incremental change. Change by increments. Little bits of new' 
ness which get added on to the oldness. This is called growth, and growth is 
an internal response to a new environment, or a volitional change to access 
a new environment which has been sensed. i.e 'seen.' By it being seen it has 
become a part of the central nervous system and has become a cascade of 
feelings and intercommunicative thought processes which have been designed 
to distribute that information. Once done it becomes the new land which can 
possibly be accessed or inhabited. Thats why people use MINDVOX, as it has 
been designed to be that island, amongst others. And ibogaine and the 
stories that surround it have become the cue or the carrot. A meme. The 
quality of which will be inherent within the experience, and also the option 
of getting out, and not being trapped within a meme. Which of course is only 
a concept after all, not a reality, but only a part thereof.

Ed.
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet at nyc.rr.com]
> > Sent: 27 June 2006 20:42
> > To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
> > Subject: Re: Re: [Ibogaine] Daniel Pinchbeck's new book in NY Times
> >
> >
> > >What is it about psychedelics and narcissism that go hand in hand...is 
>it
> > the living in ones own self created reality i.e fantasy...that
> > becomes 'mind
> > manifested' or 'turned inside out' ...after all is'nt that what breaking
> > open the head is?...letting the contents out...only to find eventually
> > through much knashing of teeth that they're delusion. Hey, this
> > is a journey
> > after all.<
> >
> > Don't know about the "delusions" bit, but as I've seen attributed
> > to George
> > Bernard Shaw:
> >
> > "The man who writes agbout himself and his own time is the only man who
> > write about all people ane all time."
> >
> > I've also seen it heard it said that one should write what one knows.
> >
> > >One of the reasons. limited coverage is given to the psychedelic
> > position
> > >is
> > that, it often is significant for the writers inability to seperate self
> > from experience and as a result it becomes a blur...like the
> > persons mind. I
> > think this is why indeed the accompanying recomendation with such
> > work is to
> > continue with a therapist...a person who one pays to contain and keep 
>this
> > material on the straight and narrow. The problem with delusion and the
> > significant [problem it is for a person is that only on the outside is 
>it
> > recognised...thats why its deluded.<
> >
> > Speaking personally (ironically enough conisdering this post's subject
> > matter), for me to try to seperate myself from the experience seems a 
>bit
> > strange. In your case (I'm guessing), you experienced some sort of blur
> > after taking whatever psychedelic and now you benefit from therapy. I
> > realized I didn't want to pay someone else to listen to me tell
> > myself what
> > I needed to be doing and how to do it. Again, I'm really only
> > speaking for
> > myself.
> > Just some thoughts.
> > Peace, love and respect,
> > Preston Peet
> >
>
>Hi Preston and others,
>
>I think what you say is true, but also, for me, Ed is more talking about 
>the
>tendency of some who have used psychoactives to get so totally identified
>with their own experience that they can talk or write about pretty much
>nothing else. It's like this whole experience they have had seems to take
>them over and they become completely lost in it. I recall doing just this
>myself for a while! It's OK, for a bit, but I think it's good to try and
>nudge people along. I mean, if I hang out with a lot people into
>psychoactives, I find it can get to be like either endless navel-gazing or 
>a
>"Who's had the most major drug experience" competition. Maybe that's just
>me, but that's the energy I often feel around that scene. If you take a 
>drug
>to teach you something about yourself, to get a change in your life, I 
>think
>you should actually have the decency to change.
>
>Nick
>
>
>   
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