[Ibogaine] There and back again

Kirk captkirk at clear.net.nz
Wed Dec 28 15:46:08 EST 2005


LOL
Madness Is The Answer ;o)

-----Original Message-----
From: slowone at hush.ai [mailto:slowone at hush.ai] 
Sent: Wednesday, 28 December 2005 3:07 p.m.
To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There and back again


"Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is 
often mistaken for madness"

My version: "Madness is not enlightenment, but neither is 
enlightenment, for that matter. Wait a minute - what was the 
question?"


On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 10:10:41 -0800 Preston Peet <ptpeet at nyc.rr.com> 
wrote:
>>So that's probably the first thing I want to talk to the shrink 
>about, how 
>>does a grown man go about learning to feel his emotions so this 
>never has 
>>to happen again?  I noticed how when I get a feeling, I 
>automatically label 
>>it good or bad and if it's bad, I stuff it.<
>
>First of all Matthew, thanks for posting this note describing your 

>latest 
>experience- very poignent and clear, succinct and eloquent, and by 

>me much 
>appreciated.
>    I can so relate to the above sentence. I just had to post a 
>pithy note 
>saying that- that I've so many times put myself right back where 
>I've 
>already been, that I need to ask, or figure out with someone else 
>listening 
>impartially, how I go about learning to feel my emotions and other 

>feelings 
>both mental and physical without automatically going back to tried 

>to true 
>methods that seem to lead down the same freaking cull-de-sack 
>every time, 
>even if the route looks different at various times it's always the 

>same 
>dead-freakin' end apparently.
>    BTW, that's in large part why I've not changed my sig-line 
>quote for so 
>long, about the search for enlightenment etc. Because I feel like 
>that 
>exactly, all the time.
>    Grrrr.
>
>Peace and love,
>Preston
>
>"Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is 

>often 
>mistaken for madness"
>Richard Davenport-Hines
>
>ptpeet at nyc.rr.com
>Editor "Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient 
>Civilizations, 
>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History"
>Editor "Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs"
>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>Columnist New York Waste
>Etc.
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Matthew Shriver
>To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
>Sent: Monday, December 26, 2005 11:14 PM
>Subject: [Ibogaine] There and back again
>
>
>So it was really pretty different than all of the other times I 
>have done 
>it.  I think there were a number of factors contributing to it, my 

>
>metabolism is faster I'm sure, my all around health is better, and 

>my diet 
>is way better.  So somehow the effect duration was substantially 
>shortened. 
>I took 16mg/kg in an enema last night, about 25 hours ago now.  
>When that 
>kicked in I felt really panicky and I called my girlfriend who had 

>made 
>arrangements to stay out of the house for a few days, and I asked 
>her to 
>come home and sit with me.  So she did, and I felt WAY safer.  But 

>the 
>intensity was just more than I could handle, which makes me wonder 

>if the 
>opiates I was on before had actually deadened some of the ibo so 
>that this 
>time I was feeling it so much more viscerally than before.  So I 
>was at this 
>point of feeling like the intensity had stopped climbing but I 
>felt as if 
>any more increase would just make me shriek, I mean I was 
>terrified, all of 
>creation was literally coming undone right in front of me.  But I 
>realized 
>at that point that I was not at the point I was seeking from this 
>experience.  So I pondered the capsules, and in the end, I 
>couldn't do it. 
>I agonized over it for a couple of hours, then decided I just 
>couldn't take 
>any more.  I fell asleep around 2 AM, I slept till 7 or so, I 
>don't recall 
>any dreams but my girlfriend did say that she saw me in REM.
>
>So when I woke up I was still feeling some background sensory 
>stuff (similar 
>to what I have going on now) but seemingly no effect on my 
>thoughts.  So I 
>decided to take the last of it, another 9 mg/kg this morning, 
>about 12 hours 
>ago now.
>
>Again it was pretty intense, a little frightening, but in the end, 

>very 
>instructive.  Even though I didn't get what I was after, and I 
>actually felt 
>sad about that last night and sad about letting fear keep me from 
>doing what 
>I thought I wanted, I still feel as though I benefited from it.  I 

>feel like 
>I have some great insight into the source of my depression.  I 
>think 
>ultimately, that my head was packed to the gills with unfelt 
>emotions and it 
>was poisoning every aspect of my thoughts.
>
>Ibogaine came up with an analogy for me.  Imagine that your mind 
>is like a 
>train station, a big room with a very high ceiling.  Now you know 
>that crud 
>that collects on the refrigerator compressor fan, that weird black 

>dust and 
>lint and whatever the hell crap?  Well imagine that stuff all 
>smeared on all 
>of the walls and ceilings.  But so much of it that it is really 
>thick, like 
>meters and meters of this stuff, so much that you can't walk 
>around in there 
>without hunching over and some areas you can't get to without 
>crawling. 
>That's what I think my head was starting to look like from all of 
>the unfelt 
>emotions.  And the ibogaine came in and just shredded it.  My head 

>feels 
>absolutely freaking spacious now!  I mean that literally, my head 
>feels so 
>clean and clear.
>
>So that's probably the first thing I want to talk to the shrink 
>about, how 
>does a grown man go about learning to feel his emotions so this 
>never has to 
>happen again?  I noticed how when I get a feeling, I automatically 

>label it 
>good or bad and if it's bad, I stuff it.  I saw the whole thing in 

>action 
>repeatedly.  I would start to cry, and soon as my eyes began to 
>overflow, I 
>would make a loud sniff followed by a slow exhale and it would be 
>gone. 
>Just gone, stuffed off where no-one will ever find it, right.  I 
>also 
>noticed that the more I did that, the more my stomach would hurt.  

>I noticed 
>a very similar thing with the fear.  I had a lot of fear early on 
>and it was 
>making my body ache and writhe but somehow I was also aware that I 

>was not 
>completely feeling it, I was avoiding it.  My girlfriend suggested 

>to me 
>that there is no such thing as a bad feeling and I was completely 
>awestruck 
>by my own capacity for ignorance in not having ever in my whole 
>life thought 
>of that idea.  I know I'm not dumb but holy crap can I act like 
>it.
>
>I saw repeatedly how my mind redirects certain things; basically I 

>saw what 
>happens to a thought or an event or whatever, after my mind 
>decides what it 
>means.  Because before it means anything to me, it is just 
>something that 
>happens.  But as soon as it means something to me, it becomes, 
>wonderful or 
>terrible, or a million other finely graded ready-made labels.  And 

>when that 
>happens, I just react to it. This is all done automatically by the 

>mind that 
>I setup as a child.  And I saw that too,  I saw how I had setup 
>all these 
>automatic interpreters for events that were of just no use to an 
>adult.  I'm 
>walking around with all of this programming that I did when I was 
>like 1.
>
>So I also decided that I never want to do ibogaine again.  That's 
>just not 
>what I want on my journey through this life anymore.  And I 
>decided to 
>change my clean date.  And I decided to unsubscribe from this list 

>as well. 
>I have no problem declaring as loudly as I wish that I absolutely 
>believe in 
>ibogaine as a treatment for drug addiction.  But I don't' want to 
>involve 
>myself in anything more to do with it.  I have the utmost respect 
>for that 
>drug.  It's probably the only drug that I have ever taken that I 
>didn't 
>completely misuse and abuse.  But one thing I had lost 
>appreciation for 
>until it was on me, ibogaine is a fucking powerful drug.  I sort 
>of imagine 
>it like I'm on an archeological dig, and I need to uncover some 
>stuff, but 
>ibogaine is like a freaking nuke and I just can't make proper use 
>of it. 
>But when I was on methadone it was like there was a freaking 
>skyscraper 
>built on top of my archeological dig and a nuke was the right tool 

>for that 
>situation.
>
>Incidentally, since I dosed last night and then again this morning 

>I noticed 
>something, it seemed as if the presence of what I guess was 
>noribogaine, 
>potentiated the effect of the ibogaine.  It seemed like the first 
>2 hours of 
>this mornings dose was almost as powerful as last nights dose, but 

>then it 
>abated fairly quickly so I thought that there might be something 
>interesting 
>going on between the two.
>
>Anyway, I want to say good bye to everyone.  I'll hang out for a 
>week or so 
>and follow up with any discussion about this post, but them I'm 
>off.  I also 
>want to say I'm sorry to anyone who I may have ever offended here. 

> I don't 
>mean to be mean or thoughtless, I actually do honestly care about 
>other 
>people, I just don't' always know how to show it.  I am very 
>struck by how 
>much I seemed to have not learned as a child.  I feel like these 
>painfully 
>childish lessons have gone poorly answered or unanswered for my 
>whole life. 
>Feel free to email me off list even after I have left if you wish.
>
>I didn't get what I was after but I'm not unsatisfied with what I 
>did get. 
>I think I may have gotten a piece of the puzzle I need to solve in 

>order to 
>be OK in this world without taking any drugs, and that's what I am 

>looking 
>for.  I decided actually quite a lot of stuff.  I decided to get a 

>ring and 
>ask my girlfriend to marry me.  I decided that I don't show my 
>friends often 
>enough or strongly enough, how much I love and appreciate them.  
>There's 
>going to be some changes made.
>Peace and love to you all, wherever your own journeys may lead.
>Matt 
>
>
>
>  /]=--------------------------------------------------------------

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