deartheo at ziplip.com
deartheo at ziplip.com
Sat Feb 14 18:41:09 EST 2004
Well, thanks for the input, but i should have clarified I was really referring to long lasting opioids like methadone and orlaam. I have been exercising consistently even during the main crunch the first 2-3 months; and when the main sickness slowly subsided in waves, like a stock market graph, the exhaustion has set in and the 2ndary withdrawal seems more consistent but just their enough to remind me this is still not completely over, which is frustrating when their is SO MUCH TO GET DONE, because it's already suppossed to be over and done with so I can focus on piecing the areas of my life back to where they need to be, which i'm finding is a very tall order when the imaginary or 2ndary sickness stays so very consistent. I am exhausted from this whole journey through the depths of a 263ml kick. But one thing is certain, the iboga took away a large portion of the unimaginable sickness that would have been there without the help of iboga. At what point do I say, ok this is as good as it is going to get and i need to just get through the shit and keep the shit to myself, hell, i'm tired of hearing myself complain about it so I seldome bring it up to anyone.
I do want to say that the resentment between peoples saddens me, it seems it only aids the regulatory authorities in dividing and concouring us and our sinceer belief in the gift of iboga(ine). I'm afraid that it is resentment neither parties involved trust one another enough to promote a healthy dialoge that could encourage unity for what we all want: TO GET THIS SOLUTION TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED IT. But it seems patents, self-interest, and personal attacks seem to be the order of the day, perhaps the spirit of iboga could teach us a few things, last one to the patient office for iboga for non-drug related theray is a rotten egg. I wish so much we could work together, but it doesn't look like that will happen anytime soon, which is really too bad.
Also, what would be the ideal training to become an iboga provider, besides the obvious intern, which I think is a good idea to intern at more then one> Any suggestion?
I hope everyone is doing well and staying strong. I agree that the slower a methadone patient goes down the easier it will be. I crazy ass causious when it comes to that, I would go down more then 1 ml every 3 weeks, to stabalize a bit between going down again, so the sickness doesn't add up and feedback and multiply; I found it was very easy for me to go down too quickly and end up bitting off more then I could chew. As far as money goes, I was able to get to YVR with my tax return, I had been unemployeed for quite some time and had to hustle a bit, but if you aren't hurting anyone(i don't think Marc was saying go do some violent crime to get the money to recover; but considering the legal risks of even buying heroin (felony), selling a little herb to get $500 is I wouldn't say is that risky considering most of our pasts. I cannot speak for Marc, but I assume that he means that if a addict/junky wants to kick the habit bad enough, they will think outside of the box. I can't get into the fact that Marc hasn't tried iboga on himself, but I think that has it's advantages and disadvatages, but his staff has taken iboga so they are familier with the experience personally. I do think the fact Tim Leary took what he promoted, prevented 'mainstream' America from listening and understanding, so it gives a certain objectivity that non-drug users need to be sure of what ever they have to be sure of to actually listen to the facts. Becasue once the non-drug using public understands the facts of this, it all goes downhill from their. Why do we not talk to normal to get a pre-written letter on their site for their members to choose and send to their representative. I've gotten my TX(R)Joe Biden to talk directly to the NIH regarding iboga by sending a simply e-mail. We can work more with our alies to get the tv only watching public to understand that addicts/junkies and thier families are suffering from that which can be prevented.
I appoligize if I'm out of line by all this, I look forward to any input anyone may have, because I sure as hell don't have it figured out: )
> -----Original Message-----
> From: D H [mailto:dave at phantom.com]
> Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004, 11:51 AM
> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
> Subject: Re: [ibogaine] 2ndaryWithdrawalORaLLiNhEAD
> well for me its like this: if i can distract myself with (exercise, bath,
> shower, sex, tv, whatever) and the symptoms go AWAY (for more than 15
> seconds - 5minutes), then its prolly all in my head.
> If I try the above and I become violently ill, sweating and shivering and
> uncontrollably start fantasizing large volumes of heroin flowing thru my
> viens, then I am most likely experiencing withdrawal.
> On 2/14/2004, "deartheo at ziplip.com" <deartheo at ziplip.com> wrote:
> >Can anyone with experience explain how you can tell the difference between
> what's called 'secondary withdrawal' and simply a mental projection of a
> physical sickness (all in your head) in regards to opioids?
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: D H [mailto:dave at phantom.com]
> >> Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004, 9:35 AM
> >> To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
> >> Subject: [ibogaine] test
> >> this is a test
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