[ibogaine] About NA after ibogaine. Long message PLEASE read!

Roberta Lapiak robertalapiak at hotmail.com
Tue Aug 24 23:27:02 EDT 2004


Thank you very much for your answer Sean, that was well put! by the way it's 
Roberta or Bobbie, not robert!

What I found so amazing is that it's full of doing everything your own way, 
which is what the 12 steps teach isn't possible. What I'm reading here is 
that it is possible after ibogaine. It's like this whole wave happening here 
and its so infectious! I want to to try it soon. Its like everyone is 
thinking about how to keep the wave going I almost believe it is possible.

Is the person who wrote that still clean? There's no email listed, that 
magazine called Heroin Times when I search for it died last year, putting 
Patrick Kroupa into a search engine lists these

http://www.nndb.com/people/552/000025477
http://deadpool.rotten.com/occupations/unspecified.html
http://www.namebase.org/xkri/Patrick-Kroupa.html
http://www.kiblix.org/eng/lecturers/patrick.htm

A famous people database, some ugly thing where they place bets on when 
someone will die, a book on hacking, everything else is computer hacking, 
security, heroin, ibogaine, a lecture on encryption, a ibogaine tv show from 
2004. No email I can find except everything leads back to this place. 
Mindvox started in 1991? I didn't know the internet was here in 1991.

I tried digital at phantom.com and get nothing. This person posted here in the 
last week, how do I ask a question? If thats the right email no one responds 
to it.

My question for him or anyone really who has done ibogaine and stayed clean, 
do you have to keep doing it or do you do it once and that's enough to stay 
with it? I think I'm asking questions that might not have a answer and 
everyone is different. I am reading the links from Mindvox and looking 
through the sites.

>  If nothing changes, nothing changes, dig?:)

I do :)

>From: UUSEAN at aol.com
>Reply-To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
>To: ibogaine at mindvox.com
>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] About NA after ibogaine. Long message PLEASE read!
>Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 20:52:29 EDT
>
>
>  Hi Robert,
>
>  I am an NA dropout.  I tried it on and off for twenty years before 
>deciding that NA was simply not for me.  What I got from the material you 
>are discussing is that you have to believe in whatever it is you are doing 
>to stay clean will keep you clean.  An AA actually told me this.  In his 
>not so humble opinion AA can never work if the AAer does not have faith in 
>the program.
>
>  I do not have faith in the program.  The 12 steps feel to me like 
>visiting someone else's church.  Nice for you, but ain't my thing.  Except 
>I was there to save my life, so I stuck around.  Stayed clean for two 
>years, relapsed ten years ago...used until last week when I tried ibo.
>
>  The point?  I have to believe that something will work to keep me clean.  
>I see ibo as part of a healing and maturing process for me. I am a 39 year 
>old man with HIV and HepC.  If I keep smoking crack, shooting heroin and 
>drinking, I won't live to see much of my forties.
>
>  So I am ready to change. I believe that ibogaine is an essential part of 
>that process. I am also in a very introspective form of therapy called 
>Internal Family systems. On Friday I am going to a post ibo support group.  
>I believe in these things as helpful and or essential in my process of 
>change, of staying clean.
>
>  But most of all I am believing for the first time in myself.  And I think 
>this is really they key.  I don't have to believe in 12 steps (again great 
>for those they work for), I don't even believe ibogaine is the "cure" for 
>my addiction.  I believe in me and my healing.  I believe also in the 
>people on this list who are making incredible changes in their life which I 
>have witnessed in the brief time I have been here.
>
>  Without a desire to change, though, and a belief in myself and the 
>healing tools around me, I a'int never goin change. 
>
>  If nothing changes, nothing changes, dig?:)
>
>  Sean

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