[ibogaine] The Perfect Detox
ptpeet at nyc.rr.com
Sat Apr 6 23:02:42 EST 2002
>I have some
methadone rant laying around someplace which you haven't seen yet, but my
personal advice to anybody contemplating MMTP is: stick with shooting
dope. You'll be happier.<
Well, other than for those nasty officers who love cramping a good buzz. And
oh if they stumble upon one mid-fix, boy that is a coup to beat all coups,
with all sorts of extra backup called to get in on the bust.;-))
with Meth at least that is one GREAT BIG no-problemo.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick K. Kroupa" <digital at mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine at mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 7:35 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] The Perfect Detox
> On [Sat, Apr 06, 2002 at 02:26:53PM -0800], [ibogaine at heroinhelper.com]
> Look, that's it. You're one of perhaps 5 people I correspond with who can
> emit 22 interesting paragraphs for every 18 insane ones I throw into your
> mail. Rock out dood!
> Alas, I am outta here! Yeah yeah yeah, it is NICE outside in Miami, and I
> am going to go enjoy my Saturday night. So my response will be just a
> lil' shorter than what I might otherwise express.
> Just like, warning you ahead of time.
> : Absolutely no argument regarding the War on Drugs, I think you're
> more than familiar with my opinions, and they're highly simpatico with
> whatcha just expressed.
> [xX]: With regards to "being as addicted as you think you are," I think
> this related to the after ibogaine part, and what people do with
> themselves once they are clean. Which is to say, how long they manage to
> stay clean, presuming this was one of their desired goals.
> [--]: As far as detox itself goes... Hey, done 'em all. Lessee, UROD
> twice (yes I was THAT stupid), methadone taper, buprinex taper,
> hydromorphone taper, that TENS/NET unit black-box electronic acupuncture
> shit, acupuncture with and without Xanax and clonodine, the super-fun home
> version of UROD: naltrexone with a handful of Xanax and clonodine, the
> getting drunk a lot detox, the smoking pot a lot detox, all sorts of
> way-fun planned and completely unscheduled cold turkey detoxes...
> And basically, sure... A variety of these methodologies got me "clean."
> I never stayed clean longer than a few days. On one hand this probably
> had a lot to do with my headspace at the time, since a variety of people
> on this very list -- whom I know about anyway, since 90% or more of the
> persons reading these words have subscribed and then never said anything
> -- used the treatment modalities I listed off in the previous paragraph;
> with eventual success.
> And yeah, I know many people who have great, epic struggles which
> originate completely within their mind -- but well, that's pretty much a
> summary of life itself. So somebody who had great success after banging
> up a bag a day for a year, doesn't really rock my world either. It's
> kinda like, "that's nice man. You coulda JUST STOPPED and had all the
> symptoms of a bad case of the flu..."
> THIS PART is what rocked my world, and still does... The one thing every
> modality I have listed off had in common was: after I was clean, I was
> still sick as fuck, and totally fiending. The ONLY THING I wanted was to
> shoot dope. I mean, okay, sex is a Pretty Big Thing, and a fundamental
> motivational force in the behaviour of organisms, and human beings too.
> The whole entire, food, shelter, getting laid, and doing drUgz thing
> hardwired into everybody. At least everybody I've ever met, unless
> they're extremely repressed and doin' a lotta sublimating.
> That's fine, KEEP THE SEX. I will never have sex again, who really gives
> a shit, just let me keep shooting dope in peace and leave me alone. All
> is well with my universe. In fact you can keep most of the food part --
> as long as I have all the basics, a bag of potato chips a week and 2 packs
> of cigarettes a day -- and shelter, well I can nod out wherever mahn...
> To summarize: I have a lifetime of drug use, and had roughly a decade of
> hardcore drug dependence when I did ibogaine (by drug dependence I mean
> opiates/opioids, since I did everything else as well, but cocaine and
> stimulants in general, for me anyway, have always been the great big,
> "whatever" I can take it or leave it, and do not sit around and fantasize
> about the shit).
> All the neuroadaptions that occur in response to chronic long-term drug
> use/dependence, have occured for me. I am highly sprung, I mentally
> classify myself as a junkie/dopefiend, and really, this is it, I'm gonna
> try this shit, because, there simply isn't anything else left to try.
> Subjectively, what it feels like, is... fucking amazing. It's not a
> "detox" it is more like hitting a RESET and rebooting your brain. Within
> 35-45 minutes, there is this sensation of heat moving up your spine, and
> like this ball of warmth that centers in your solar plexus -- in some way
> slightly similar to what the after-UROD part felt like to me (except that
> felt like someone had heated a fucking spear or serrated knife and kept
> twisting it, whereas the ibogaine was nothing whatsoever like that...
> Just warmth, no pain).
> Then you trip out do0d! Erm, I meant to say, experience an oneiric state
> replete with waking visions!
> What, to me, was just fucking staggering... Is that I was on 200mg
> methadone + 2 grams of heroin + 12mg Xanax... And this is the tail end of
> many years of heavy habits.
> <WhaM> it's gone. Praise the God of Molecular Pharmacology, the Bwiti,
> Philip K. Dick, whomever mahn, this is truly fucking amazing.
> And it sure was. I lasted nearly an hour at the nearest airport, before
> taking a detour and doing some of San Juan's truly excellent heroin. Man
> that was nice... Spiritual even.
> ...Which I sorta think was the main gist of the questions about what
> someone should do after dosing/kicking with ibogaine. Okay you ARE clean,
> you are not in withdrawal, you are not in pain, but you are STILL you, and
> all the reasons you picked up a habit in the first place, still exist.
> And now comes the part where you hafta deal with all of this in some
> manner -- presuming that staying clean is one of your goals.
> Regarding methadone, mahn, I think it's total garbage, I have some
> methadone rant laying around someplace which you haven't seen yet, but my
> personal advice to anybody contemplating MMTP is: stick with shooting
> dope. You'll be happier.
> And yeah, I am cogent that in a perfect world I am absolutely correct
> making the above assertion. In the world we live in, methadone has one
> distinct advantage over dope: it's legal, and if you are motivated
> presents you with the opportunity to get a handle on things and attempt to
> get your life back together.
> I gotta bounce, and I'm just recounting my own personal experience, which
> does not empirically prove anything. But... to anybody who is
> strung-out on opiates and/or opioids -- regardless of the size of their
> habit -- my personal advice would be highly consistent and very simple: do
> Absolutely no question about that, no wavering, no if/then loop. If your
> drug use has reached the level where you are even considering the need for
> a "detox" -- whatever your reason(s) -- do yourself a favor and skip
> options 1-50, and go directly to ibogaine.
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